# So was Chomsky correct after all about complex language acquisition being unique to humans? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 9, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427 "2011-07-09T17:47:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/1 "2011-07-09T17:47:30Z")
There is documentary out this week re one experiment in language acquisition by primates. [“Project Nim” - A shattering documentary about a chimpanzee raised as a human.](http://www.slate.com/id/2298705/) [In this experiment](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nim_Chimpsky)the researchers eventually came to the conclusion that no meaningful true language acquisition has been demonstrated. They were seeking to demonstrate the opposite conclusion, and to prove that Chomsky’s contention that language acquisition is a uniquely human trait was false. This wiki on an earlier experiment with a [chimp named Washoe](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washoe_(chimpanzee))seem to maintain that language use was demonstrated. Oddly, the Washoe wiki makes no note of any dispute about these results. Both these experiments are over 30 years old at this point, and it seems some contemporary researchers think the Washoe experimental results were a variant on the [Clever Hans](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clever_Hans)effect. > [@](#): > > Critics of primate linguistic studies include Thomas Sebeok, American semiotician and investigator of nonhuman communication systems, who wrote: > > In my opinion, the alleged language experiments with apes divide into three groups: one, outright fraud; two, self-deception; three, those conducted by Terrace. The largest class by far is the middle one.[7] > > Sebeok also made pointed comparisons of Washoe with Clever Hans. Some evolutionary psychologists, in effect agreeing with Chomsky, argue that the apparent impossibility of teaching language to animals is indicative that the ability to use language is an innately human development.[8] What have we learned in the interim. Can apes acquire complex language or not? ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/2 "2011-07-09T18:31:14Z")
My understanding is that nonhuman apes can learn a lot of words, but they don’t seem to have any sophisticated grammatical abilities. However, there’s been some [recent suggestions](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=608117) that dolphins have some notions of grammar. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/3 "2011-07-09T18:55:29Z")
Another similar experiment was [Koko.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Koko_(gorilla)) The Wikipedia entry seems a little more skeptical: > [@](#): > > Francine Patterson (her longterm trainer) believes that Koko’s use of signs and her actions, which are consistent with her use of signs, indicate she has mastered the use of sign language. Other researchers argue that she does not understand the meaning behind what she is doing and learns to complete the signs simply because the researchers reward her for doing so (indicating that her actions are the product of operant conditioning). However, the latter position is not consistent with the claims that Koko uses the language freely and in novel ways, even when there is no foreseeable gratification. Another concern that has been raised about Koko’s ability to express coherent thoughts through the use of signs is that interpretation of the gorilla’s conversation is left to **the handler, who may see improbable concatenations of signs as meaningful.** (bolding mine) ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/4 "2011-07-09T19:04:09Z")
OTOH (regarding the lack of skepticism in the Wiki entries), this one on another chimp, [Loulis,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loulis_(chimpanzee)) is completely non-skeptical: > [@](#): > > Loulis (born May 10, 1978) is a chimpanzee who has learned to communicate in American Sign Language. > \ > Washoe and 3 other chimpanzees (Tatu, Dar, and Moja) were raised as deaf human children and acquired American Sign Language. The chimpanzees regularly use the hand signals to communicate with each other and humans. Loulis is the only chimpanzee in the family who was not cross-fostered (he wasn’t raised by humans but rather Washoe and the other chimpanzees). After eight days with Washoe, Loulis learned his first sign. For the first five years of his life, Loulis’s human handlers only used seven signs around him (the signs used were who, which, want, where, name, that, and sign). Loulis was able to acquire the use of ASL from Washoe. The details of this research can be found in “Teaching Sign Language to Chimpanzees” edited by Allen and Beatrix Gardner. Personally, I think this is wishful thinking, but I have no ape to experiment on at present. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/5 "2011-07-09T19:55:45Z")
Show me a chimp who use an embedded clause and I might begin to believe he was wrong. Buy for cetaceans, who knows? We have never lrarned dolphin. ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/6 "2011-07-09T20:06:39Z")
It’s sad that after all these years, no human has been able to speak “chimp” despite the many attempts that we have made to teach them. I have come to the conclusion that language is restricted to our species. ---
**Author:** ![Maastricht](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@Maastricht](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maastricht)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/7 "2011-07-09T20:50:44Z")
[Obligatory](http://www.cracked.com/article_18930_6-amazingly-intelligent-animals-that-will-creep-you-out_p2.html) [cracked](http://www.cracked.com/article_18766_5-creepy-ways-animal-societies-are-organizing.html) [articles](http://www.cracked.com/article_17453_5-diabolical-animals-that-out-witted-humans.html). And here’s an [National Geographic article.](http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2008/03/animal-minds/virginia-morell-text) relevant to the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Blake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@Blake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blake)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/8 "2011-07-09T21:00:32Z")
> [@sh1bu1](#): > > It’s sad that after all these years, no human has been able to speak “chimp” despite the many attempts that we have made to teach them. First off, in what sense is that true? What communications can chimps use that many humans can not also use at least as well? Secondly, you are begging the question. You are starting from the premise that chimps “speak” and use “language” when no evidence of such exists. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/9 "2011-07-09T22:33:44Z")
> [@astro](#): > > Can apes acquire complex language or not? Non-human species, you mean? I’d like to think so. I don’t see how anybody can possibly read [Next of Kin](http://www.amazon.com/Next-Kin-My-Conversations-Chimpanzees/dp/0380728222) and come away unconvinced that chimps have at least _some_ rudimentary ability to understand and spontaneously use iconic representations of environmental objects and even nonphysical concepts. There just doesn’t seem to be any other possible explanation for the interactions that Fouts documented. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/10 "2011-07-09T22:59:55Z")
These studies don’t really ask or answer whether animals can learn complex language. They ask (and partially answer) whether animals can learn ‘Human as a Second Language’. They are being asked to communicate through signs and indicators that we are able to understand. That doesn’t necessarily have a lot of bearing on how well they are able to communicate with each other or how complex their communications are. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/11 "2011-07-09T23:22:05Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > Non-human species, you mean? I’d like to think so. I don’t see how anybody can possibly read [Next of Kin](http://www.amazon.com/Next-Kin-My-Conversations-Chimpanzees/dp/0380728222) and come away unconvinced that chimps have at least _some_ rudimentary ability to understand and spontaneously use iconic representations of environmental objects and even nonphysical concepts. There just doesn’t seem to be any other possible explanation for the interactions that Fouts documented. The problem seems to be that a number of researchers have serious problems with how accurate researchers interpretations of their observations were, and that there was a lot of very “rich” interpretation going on WRT interpreting Washoe’s gestures and assigning meanings to them. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2011, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/12 "2011-07-09T23:52:41Z")
> [@Washoe](#): > > … The very fact that **Washoe** is posting here at all is surely evidence enough. 🆒 ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/13 "2011-07-10T00:37:08Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The very fact that **Washoe** is posting here at all is surely evidence enough. 🆒 True, but still [wouldn’t trust her with a gun](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmtX6Tj74oU). ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/14 "2011-07-10T01:17:05Z")
Ahhhhh! Bad college flash-back! I did several papers on “Language Acquisition By Non-Human Primates” for my Anthro degree. The conclusion to all of them was “apes no spika da English.” Or any other language, verbal or gestural. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/15 "2011-07-10T04:04:08Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The very fact that **Washoe** is posting here at all is surely evidence enough. 🆒 Yeah, and from beyond the [freakin’ grave](http://www.friendsofwashoe.org/washoe/), no less. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/16 "2011-07-10T14:43:34Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > The very fact that **Washoe** is posting here at all is surely evidence enough. 🆒 On the internet, nobody knows you’re a dog. Or a chimp. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/17 "2011-07-10T15:48:45Z")
Some social animals seem to have learned co-operative patterns of behaviour for hunting. Are we restricting ourselves to vocal language rather than posture and behavioural? Personally I think that human type language depends upon the ability to transmit concepts, especially abstract ones or to model reality using other concepts - eg ‘Imagine this pile of rocks is a food source - its over in that direction over there’ ---
**Author:** ![fumster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9c0ed/32.png) [@fumster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fumster)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2011, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/18 "2011-07-10T16:25:19Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > First off, in what sense is that true? What communications can chimps use that many humans can not also use at least as well? > > Secondly, you are begging the question. You are starting from the premise that chimps “speak” and use “language” when no evidence of such exists. That’s what chimps think too: “I am expressing my place in the pecking order relative to this person, but he seems unable to understand even the most rudimentary concept. He also does not respond to my request for mutual grooming. Even a 6 week old chimp can understand that”. ---
**Author:** ![Blake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a9a28c/32.png) [@Blake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blake)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2011, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/19 "2011-07-13T23:05:47Z")
So you can’t provide any evidence then? That’s what I figured. ---
**Author:** ![Crazyhorse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crazyhorse/32/31_2.png) [@Crazyhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crazyhorse)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427/20 "2011-07-14T00:44:22Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > So you can’t provide any evidence then? > > That’s what I figured. Are you asking them for evidence to answer your previous statement? > [@Blake](#): > > You are starting from the premise that chimps “speak” and use “language” when no evidence of such exists." I’ll get the ball rolling with [these](http://scholar.google.com/scholar?start=0&q=study+ape+communication+language&hl=en&as_sdt=0,5&as_vis=1)but I may be misunderstanding your definition of “speak” or “use language”. There are numerous studies that demonstrate apes and chimpanzees are able to acquire ‘language’ in human terms, to some extent or another. What level of communication ability do you consider to be ‘speaking’ or ‘using language’ for the purpose of this question? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-was-chomsky-correct-after-all-about-complex-language-acquisition-being-unique-to-humans/588427.md?page=2)