# So what if the president gets tipsy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 8, 2008, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865 "2008-02-08T22:57:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cyberhwk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7993a0/32.png) [@Cyberhwk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyberhwk)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2008, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/1 "2008-02-08T22:57:20Z")
This may sound dumb, but I’ve wondered it. I realize the 25th Amendment applies when the President becomes incapacitated, but would happen in a lesser case? The President surely has some down time too (relatively LITTLE, but I’m sure there’s SOME). After a hard day’s work, say he invites the Senate leadership to the White House for some scotch. He’s not wasted by any means, but he’s having a good time. Then BAM! A US Embassy abroad is bombed. I mean, he IS still President and the authority lies with him and him alone, yet surely the Joint Chief’s aren’t going to be happy seeing a liquored up Commander-in-Chief strolling on into the sit room? What might happen? If it comes out 15 years later he called in an air strike after a couple glasses of Macallan that surely wouldn’t sit well with the American public. Move to IMHO if need be. ---
**Author:** ![A.R.Cane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee7513/32.png) [@A.R.Cane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A.R.Cane)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2008, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/2 "2008-02-08T23:10:00Z")
Nixon was apparently drunk on many occasions, Kissinger and Haig took advantage of the situation more than once, probably the most notable during the '73 Arab-Israeli war: [http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/08/politics/main634636.shtml](http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/08/08/politics/main634636.shtml) ---
**Author:** ![solkoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@solkoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/solkoe)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/3 "2008-02-09T03:02:42Z")
[QUOTE=Cyberhwk] This may sound dumb, but I’ve wondered it. I realize the 25th Amendment applies when the President becomes incapacitated, but would happen in a lesser case? The President surely has some down time too (relatively LITTLE, but I’m sure there’s SOME). After a hard day’s work, say he invites the Senate leadership to the White House for some scotch. He’s not wasted by any means, but he’s having a good time. Then BAM! A US Embassy abroad is bombed. I mean, he IS still President and the authority lies with him and him alone, yet surely the Joint Chief’s aren’t going to be happy seeing a liquored up Commander-in-Chief strolling on into the sit room? What might happen? If it comes out 15 years later he called in an air strike after a couple glasses of Macallan that surely wouldn’t sit well with the American public. Move to IMHO if need be. [/QUOTE] OK, what if he’s not tipsy. What if he’s fuckin’ wasted? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/4 "2008-02-09T04:04:53Z")
[QUOTE=solkoe] OK, what if he’s not tipsy. What if he’s fuckin’ wasted? [/QUOTE] Realistically, his Chief of Staff would probably be calling the shots. I can’t imagine the 25th amendment being invoked over an episode of drunkness unless we desperately needed to launch nuclear weapons or something equally drastic. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/5 "2008-02-09T04:11:53Z")
[QUOTE=Blalron] launch nuclear weapons or something equally drastic. [/QUOTE] Yeah, nuclear arms and drunkeness just won’t mix. “Sir, we nuked Sweden like you asked!” “Eh? When did I ask that?” _plays recording_ “I wanshanukeswe gen” _recording ends_ “Uhh… I said I want to puke from gin” “Oh… oops” ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/6 "2008-02-09T05:04:16Z")
Realistically, people will work around the drunkenness because there’s no other choice. If the President is so wasted that the Vice-President has to invoke the 25th Amendment in the most serious emergency possible, the President might as well resign. There could be no recovery from that. Your scenario would make good fiction, but it won’t happen in real life. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/7 "2008-02-09T05:06:53Z")
[QUOTE=Exapno Mapcase] Realistically, people will work around the drunkenness because there’s no other choice. If the President is so wasted that the Vice-President has to invoke the 25th Amendment in the most serious emergency possible, the President might as well resign. There could be no recovery from that. Your scenario would make good fiction, but it won’t happen in real life. [/QUOTE] I wouldn’t say that’s nescessarily true. I mean it’d definately LOOK bad, but if something COMPLETELY unforseen happens there’s always the chance he’s drunken beyond the point of being considered able to legally make decisions (which doesn’t take much). Sure he’ll get the worst public approval rating ever but it is a feasable occurence. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 5:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/8 "2008-02-09T05:34:26Z")
It’s feasible the way the terrorists who know that an atom bomb is going to go off in ten minutes and can be tortured to give up the location is feasible on 24. Not outside the realm of possibility but so unlikely that we’ll never see it in our lifetimes or beyond. On television, everything happens at exactly the same moment with a deadline of now. In real life, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/9 "2008-02-09T08:58:26Z")
One might ask the same thing about invoking it if you’ve just woken the President from a sound sleep and he hasn’t had his coffee. Lord knows I’d probably say, “Nuke the fuckers. Here’s my code \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_” and then promptly go back to sleep, never remembering anything about it in the mornng, when they’d told me they’d successfully nuked Beijing in response to the US winning a record number of gold medals at the Olympics. I’m sure there’s protocols for these situations, and if the President’s passed out from a hard night of drinking ripple, they’d probably treat the situation like they were unable to reach the President by phone. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/10 "2008-02-09T16:51:34Z")
[QUOTE=Blalron] Realistically, his Chief of Staff would probably be **calling the shots**. [/QUOTE] Heh. Seriously, though, we did have one president who was an alcoholic-[Franklin Pierce](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franklin_Pierce). Fortunately, it doesn’t seem to have been an issue during his time in office. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/11 "2008-02-09T19:26:50Z")
I seem to recall an incident with JFK, when he was smoking reefer in the White House. He was offered (IIRC) a third doobie, but he refused, saying, “No thanks - what if the Russians try something?” Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Alex\_Dubinsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dbc845/32.png) [@Alex\_Dubinsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alex_Dubinsky)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/12 "2008-02-09T20:01:21Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] I seem to recall an incident with JFK, when he was smoking reefer in the White House. He was offered (IIRC) a third doobie, but he refused, saying, “No thanks - what if the Russians try something?” Regards, Shodan [/QUOTE] holy shit what? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/13 "2008-02-09T21:11:43Z")
[QUOTE=Blalron] Realistically, his Chief of Staff would probably be calling the shots. I can’t imagine the 25th amendment being invoked over an episode of drunkness unless we desperately needed to launch nuclear weapons or something equally drastic. [/QUOTE] Would there even be enough time for the VP to invoke the 25th if we were under a nuclear attack? Wouldn’t we get less than 30 minutes of warning? Is that enough time to convene the cabinet (or would a conference call do)? Or could the VP just assume command without following constitutional procedure and sort everything out latter? ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/14 "2008-02-09T21:13:31Z")
[QUOTE=alphaboi867] Would there even be enough time for the VP to invoke the 25th if we were under a nuclear attack? Wouldn’t we get less than 30 minutes of warning? Is that enough time to convene the cabinet (or would a conference call do)? Or could the VP just assume command without following constitutional procedure and sort everything out latter? [/QUOTE] I don’t know, but I’d HOPE they say “to hell with beuracracy” if the procedure is going to take more than the alotted time to death. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/15 "2008-02-09T21:35:07Z")
[QUOTE=Tuckerfan] I’m sure there’s protocols for these situations, … [/QUOTE] I’m thinking that there aren’t. I’m thinking that the people who actually issue orders would just sort of … stall, or something. I also think a bombed embassy might help to sober one up pretty fast. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/16 "2008-02-09T21:57:09Z")
Given the lack of a major power to first strike us into oblivion, the President has plenty of time to sober up before any decisions have to be made at that high a policy level. Embassy gets bombed? The plans are already in place for such an eventuality, so things happen without any need to even wake the President. By the time he is needed for decisions, he will be sober. Face it, most of the time some considered reflection is what is called for in these incidences, not an immediate call to counter-attack. If immediate action is needed, it will be the decision of the theater commander or person on the scene anyway. ---
**Author:** ![WoodenTaco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/45deac/32.png) [@WoodenTaco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WoodenTaco)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2008, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-if-the-president-gets-tipsy/436865/17 "2008-02-09T23:17:44Z")
This has [actually happened](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWP_rEWG2xk&feature=related) once. The results weren’t too good.