# So WHAT is the Deal With Peppermint Patty? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 31, 2005, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669 "2005-10-31T03:08:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/1 "2005-10-31T03:08:25Z")
We all know the gag about her and Marcie being “an item”, but what was Schulz thinking when he created the characters? And didn’t he ever think that maybe he should change the characters once folks began making jokes? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/2 "2005-10-31T03:09:42Z")
Maybe he wanted to show that girls could play sports just like boys. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/3 "2005-10-31T03:10:37Z")
They are just friends, and were always meant to be. A creator can’t be responsible for what dirty minded people think of his work. The characters were his, and he had no reason to change them just because someone interpreted them in one particular way. ---
**Author:** ![drmark2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a87d85/32.png) [@drmark2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drmark2000)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/4 "2005-10-31T03:18:40Z")
Peppermint Patty makes an awful lot of overtures toward Charlie Brown to be considered a lezzie. Marcie calls Patty “sir” because she’s both smart and clueless, a humorous combination. Patty generally objects to being called “sir.” If she were a dykester, she might be more inclined to encourage this. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/5 "2005-10-31T03:22:06Z")
I’m pretty sure Marcie also had a crush on Charlie Brown for a while. They’re meant to be nine year old kids. I think any hints of something outside of nine-year-old-kidisms is probably taking things too far. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/6 "2005-10-31T03:29:04Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > They are just friends, and were always meant to be. Well, yeah, I _know_ that, but I just can’t wrap my mind around the fact that someone could be so wholesome that they’d look at Peppermint Patty and think, “She’s straight.” > [@](#): > > A creator can’t be responsible for what dirty minded people think of his work. The characters were his, and he had no reason to change them just because someone interpreted them in one particular way. True, but Bert and Ernie got seperate pads after the “they’re gay” rumors began to really circulate. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/7 "2005-10-31T03:37:38Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > True, but Bert and Ernie got seperate pads after the “they’re gay” rumors began to really circulate. But Charles Schulz is more dead than the folks at the Public Television Workshop. Also, he never had to rely on public funding, and was fairly wealthy, so maybe he said “screw it”. Or “aw nuts”. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/8 "2005-10-31T04:32:53Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > A creator can’t be responsible for what dirty minded people think of his work. What’s _dirty_ about it? :dubious: (And, for the record, I don’t think they were gay, or supposed to be, myself. Too much evidence to the contrary—not the least of it being that they both have been noted as having crushes on Charlie Brown, along with other boys.) The weirdest part, though…guess who I’d been reading about in Wikipedia about two minutes before finding this thread? :eek: ::Cue theramin music:: ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/9 "2005-10-31T04:43:18Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > True, but Bert and Ernie got seperate pads after the “they’re gay” rumors began to really circulate. Really? As far as I can tell, Bert and Ernie still share an apartment. As for Peppermint Patty, both she and Marcie have had crushes on Charlie Brown. She eventually accepted Marcie calling her “sir.” I don’t think she’s a lesbian any more than I think Bert and Ernie are gay lovers- they are just The Odd Couple in Muppet form. And she’s just a tomboyish kid who likes to play baseball. ---
**Author:** ![Silentgoldfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@Silentgoldfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silentgoldfish)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/10 "2005-10-31T04:45:29Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > What’s _dirty_ about it? :dubious: Um… they’re 9? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/11 "2005-10-31T04:56:36Z")
How can we say we’ve made progress in the fight against ignorance when people still talk about a child being a lesbian just because she likes sports? And, worse, that somebody should _do something_ about it. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/12 "2005-10-31T04:57:16Z")
> [@mobo85](#): > > Really? As far as I can tell, Bert and Ernie still share an apartment. It was, IIRC, about 5 years or so ago that they did the big “move out,” however, the few times I’ve got the show in the years since, I’ve noticed that the scenes with Bert and Ernie have been shot in an “open manner” (i.e. one of them could be visiting the others place or they could still be living together, there’s be no use of things like them sleeping in seperate beds, etc.), and it’s entirely possible that the folks at the Street decided after they shot the “move out” ep, that it was really stupid and just dropped the idea. **Silentgoldfish** , IIRC, one Doper on these boards stated that he realized he was gay when he was that age and saw _E.T._. So long as there’s no Marcie and Patty girl on girl action, it’s not really dirty. After all, you **don’t** see anyone claiming that it’s “dirty” that the two of them have had crushes on Charlie Brown, and well, he’s got a penis he could impregnate them with. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/13 "2005-10-31T05:06:40Z")
Why aren’t there any rumors about Charlie Brown and Linus? Why didn’t Linus like the advances of Sally? Why didn’t Charlie Brown do anything with Patty. The cute little red haired girl was a beard. Oh wait a second. **THEY ARE FICTIONAL CHARACTERS THAT ONLY EXIST IN CARTOONS!** ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/14 "2005-10-31T05:10:46Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > How can we say we’ve made progress in the fight against ignorance when people still talk about a child being a lesbian just because she likes sports? I never stated that’s why people thought PP was gay (certainly folks have cited other things like her manner of dress). > [@](#): > > And, worse, that somebody should _do something_ about it. Nor did I mean to imply that there was anything wrong with the character of PP, only that given Shulz’s openly Christian attitude, I’m surprised he didn’t try to make changes to the character so that folks would be less likely to claim PP and Marcie were an “item.” ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/15 "2005-10-31T05:21:25Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > Nor did I mean to imply that there was anything wrong with the character of PP, only that given Shulz’s openly Christian attitude, I’m surprised he didn’t try to make changes to the character so that folks would be less likely to claim PP and Marcie were an “item.” I never heard that Charles Schultz was a fundamentalist. A Christian, of course, would not necessarily be bothered with the idea that people are gay. A small minority of Christians are closed-minded bigots who would object to the characters. I would bet that, had they not already become so firmly lodged in American culture, Pat Robertson would be leading a crusade against them. But again, what ignorant people think of his work happily had no bearing on Schultz ---
**Author:** ![Good\_Egg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/96bed5/32.png) [@Good\_Egg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Good_Egg)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/16 "2005-10-31T05:21:34Z")
What made the rumor start? I recall a video where they went to France and Marcie found a love. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/17 "2005-10-31T05:24:08Z")
I always thought she was intended to be a young feminist lefty… which doesn’t automatically mean she is gay… But come on… she wears birkenstocks… ---
**Author:** ![Mesquite-oh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a183cd/32.png) [@Mesquite-oh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mesquite-oh)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/18 "2005-10-31T06:07:32Z")
My impression of her when I was a child was simply that of a not too bright tomboy (remember how she thought Snoopy was an ugly kid?). I would have to believe that was Schultz’s intentions. With those sandals and an apparent lack of concern of what are traditional feminine and masculine roles, I percieve the character as just being an “earthy” idividualist. I can imagine the character growing up to be one of those overly tanned women who wear no make up and work at the State Park 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/19 "2005-10-31T06:20:49Z")
> [@saoirse](#): > > I never heard that Charles Schultz was a fundamentalist. A Christian, of course, would not necessarily be bothered with the idea that people are gay. A small minority of Christians are closed-minded bigots who would object to the characters. I would bet that, had they not already become so firmly lodged in American culture, Pat Robertson would be leading a crusade against them. But again, what ignorant people think of his work happily had no bearing on Schultz For the record, just because somebody is Christian doesn’t mean they’re a fundamentalist follower of the Reverends Robertson and Falwell. Schulz definitely was not a fundamentalist. I believe he was raised Lutheran and later joined another Protestant sect that had a fairly progressive reputation (It might have been the United Church of Christ but I’m not sure about that.) ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2005, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669/20 "2005-10-31T06:41:48Z")
> [@Silentgoldfish](#): > > Um… they’re 9? What, Charlie Brown’s sick for having a crush on the Little Red Haired Girl, then? How about Sally and Linus? Hey, just cause they (theoretically) “like-like” each other wouldn’t automatically mean they’re having freaky lesbian sex under the Kite-Eating Tree, or something. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-what-is-the-deal-with-peppermint-patty/328669.md?page=2)