# So when do you think Marvel... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 17, 2013, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562 "2013-12-17T15:40:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2013, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/21 "2013-12-18T15:05:49Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Thor might have learned a bit about humility and impulsivenes and stuff during his Midgardian ordeal, but he’s still waaaay too naive to be head of state. At least he’s realized that and given the throne over. And honestly, that makes Loki’s rule even more legit - Thor’s gone and abdicated (pre-abdicated?) and IF Loki hadn’t faked being dead, he’d be the only son available to inherit - Frigga’s dead, Odin’s old as shit, and Baldur (as far as I can tell from the Cinematic U) doesn’t exist. So the only REALLY hinky parts of this are whatever he’s done to Odin (or whatever naturally happened to Odin that he took advantage of) and him being “dead.” (Although even that might not be common knowlege among Asgardians, since I can’t see Odin having a big state funeral for the “traitor” so soon after Frigga’s massive send-off.) ---
**Author:** ![unwashed\_brain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/a9adbd/32.png) [@unwashed\_brain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/unwashed_brain)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2013, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/22 "2013-12-18T20:47:47Z")
Sorry for the threadshit, but hopefully they’ll invest their time and money in something else. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2013, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/23 "2013-12-18T21:18:39Z")
Ant-Man probably needs all the help it can get. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2013, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/24 "2013-12-18T21:33:47Z")
Don’t dis Ant-Man. He can be the size of an ant with human strength. He’s really able to clean house on those other ants. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2013, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/25 "2013-12-18T22:00:17Z")
> [@epbrown01](#): > > I also doubt he counted Thor out as his heir, since he sent him Mjolnir. Sorry, I’d missed that : so ? We can’t base political fundamentals and the legitimacy of supreme authority derived from the feudal contract based on the whims of an inanimate object. That’s just one step removed from farcical aquatic ceremonies ! > [@](#): > > And seeing as how Thor was only exiled a couple of days, no one outside the court likely knew he was gone. Odin basically just grounded him for a weekend. That’s _de facto_. But Odin couldn’t know just how long Thor would remain an unenlightened butthead, could he ? _De jure_, between this open ended exile and his Odinsleep thing, he must have set up a temporary stewardship for the duration of his “absence”. And everybody knows you can’t trust stewards (and grand viziers) to not crave to be Caliph instead of the Caliph. Basic political fact. So making Loki steward must be understood as Odin’s tacit condoning of parricide. The guy’s the god of lies and mischief, for Bifrost’s sake ! Don’t tell me nobody saw that shit coming. Specially not “I plucked my own eye out for Wisdom” guy. ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2013, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562/26 "2013-12-19T02:58:07Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Sorry, I’d missed that : so ? We can’t base political fundamentals and the legitimacy of supreme authority derived from the feudal contract based on the whims of an inanimate object. That’s just one step removed from farcical aquatic ceremonies! Actually, the Excaliber references works in a couple of ways against you. Thor was exiled as unworthy of taking the throne and Mjolnir was enchanted to work for someone who was (hopefully Thor, eventually). Loki attempted to wield it and couldn’t, meaning he’s no more worthy of the throne that Thor - by attempting to, he disqualified himself > [@](#): > > That’s _de facto_. But Odin couldn’t know just how long Thor would remain an unenlightened butthead, could he ? _De jure_, between this open ended exile and his Odinsleep thing, he must have set up a temporary stewardship for the duration of his “absence”. I think I’ve mentioned this gripe before: depending on the origin version, Thor was left on Earth for years or centuries to get his head straight. This could have been done in the movie with a quick montage ala Wolverine: Origins to bring him up to the present and meet Jane/find Mjolnir, but they skipped it (Odin also removed his memories, so he didn’t know he was Thor until he retrieved Mjolnir in the comics). Including this in the movies would have made clear Odin’s intent to have Thor take the throne and his willingness to wait indefinitely until his son was ready. This would also have reinforced Loki’s grievance as legitimate - swiping the throne after the heir is gone two days is grabby. Having Loki wait years/centuries for his shot, playing the good son so Odin gives up on Thor and sees him as worthy, _then_ hit with the one-two punch that 1)he never had a chance because 2) he’s a Frost Giant foundling? If I’m an Asgardian bartender hearing this tale from a Loki explaining his betrayal, I’d stand him a round and throw in a “Homie, you got screwed.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-do-you-think-marvel/676562.md?page=1)