# So when does it become an arsenal **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 29, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743 "2004-04-29T20:42:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/1 "2004-04-29T20:42:32Z")
A CNN article by Cheryl Bronson states that NY Police uncovered an arsenal of weapons and bombs in a Staten Island home. According to Bronson 13 guns and 10,000 rounds of ammo is a arsenal. I’m wondering what exactly constitutes an arsenal. I’m thinking 13 guns is hardly enough to qualify and 10,000 rounds although a lot could have been bought easily in bulk lots much cheaper than by the 20 round box. Shouldn’t Bronsons hand be slapped for crying wolf? FWIW I have more than half that many guns stored here in my gun cabinet. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/2 "2004-04-29T20:49:08Z")
I couldn’t find any definition that included a number, just this: 1. A governmental establishment for the storing, development, manufacturing, testing, or repairing of arms, ammunition, and other war materiel. 2. A stock of weapons. 3. A store or supply: an arsenal of retorts. It’s just a buzzword that sounds good in a media story. In Arizona someone with 13 guns is known as a liberal democrat. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/3 "2004-04-29T20:57:42Z")
If 13 guns is considered an arsenal, I know a lot of people who have an entire armory. Hobbyists can easily have over 100, plus reloading equipment, powder, ammunition, etc. It doesn’t make them terrorists or nuts, just collectors, hunters and hobbyists. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/4 "2004-04-29T21:09:41Z")
13 guns? Amateur! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Reepicheep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ed655f/32.png) [@Reepicheep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reepicheep)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/5 "2004-04-29T21:34:03Z")
I thought it was an arsenal because of the amount of ammo for the guns involved. I also thought CNN wanted something more than “a stash of guns” to report on. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/6 "2004-04-29T21:37:46Z")
> [@Reepicheep](#): > > I thought it was an arsenal because of the amount of ammo for the guns involved. 10,000 rounds just means that there was a sale at Turner’s! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/7 "2004-04-29T22:02:06Z")
> [@Reepicheep](#): > > I thought it was an arsenal because of the amount of ammo for the guns involved. > > I also thought CNN wanted something more than “a stash of guns” to report on. Depends. If each of the guns was a different caliber, then we’re talking an average of 800 rounds per gun. If not, it still isn’t significant if the guy is a target shooter, especially if he’s competetive. Now, if he has 13 guns, some high-powered scopes, and pictures of prominent political figures splashed with pig’s blood on the walls, then Houston, we have a problem. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/8 "2004-04-29T22:20:08Z")
If, according to community standard among levelheaded citizens, you have guns and ammo out the arse, then you have an arsenal. So, it’s a locally adjusted term. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![St\_Ides](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@St\_Ides](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/St_Ides)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/9 "2004-04-29T22:57:09Z")
Does this make my arsenal look big? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/10 "2004-04-29T23:27:55Z")
> [@St\_Ides](#): > > Does this make my arsenal look big? It’s not the size of the arsenal that counts, it’s the diameter of your bore. ---
**Author:** ![ltfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@ltfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ltfire)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/11 "2004-04-29T23:38:44Z")
According to todays N.Y. Times, also seized in the raid were the following: “Numerous propane tanks and seven home made explosive devices” ---
**Author:** ![HPL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/3da27b/32.png) [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/12 "2004-04-29T23:53:23Z")
I wondered about that too, but the report of pipe bombs seized as well disturbs me a bit more then the number of guns and ammo. ---
**Author:** ![justwannano](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7ab992/32.png) [@justwannano](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/justwannano)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2004, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/13 "2004-04-29T23:55:45Z")
Quote AskKnott If, according to community standard among levelheaded citizens, you have guns and ammo out the arse, then you have an arsenal. So, it’s a locally adjusted term Ok as long as there is a standard 😃 Quote ltfire According to todays N.Y. Times, also seized in the raid were the following: “Numerous propane tanks and seven home made explosive devices” Yeah probably a little strange for Staten Island but I’ve got numerous propane tanks myself. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Scrivener](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@The\_Scrivener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Scrivener)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/14 "2004-04-30T01:20:20Z")
Hmmm… can we at least agree on a lexicographic progression from “collection” to “stash” to “arsenal” to “armory”? 😃 Here’s my Q: at what point does a home containing one of the above go from being the “residence” of a “private person” to a “walled-off” or “tightly-guarded residence” of an “aloof individual” to a “jealously guarded compound” housing “shadowy figures”? And one more thing: why is it “10,000 rounds of ammo” instead of “10,000 bullets”? Or is a “round” a set number of bullets? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Scrivener](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@The\_Scrivener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Scrivener)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/15 "2004-04-30T01:24:53Z")
I just looked it up. A “round” is indeed a single bullet, or the ammunition equivalent. It’s still a ham-fisted cliche, though. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/16 "2004-04-30T01:46:05Z")
When my dad was real, real worried about Y2K. He bought my brother and I 5000 rounds (or is it 10000) of .22lr. It fits in a shoe box. I have maybe 200 rounds of other ammo. I ‘own’ 7 guns. I also have 4 - 20 pound propane bottles. And 5 GAS cans. Nothing real unusual. Not an arsenal. 13 CAR-15’s and 10,000 rounds of ammo could, in my mind be considered an arsenal. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/17 "2004-04-30T01:51:58Z")
> [@](#): > > And one more thing: why is it “10,000 rounds of ammo” instead of “10,000 bullets”? Or is a “round” a set number of bullets? The bullet is the lead/copper jacketed part that comes out the end of a gun. A round it the whole thing. Bullet, shell, powder, primer. ---
**Author:** ![Ringo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@Ringo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ringo)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/18 "2004-04-30T02:05:37Z")
I had the same thought **enipla** did. Thirteen identical assault rifle with 800 rounds each might be a tad “arsenalish.” How many rounds does an infantryman typically carry into battle? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/19 "2004-04-30T02:25:49Z")
Yeah…gotta admit that 13 identical rifles is a bit…suspicious, to say the least, even to me. 😃 At least my “arsenal” is made up of different rifles and different calibers. Maybe I won’t have to hide the spares for the BBQ after all… ---
**Author:** ![SnakeSpirit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snakespirit/32/7271_2.png) [@SnakeSpirit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnakeSpirit)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2004, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743/20 "2004-04-30T02:50:36Z")
I gotta agreed with enipla, if you’ve got a lot of the same or numerous related weapons, it qualifies as an arsenal, with or without ammo. The ammo alone would be a ‘dump.’ Typically, in the Nam, we carried \*at least \* 10 clips of 20 rounds each while on patrol, not necessarily expecting to get hit. 200 rounds. For the M-79 grenade launcher we carried at least 40 rounds. Into a known battle we would load up and carry up to five bandoliers each, 1000 rounds. We kept 3-4 times that much back in our forward firebase, in our hootch, for quick resupply, and supply had ammo boxes full of thousands of rounds for periodic resupply. But that’s war! At home I have 14 firearms and about 7 ammoboxes full of ammo, stocked up for the day when we can no longer get them. In addition, I have dozens of propane tanks, an atcetylene tank, nitric acid, sulfuric acid (but no glycerine), explosive ammonium nitrate (to make the flowers grow), no homemade bombs, an attack cat, two boomerangs, nunchakas, sai, darn-do, cern-do, swords from all over the world and a bottle of Cazadores tequila. It’s all legal, but I’m not sure about the tequila. I think I’m ready for the terrorists… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-when-does-it-become-an-arsenal/242743.md?page=2)