# So, where did the Democrats go wrong? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 9, 2016, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165 "2016-11-09T08:21:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/41 "2016-11-09T10:08:37Z")
Trump didn’t win because of the Breitbart readers. He won Florida due to the Cuban vote. We have no idea what the Jewish vote was yet(anyone have info on that?) He won the Midwest in all likelihood due to trade. It wasn’t Breitbart that told us Clinton was lying about trade. Her own surrogates did that(Thanks Terry Mac!). ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/42 "2016-11-09T10:11:02Z")
BTW, one thing it’s WAY past time for Democrats, from the top to the bottom, to do? Ditch the prime time comedy news show approach to looking at your opposition. Enough with the self-satisfied derision of your political opposition. All that is fine for the half hour it’s on, but there’s a reason we don’t talk like professional wrestlers once WWE Raw is over. Democrats shouldn’t talk like Jon Stewart/Stephen Colbert/John Oliver in real life. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/43 "2016-11-09T10:12:46Z")
So is it an indication of how people see this election that nobody seems to be offering any reason why Trump won, only why Clinton lost? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/44 "2016-11-09T10:13:59Z")
This was always going to be more about who lost than who won. Both candidates were unacceptable to the majority of voters. yet they had to choose and they decided to choose change. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/45 "2016-11-09T10:18:57Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Reform of the system, not steady incremental policy changes. There was nothing the public got from electing Barack Obama that they couldn’t have gotten from Hillary Clinton. Why bother? What on Earth makes you think Trump will reform the system, other than massively extending the power of the Executive? Trump doesn’t want to change anything systemic, he just wants his policies enacted. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/46 "2016-11-09T10:21:42Z")
Since Trump is a liar, I have no idea. But he did run making some pretty specific promises like ending the revolving door between Congress and a lucrative lobbying career. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/47 "2016-11-09T10:28:44Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Since Trump is a liar, I have no idea. But he did run making some pretty specific promises like ending the revolving door between Congress and a lucrative lobbying career. Even if he really, earnestly believes this, he won’t get it unless he goes full Jan Brewer and vetoes everything. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/48 "2016-11-09T10:34:29Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > … Tonight the Democrats got crushed across the board … Really? That is not what I heard. The Rs lost a few house seats and did not gain a supermajority in the Senate. If that is correct, “crushed across the board” is far from accurate. They may not even be able to repeal the ACA if there is a filibuster. ---
**Author:** ![Memnon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Memnon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Memnon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/49 "2016-11-09T10:41:16Z")
Where did the Democrats go wrong? Well, I think their main mistake was forgetting that these days, politics isn’t seen as Serious Business. It’s consumed as entertainment, where people root for their party like they root for their football team. This blindingly obvious political reality having somehow escaped them, they decided to nominate perhaps the least charismatic candidate to ever walk the Earth - a preternaturally inauthentic woman who habitually focus-grouped her every 3rd sentence and whose idea of humour was _“I’m trying to get them to have Pokemon Go-To-The-Polls”_ - and put her up against a professional showman. I think we can all agree that this was a tactical error. ---
**Author:** ![Salvor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Salvor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Salvor)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/50 "2016-11-09T10:47:16Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Really? That is not what I heard. The Rs lost a few house seats and did not gain a supermajority in the Senate. If that is correct, “crushed across the board” is far from accurate. They may not even be able to repeal the ACA if there is a filibuster. Stop it. They lost the presidency to Trump, and failed to take the Senate. It’s a total cluster fuck and disaster. ---
**Author:** ![Noel\_Prosequi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b19c9b/32.png) [@Noel\_Prosequi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noel_Prosequi)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/51 "2016-11-09T11:16:22Z")
Yep. They lost to Trump. The voters who were invisible to the polls blindsided everyone. This is not a blame thing. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/52 "2016-11-09T11:43:29Z")
Where did they go wrong? Besides all the good and thoughful comments made above, they apparently _ **didn’t** _ "Get Out the Vote. Right now on the NYT site Hillary has a small total National vote lead of about 30,000 votes, and once California is fanla counted, that will probably grow. But it is still only 58.875 million votes; in contrast Obama got 65.9 Million votes in 2012 (Rommey got 60.9). So even discounting the 3rd party candidates, that’s 7 million voters that came out for Obama and not for Clinton. Put them (hell, half of them) in Hillary’s column and she easily sweeps into the White House. So the votes that supposedly were going to be plucked by the ‘superior’ Democratic GOTV action…didn’t. Weak candidate, message not well-communicated, any number of reasons…but the upshot is the Dems didn’t get their vote out and it cost them. IMHO as always. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/53 "2016-11-09T11:46:28Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Where did they go wrong? Besides all the good and thoughful comments made above, they apparently _ **didn’t** _ "Get Out the Vote. > > Right now on the NYT site Hillary has a small total National vote lead of about 30,000 votes, and once California is fanla counted, that will probably grow. But it is still only 58.875 million votes; in contrast Obama got 65.9 Million votes in 2012 (Rommey got 60.9). So even discounting the 3rd party candidates, that’s 7 million voters that came out for Obama and not for Clinton. Put them (hell, half of them) in Hillary’s column and she easily sweeps into the White House. > > So the votes that supposedly were going to be plucked by the ‘superior’ Democratic GOTV action…didn’t. Weak candidate, message not well-communicated, any number of reasons…but the upshot is the Dems didn’t get their vote out and it cost them. > > IMHO as always. YMMV. Again, it probably didn’t account for all 7 million, but the Voter Rights Act was gutted in 2013 which had a substantial effect (but we don’t know exactly how substantial) on minority turnout. Though it’s also clear that Hillary had massive enthusiasm problems, that’s not in dispute. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/54 "2016-11-09T11:51:10Z")
> [@Memnon](#): > > Where did the Democrats go wrong? Well, I think their main mistake was forgetting that these days, politics isn’t seen as Serious Business. It’s consumed as entertainment, where people root for their party like they root for their football team. Yes… if you read the YouTube comments on the debates, the highly-upvoted comments were **overwhelmingly** in favor of Trump (with just a handful of “man I can’t believe these are our choices!”-type comments), declaring him as having crushed Hillary in the debates. Yet if you read liberal news outlets or the SDMB, they somehow declared Hillary as the “winner” of the debates. It’s this disconnect between what’s seen as smart/sensible/logical by the educated, and what’s seen through the lens of the masses, which led to the Democrats’ utterly delusional failure to grasp the reality of the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/55 "2016-11-09T11:53:13Z")
Fine, fuck it then, Kanye West 2020 let’s do this Dems. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/56 "2016-11-09T11:56:18Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > Fine, fuck it then, Kanye West 2020 let’s do this Dems. That’s not even a joke. [He has declared that he will be running](http://consequenceofsound.net/2016/08/kanye-west-fully-intends-to-run-for-president-in-2020-im-going-to-try-to-do-it/), and fully intends to follow through on it. And after tonight, I don’t doubt that he can win. ---
**Author:** ![Jragon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19b73/32.png) [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/57 "2016-11-09T12:00:34Z")
> [@Rigamarole](#): > > That’s not even a joke. [He has declared that he will be running](http://consequenceofsound.net/2016/08/kanye-west-fully-intends-to-run-for-president-in-2020-im-going-to-try-to-do-it/), and fully intends to follow through on it. And after tonight, I don’t doubt that he can win. As the memelords say these days [this is fine](http://i.imgur.com/GEAxXi1.png) ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/58 "2016-11-09T12:03:07Z")
It sure didn’t help that democrats were voting for Trump in the primaries and then talking about it (even here). Those folks sure built up some karma that just has to hurt. ---
**Author:** ![Rigamarole](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/77aa72/32.png) [@Rigamarole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rigamarole)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/59 "2016-11-09T12:05:28Z")
> [@kidchameleon](#): > > It sure didn’t help that democrats were voting for Trump in the primaries and then talking about it (even here). Those folks sure built up some karma that just has to hurt. “Trump is the greatest gift to the Democrats” was a common sentiment - would love to see what some of those people have to say now. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2016, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165/60 "2016-11-09T12:20:29Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Where did they go wrong? Besides all the good and thoughful comments made above, they apparently _ **didn’t** _ "Get Out the Vote. > > \ > > So the votes that supposedly were going to be plucked by the ‘superior’ Democratic GOTV action…didn’t. Weak candidate, message not well-communicated, any number of reasons…but the upshot is the Dems didn’t get their vote out and it cost them. > > IMHO as always. YMMV. I canvassed for Hillary just Tuesday morning (but not before). In my anecdotal experience, her CAMPAIGN did a great job – super organized, efficiently made sure I knew exactly what to say and to whom – BUT I was struck at how few volunteers like me there were at the local headquarters. So, another example of the lack of enthusiasm among regular folk – folks inclined to vote for her, but not AMPED about it like they were for Obama. So, yes, a GOTV problem, but not due directly to the campaign (e.g., inattention, or ineptitude, or lack of funding or planning). Indirectly, due to diminished enthusiasm and participation among the casual volunteers any successful campaign partly depends on. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-where-did-the-democrats-go-wrong/771165.md?page=4)