# So, which part of my life do I give up to avoid being raped? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 18, 2005, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339 "2005-01-18T09:27:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/281 "2005-01-22T12:23:00Z")
> [@spooje](#): > > Did you read the info in that link? Yes. > [@spooje](#): > > I don’t think it proves your point. It did that people heard things, not the complete thing, but some things and chose not to get involved. It is not proof of a greater pattern in society but my semi-WAG is that if you looked you could easily find cases where people stood by and did nothing. > [@spooje](#): > > Anyways, I always assumed much about that story, that your link says is wrong: Me too, and I’m a Gothamite. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/282 "2005-01-22T12:23:47Z")
Sorry–missing verb in that last sentence: “Why is this a plain-sense attitude…” ---
**Author:** ![laigle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@laigle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/laigle)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/283 "2005-01-22T15:43:29Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > Only if you consider all feminists to be raving loons, and “Nazi” to be a mild epithet. I think many reasonable people would disagree, though. > > You may care to review post #212 above, in which **catsix** explains that she calls feminists “Feminazis” because she has heard of a couple of feminists who hold repulsive views. One of her major examples is Valerie Solanas, who I believe appears in the dictionary under “Lone Wacko”. Another is her unsupported account about what someone once said on another message board (a message board that, as best as I can tell, no longer even exists). > > So we’ve got someone classing a whole group of people as horrible monsters because of the vile words of a very few. I’m not seeing how this is better than saying “Men are rapists”. Especially since **catsix** apparently believes that feminists _are_ Nazis, while the “Men are rapists” thing seems to have been a very, very bad turn of phrase that was actually meant to express a completely different idea – “[Almost all] rapists are men.” “Men are rapists” is still an awful thing to say, but it looks like it was a mistake. Of course it was. Just like if someone came through and said “Muslims are terrorists,” we should all accept their later snivvelling about how they mean almost all terrorists are Muslims instead of viewing them as the hatemongers they are. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![laigle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ce7236/32.png) [@laigle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/laigle)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/284 "2005-01-22T15:51:06Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > No, better it get reported in the first place. That’s okay with you, right? If the victims actually report the crimes and want to see the people who comitted this act against them prosecuted? Wow, that was the most obvious strawman I’ve seen in awhile. If you want to rant about reporting the crime, do so. Your previous rant was that a difficult to prove crime had a low conviction rate. Pick a topic to launch into irrational rants about. > [@](#): > > I realize we only spent 5 pages on this thread and a few on the others discussing how rape victims being made to feel responsible for the rape is only a myth, but y’know, a 2% conviction rate of a crime (of which only 16% of all cases are actually reported) leads me to believe that it’s not especially taken all that seriously. And when other people explain to you why that’s not the case, you have a temper tantrum. > [@](#): > > I could be wrong. I mean, maybe the police are just really, REALLY busy catching some kid smoking a joint, or ticketing jaywalkers, and saving the jail time for the way more important criminals, like murderers and rap…oh, wait, no, we’re talking about the rapists… but that conviction rating might have something to do with the victims’ feelings. Maybe. Just, y’now, a little bit. And? Drug offenses are easy to prove. Murder is still easier to prove than rape. The only difference between rape and sex is consent, and has been slowly and carefully explained to you consent is not an easy thing to prove. If the jury believes the sex was consensual, they won’t convict. If they believe the man THOUGHT it was consensual, there’s a good chance they won’t convict. Under those conditions you won’t get a good conviction rate. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/285 "2005-01-22T17:35:12Z")
> [@](#): > > **FinnAgain** said: > It is not proof of a greater pattern in society but my semi-WAG is that if you looked you could easily find cases where people stood by and did nothing. That’s not just true of rapes though. A lot of people don’t get themselves involved when they hear or see a crime happening for various reasons, not the least of which being that they are themselves afraid of harm that may come to them if they step between a violent attacker and a victim. > [@](#): > > **laigle** said: > And when other people explain to you why that’s not the case, you have a temper tantrum. Is she still claiming, despite cites to the contrary from more than one person, that only 2% of rape trials result in a conviction? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [January 22, 2005, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/286 "2005-01-22T21:42:25Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > That’s not just true of rapes though. A lot of people don’t get themselves involved when they hear or see a crime happening for various reasons, not the least of which being that they are themselves afraid of harm that may come to them if they step between a violent attacker and a victim. Yeah, that was my point. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2005, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/287 "2005-01-23T00:59:22Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > Well, I’m glad to hear that. > > But, leaving drugging incidents out of it, is it true or is it not that men will sometimes ignore a woman’s cries for help, figuring that “she doesn’t really mean it” or “I don’t want to get involved”? > > Note: I am **not** asserting that that **does** happen; I’m just asking **if** it ever does. Although…When I was a sophomore in college, my roommate was raped at a drunken party. I encouraged her to press charges and naturally word got around, resulting in one of the partygoers trying to “reason” with me that “She could ruin these guys’ lives!” and “You have to ask yourself what she was doing at that party in the first place”. I’m inclined to call that “tribal buddy mode”. I think we need to be real clear that everyone here understands the difference between: “I knew this guy once who did X”, and “Men tend to do X”. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/288 "2005-02-05T02:27:17Z")
**blowero** , we did that definition to death. Twice. How very ironic. I sent a link to this thread to all the women that I love and care about. Yesterday, one of them was raped. By two men she works with. One of them 26 years old, married, a father with a baby on the way. The second one was 19. They drove up next to her car after work, threw her in a van. They raped her, beat her, and drove her to a remote spot, and left her there. She has a broken nose, a broken jaw, and three broken ribs. She’s going to need plastic surgery. She doesn’t have insurance. ---
**Author:** ![if6was9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@if6was9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/if6was9)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/289 "2005-02-05T02:34:46Z")
Anyone who disagreed with **Maureen** (and others) in this thread would open your closed minds and eyes pretty fucking quick if it hit home like it did for us tonight. You should just shut your fucking mouths unless you know something. Debaters! Rhetoric-spewers! Non-feeling less than humans! _spits_ ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/290 "2005-02-05T02:36:57Z")
Sorry… …it hasn’t been a good day here in the **was9** household. ---
**Author:** ![Chotii](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@Chotii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chotii)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/291 "2005-02-05T02:53:22Z")
> [@Maureen](#): > > … By two men she works with. This is bewildering. Do they really think she can’t identify them? That the police will not be involved? Did the one man think his wife wouldn’t learn about it, and see his marriage crumble into nonexistence? Your poor friend. I hope she can find peace and healing. I can’t imagine what she must be going through. ---
**Author:** ![if6was9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@if6was9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/if6was9)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/292 "2005-02-05T03:07:15Z")
> [@Chotii](#): > > This is bewildering. Do they really think she can’t identify them? That the police will not be involved? Did the one man think his wife wouldn’t learn about it, and see his marriage crumble into nonexistence? > > Your poor friend. I hope she can find peace and healing. I can’t imagine what she must be going through. That is the thing that really has me pissed. This happened in Utah, where women are considered chattel and some of them “ask for it.” ---
**Author:** ![if6was9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@if6was9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/if6was9)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/293 "2005-02-05T03:09:46Z")
Jeez! I’m just spewing hatred. Sorry all. I’ll shut up. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/294 "2005-02-05T03:10:59Z")
> [@](#): > > **if6was9** said: > Anyone who disagreed with Maureen (and others) in this thread would open your closed minds and eyes pretty fucking quick if it hit home like it did for us tonight. You should just shut your fucking mouths unless you know something. Debaters! Rhetoric-spewers! Non-feeling less than humans! _spits_ I disagreed with **Maureen**. I still disgaree with her. I was raped six years ago by someone I thought was my friend and two of his buddies. Go ahead and tell me to shut my fucking mouth and that I don’t know anything. Go right ahead. ---
**Author:** ![Syntropy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/65b543/32.png) [@Syntropy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Syntropy)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/295 "2005-02-05T03:13:42Z")
Unfortunately for her, **catsix** , she’s not strong enough to write this off as just “a thing that happened to her.” Her nose was broken. Her jaw was broken. She’s going to need plastic surgery to repair her face. She was taken to a remote spot in the (Utah) mountains and left there. Basically, to die. Good on you that you could get past something like that. Not every woman is you. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/296 "2005-02-05T03:43:39Z")
Yeah it sucks that it happened to her, but to say that anyone who disagrees with you is a know-nothing who should shut their fucking mouth is also wrong. _That_ is what I responded to out of **if6was9** ’s post. ---
**Author:** ![if6was9](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@if6was9](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/if6was9)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/297 "2005-02-05T03:53:06Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Yeah it sucks that it happened to her, but to say that anyone who disagrees with you is a know-nothing who should shut their fucking mouth is also wrong. > > _That_ is what I responded to out of **if6was9** ’s post. Uhn huhn. Let’s not fool ourselves here. We all know if6’s rep… light-weight excitable poster with a spurious reputation. Let’s put the onus on him instead of someone who can handle herself and might actually make you shut the fuck up. You chose the the easy meat. Pansy. ---
**Author:** ![catsix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@catsix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/catsix)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/298 "2005-02-05T03:59:51Z")
Yeah, because obviously I know a damn thing about you. Shit, I didn’t even know you had any kind of knowledge of **Maureen**. I’m supposed to automatically know your personality too? ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/299 "2005-02-05T06:02:01Z")
> [@catsix](#): > > Yeah, she is. Isn’t she the one that believes it’s perfectly acceptable to implement a curfew for all men and to revoke their right to free association by saying that they cannot travel in groups? YOu know, catsix, if you didn’t get into a frothing rage at the very sight of my name, the froth might not get in the way of your actually reading what I wrote. Ah, well, parr for the course. I posted a link previously to the US DOJ study on rape. And this: And I’ve already said that because feminazi is too inflammatory for certain feminists who believe that men are inherently flawed and ( **margin** as an example) have espoused the view that men should have curfews and restrictions placed upon their associations with other men, I will use the term ‘feminasty’ to describe them. These include the followers of Andrea Dworkin, Catharine MacKinnon, Germaine Greer, and posters like **margin**. I really can’t decide if you believe this stuff or if you’re just incapable. Catsix: YOU HATE MEN!! Yeah, hasn’t changed. You say this shit about me. Prove it. Where’s the quote? ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2005, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339/300 "2005-02-05T06:34:13Z")
> [@margin](#): > > Prove it. Where’s the quote? You posted this on page 2: > [@margin](#): > > Huh, redux > > * * * > > "The fact of the matter is that you don’t get to restrict the rights of an entire half of the damn species because some of them happen to commit crimes. Women should take care of their own security, just like men. Punishing innocent men because some other men raped someone is the height of stupidity and bigotry. " > You’re still ignoring the central point. Women do take precautions, and get raped anyway. Society is uncomfortable with anything but the guy in the alleyway type of rapist, which you yourself used as an example at least twice. Why is it acceptable to demand that women curfew themselves----because they might get attacked—while men who might attack them are granted all the freedom they want? We restrict women so that men can be given more freedom. If it’s fair to restrict women to ‘protect’ them then it’s fair to restrict men for what they might do. > > Anyway, what level of restrictions are okay, to go back to the OP? Self curfew? Being inside by dark? Dressing conservatively? This post you made implies that it is okay to curfew men. Perhaps that’s what she is referring to? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-part-of-my-life-do-i-give-up-to-avoid-being-raped/285339.md?page=16)