# So which religious laws are Christians supposed to follow? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 17, 2005, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491 "2005-11-17T15:55:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Atticus\_Finch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2005, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/1 "2005-11-17T15:55:06Z")
This is more of a GQ, really, but I put it here because it obviously has no single, absolute answer and might be controversial. So what biblical or similar laws are Christians supposed to follow? What kind of schools of thought exist, who adheres to them and what theological justification do they have? Off the top of my head, I can think of Jesus’ two commandments (love God, love thy neighbour) alone, and of the laws laid out in the Old Testament plus Jesus’ commandments, or all of the above plus Paul etc in the New Testament. A poster in [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=345045), **Finagle** , suggests that Christians are compelled to follow only the Noahide laws. So what’s the story? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2005, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/2 "2005-11-17T16:13:28Z")
You haven’t covered them all. There are also the dietary laws set out in the Acts of the Apostles, that Christians have used to avoid the Jewish dietary laws. But Christ said that “not a jot or a tittle of the Law will pass away…”, so you could argue that Christians _ought_ to follow all the rules. I’m sure you can find a way to justify anything. When I was a kid we had to asvoid meat on Friday, and that doesn’t even have a scriptural basis. It’s so much easier being agnostic. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2005, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/3 "2005-11-17T16:19:36Z")
There is no official, universal set of laws for all Christians. It’s pretty much an interpretive, denominational thing. For some, all you have to do is repent and accept Jesus, for some, you have to be baptized, for some you have to follow the Noahide laws. Some groups of so-called “Messianic Jews” basically follow Mosaic law and even keep kosher. There is nothing in the NT that outlines a set of rules and regulations or anything, and more than a little of what _is_ suggested as to how Christians should live (living in poverty, living in communes without private ownership of property, paying taxes without complaint, pacifism, women keeping silent, slaves obeying their masters, etc.) is more or less ignored. ---
**Author:** ![Atticus\_Finch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2005, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/4 "2005-11-17T16:45:34Z")
I’m aware that I didn’t cover the field of potential biblical sources of law, and also that there’s no one authoritative or official answer. I guess what I’m interested in is the concept of some, generally more conservative / evangelical Christians, that the Old Testament applies entirely or in large part to Christians and others today. All that Leviticus stuff that gets brought up in support of arguments against tolerance of homosexuals, that kind of thing. Where does that all come from, and what do more lefty modern Christians think about the authoritativeness of such _halakha_ law? ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/5 "2005-11-18T08:21:11Z")
> [@Atticus Finch](#): > > I’m aware that I didn’t cover the field of potential biblical sources of law, and also that there’s no one authoritative or official answer. > > I guess what I’m interested in is the concept of some, generally more conservative / evangelical Christians, that the Old Testament applies entirely or in large part to Christians and others today. All that Leviticus stuff that gets brought up in support of arguments against tolerance of homosexuals, that kind of thing. Where does that all come from, and what do more lefty modern Christians think about the authoritativeness of such _halakha_ law? It just basically comes from theological differences, that is why there are so many different Christian denominations. Some Christians believe somet hings, others believe different. It’s hard to even generalize about right/left when it comes to Christiand denominations. There are literally just a huge number of sects, some of them very small and highly specific in what they believe. A large percentage of modern Christians, both on the left and right, don’t give much weight to halakha law. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/6 "2005-11-18T13:59:32Z")
Talk about varied beliefs. Some Christians believe you shouldn’t dance. Some drink alcohol some don’t. Some believe playing a musical instrument in during church services is sinful. Some believe all swearing is awful while others just try not to use the Lords name in vain. I like Jesus response about the first two commandments. If you sincerely and continuously try to do those two, then all the rest is just details. Everything else springs from those two. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/7 "2005-11-18T14:09:17Z")
I’d be interested in some elaboration of the “New Covenent” Christians sometimes mention. I’ve heard this used to justify why the Jewish dietary laws don’t apply. Is there scriptural support for this “new covenent” concept, and/or a description of what is and is not included in it? Why is eating pork allowed, yet, for many Christians, homosexuality is still bad? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/8 "2005-11-18T16:30:33Z")
“Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” — Jesus, _Matthew 5:48_ ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/9 "2005-11-18T17:07:25Z")
Actually, I think one of the main points of Jesus’ ministry was that people were getting too tied up in the fine points of the law to the point where it defied common sense. I don’t have cites handy, but look at where He’s chided for gathering food on the Sabbath or when He was asked about the woman who was married multiple times. When Christ was asked which the most important Commandment was, He said, (bear with me here; I’m working from memory) “Thou shalt love the Lord, thy God, with all thy heart and with all thy soul and with all thy mind. This is the first and greatest commandment and the second is like unto it. Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.” In my own, sometimes unorthodox take on Christianity, these are the two laws against which I must measure my every action. These are the two laws I _must_ obey above all others. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Atticus\_Finch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/10 "2005-11-18T17:20:23Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > I’d be interested in some elaboration of the “New Covenent” Christians sometimes mention. I’ve heard this used to justify why the Jewish dietary laws don’t apply. Is there scriptural support for this “new covenent” concept, and/or a description of what is and is not included in it? Why is eating pork allowed, yet, for many Christians, homosexuality is still bad? Yeah, I’m interested in this too. Can I narrow my extremely vague OP down to this for the time being? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2005, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/11 "2005-11-18T17:54:54Z")
> [@Atticus Finch](#): > > Yeah, I’m interested in this too. Can I narrow my extremely vague OP down to this for the time being? I has been explained to me that some of those laws are “ceremonial laws,” (no pork) which Christians don’t have to follow, and some are “moral laws,” (no murder) which still apply. Haven’t yet heard how one determines which category a specific law fits into, though. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2005, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/12 "2005-11-19T11:02:49Z")
Well, Jesus talks a lot about the law in [Matthew 15](http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=47&chapter=15&version=31&context=chapter). In verses 10 through 20, He can be read as specifically doing away with dietary restrictions. Here’s the passage: > [@](#): > > Jesus called the crowd to him and said, "Listen and understand. What goes into a man’s mouth does not make him ‘unclean,’ but what comes out of his mouth, that is what makes him ‘unclean.’ " > > Then the disciples came to him and asked, “Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this?” > > He replied, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be pulled up by the roots. Leave them; they are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.” > > Peter said, “Explain the parable to us.” > > “Are you still so dull?” Jesus asked them. "Don’t you see that whatever enters the mouth goes into the stomach and then out of the body? But the things that come out of the mouth come from the heart, and these make a man ‘unclean.’ For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false testimony, slander. These are what make a man ‘unclean’; but eating with unwashed hands does not make him ‘unclean.’ " Taking this in context with the rest of the chapter and with the rest of Jesus’s teachings, I’d say that going through Jewish law and saying “A applies but B doesn’t” is missing the point. Earlier in the chapter, Christ speaks about those who pay lip service to the Commandment “Honor thy father and mother” yet say to them “Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is a gift devoted to God” thus breaking the Commandment while keeping the strict letter of the law. One’s actions must be measured the _entire_ law and priorities set based on the guidelines I mentioned in my last post. It’s not about nitpicking the law; Christ specifically speaks against that. Rather, it’s about looking at one’s actions in the context of the entire law as summed up by Jesus and seeing how one’s actions fit them. Last year, an old friend of mine who happens to be a Wiccan moved in with me for a while when his wife divorced him. There are some Christians who’d say I continue to sin by associating with a non-Christian whom I’m highly unlikely to convert. There are some people who’d say I sinned by allowing a man to move in with me since I’m a single woman. On the other hand, there is that whole “Love your neighbor as yourself” business and in Matthew 25, Christ speaks about inviting strangers in, let alone friends. It’s dead early in the morning here. Is any of this making sense? CJ ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2005, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/13 "2005-11-19T22:55:52Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > I’d be interested in some elaboration of the “New Covenent” Christians sometimes mention. I’ve heard this used to justify why the Jewish dietary laws don’t apply. Is there scriptural support for this “new covenent” concept, and/or a description of what is and is not included in it? Why is eating pork allowed, yet, for many Christians, homosexuality is still bad? Chapter 15, the Book of Acts of the Apostles – the first “Council of Jerusalem”: > [@](#): > > 1Some men came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the brothers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. […] > 5Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised **and required to obey the law of Moses."** > 6The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that **some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are**.” > […]13When they finished, James spoke up: "Brothers, listen to me. 14Simon has described to us how God at first showed his concern by taking from the Gentiles a people for himself. 15The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, […] > 19"It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20Instead we should write to them, telling them **to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood**. > […] > 22Then the apostles and elders, with the whole church, decided to choose some of their own men and send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. They chose Judas (called Barsabbas) and Silas, two men who were leaders among the brothers. 23With them they sent the following letter: The apostles and elders, your brothers, To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia: Greetings. […] 28It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29You are to\*\* abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality.\*\* You will do well to avoid these things. Farewell. > 30The men were sent off and went down to Antioch, where they gathered the church together and delivered the letter. 31The people read it and were glad for its encouraging message[…] > > New International Version Bible; at [www.biblegateway.com](http://www.biblegateway.com); boldfaced emphasis added by JRD (In the more traditional KJV version, substitute “fornication” for “sexual immorality”) Many Christians, based upon this passage, conclude that since the Apostles did not provide a new, Christian definition of “sexual immorality”/“fornication”, then the _sexual_ prohibitions from the old Law should still apply. Other interpreters of Scripture argue that the reference is to the conduct in the context of Pagan _sexual rituals_ and not to Bruce and Derek sharing a flat in the East Village, but you can see how things can get there if you’re a literalist. (BTW, if I understand correctly Jehovah’s Witnesses use the Council of Jerusalem rules as justification for their rejection of blood transfusions.) ---
**Author:** ![Atticus\_Finch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ec9cab/32.png) [@Atticus\_Finch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atticus_Finch)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2005, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/14 "2005-11-19T23:29:22Z")
Thank you very much, **CJ** and **JR** … ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2005, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-which-religious-laws-are-christians-supposed-to-follow/331491/15 "2005-11-19T23:58:44Z")
Day by day, Oh, dear Lord, Three things I pray: To see Thee more clearly, Love Thee more dearly, Follow Thee more nearly, Day by day. 😃