# So who are these people that "can't afford" ACA? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 14, 2016, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090 "2016-01-14T00:09:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/61 "2016-01-15T13:15:28Z")
> [@Rushgeekgirl](#): > > She cannot afford 300 a month after rent, utilities, and car insurance, much less gas and food. Why doesn’t she stop paying for car insurance? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/62 "2016-01-15T13:27:21Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > You can also buy aspirin at the Dollar Store. Not in the hospital, nor may you bring your own prescription drugs in. They want to be sure that while under their care you receive the very best, most expensive drugs. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/63 "2016-01-15T13:32:19Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > It’s why the US needs to become civilized and provide for all citizens like a real country should. I’ve wondered if the ACA is a setup for that. Another party could gleefully repeal the hated “Obama Care” and be heroes introducing national health care. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/64 "2016-01-15T14:45:43Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Not in the hospital, nor may you bring your own prescription drugs in. They want to be sure that while under their care you receive the very best, most expensive drugs. 🙂 Neither facial tissues nor aspirin require a prescription. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/65 "2016-01-15T14:49:20Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Neither facial tissues nor aspirin require a prescription. You may be able to bring your own tissues, I don’t know about aspirin. The point, however, is that hospitals charge much more for stuff than they should. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/66 "2016-01-15T16:43:23Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Why doesn’t she stop paying for car insurance? In many states, insurance is manadatory if you own a car. ETA: And the Sec of State does require proof of insurance when you renew you car’s registration. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/67 "2016-01-15T16:47:42Z")
> [@Ca3799](#): > > This year, she tells me that a person with “zero” income does not qualify for any subsidy and she must pay the full cost of any plan. She’s also pretty much depleted all her reserves. She’s in Texas, so does not qualify for Medicaid since Texas refused the expansion. (She wouldn’t qualify anyway under the current rules.) That’s the problem with subsidies. When money gets tight, subsidies are the first thing that gets the axe. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/68 "2016-01-15T16:49:42Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > In many states, insurance is manadatory if you own a car. > > ETA: And the Sec of State does require proof of insurance when you renew you car’s registration. Isn’t health insurance now mandatory? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/69 "2016-01-15T17:34:20Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Neither facial tissues nor aspirin require a prescription. While you laugh about aspirin, taking aspirin could be very dangerous for me, since I’m on Warfarin. If you were in the hospital, and they put you on a blood thinner for some reason, popping your normal aspirin could be dangerous to you. And you’d no doubt sue the hospital. I’m unaware of any bans at bringing in tissues however. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/70 "2016-01-15T17:40:00Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > OK, oh invulnerable one, all of a sudden you have a heart attack, wind up in the ER, and find your life will be saved if you get a stent of two. I’m gonna stop you _right there_. I’m going to **DIE**. I would not tolerate having my rib-cage ripped open to “save my life” (for what, maybe a couple of extra years of constant pain and suffering?). Ain’t going down that road. I’ve got 2 close friends who get sliced and diced on a regular basis, and their lives are absolute SHIT. No thanks. I’ll leave my money for my kid, have the common decency to die when its my time, on my terms, intact. BOOYAH! ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/71 "2016-01-15T17:42:54Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Isn’t health insurance now mandatory? Automobile insurance. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/72 "2016-01-15T17:44:16Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Isn’t health insurance now mandatory? No. It increases your tax burden by a few hundred dollars if you don’t have any though. They’re not going to put you in jail or take your license away for failing to obtain health insurance like they will with car insurance. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/73 "2016-01-15T17:52:24Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > No. It increases your tax burden by a few hundred dollars if you don’t have any though. They’re not going to put you in jail or take your license away for failing to obtain health insurance like they will with car insurance. So, if health insurance is not mandatory, why is your tax burden increased by a few hundred dollars if you don’t have it? Being fined for not having something seems like it is mandatory to me. If auto insurance is mandatory, why are there millions of drivers without it? ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/74 "2016-01-15T17:55:45Z")
Taxes are not fines. You pay taxes if you drive a car, does that mean driving is forbidden? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/75 "2016-01-15T17:59:41Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > You pay taxes if you drive a car, does that mean driving is forbidden? This makes no sense, and is in no way related to what I am asking. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/76 "2016-01-15T18:04:09Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > This makes no sense, and is in no way related to what I am asking. You said, and I quote “So, if health insurance is not mandatory, why is your tax burden increased by a few hundred dollars if you don’t have it?” If driving isn’t forbidden, why is your tax burden increased when you drive? It’s the same issue. Taxing something doesn’t mean that thing is banned. We have taxes on liquor, cigarettes, real estate, literally everything you buy. Those things aren’t forbidden, nor is going without them mandatory. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/77 "2016-01-15T18:04:10Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > I have a health savings account (HSA) that is tax deductible but I can only save a little over $3000 a year in it by law (those that are good at math may notice that is significantly less than a $6000 deductible). Nitpick: you can put as much as you want in per year. The caveat is that only the first $3350 per year (in 2015) is deductible. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/78 "2016-01-15T18:55:01Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > You said, and I quote “So, if health insurance is not mandatory, why is your tax burden increased by a few hundred dollars if you don’t have it?” If driving isn’t forbidden, why is your tax burden increased when you drive? It’s the same issue. Taxing something doesn’t mean that thing is banned. We have taxes on liquor, cigarettes, real estate, literally everything you buy. Those things aren’t forbidden, nor is going without them mandatory. Still makes no sense. I said nothing about anything being banned or forbidden. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/79 "2016-01-15T18:58:36Z")
You said it was mandatory. Ergo, you are saying _not_ having it is forbidden. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2016, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090/80 "2016-01-15T19:16:45Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > The big difference is that it’s not gambling when you have all the information. The US government (and insurance companies) know (probably within 5%) the number of people who will get cancer this year. If they make the decisions, it’s not gambling. They know all the costs, all the benefits, and how to make sound financial decisions with that information. > > An individual patient is like a casino patron. They’re just guessing, and it mostly comes down to luck. The insurance companies and the US government are like the casino. It’s gambling in the first instance. It’s just business in the second. > > Furthermore, in the case of universal healthcare, we’re providing for people who can’t afford it. It’s kind of like a casino who makes sure their poorest patrons don’t go broke, rather than just telling them that if they currently can’t afford to live, they should just keep playing the slots until they can. That’s a significant difference. Once again, health insurance (heck insurance generally) is seen more frequently as a hedge rather than a gamble. Characterizing insurance as a gamble rather than a hedge kinda makes you seemed biased against the concept of insurance generally. The way Obamacare subsidies work, I don’t see a lot of daylight between Obamacare and what you are describing as universal healthcare. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-who-are-these-people-that-cant-afford-aca/743090.md?page=5)