# So why can't you get GOOD mexican food outside the Southwest? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 24, 2010, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191 "2010-10-24T15:46:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Kevbo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e47774/32.png) [@Kevbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kevbo)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2010, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/61 "2010-10-26T22:14:22Z")
Just have to mention the aptly named “Senior Gringo’s” in Fort Smith, Arkansas. I refused to try it, but those that did confirmed it was every bit as dreadful as it sounds. ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2010, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/62 "2010-10-26T23:27:56Z")
One time about 15 years ago, we were traveling in Alaska and really really really needed some Mexican food. Stopped in a place on the side of the road, not expecting much, but desperate. The food was fantastic- just like home. Actually better than home… Turns out the guy was from Laredo, God bless him. Hmmm… could use some right now… 'scuse me. ---
**Author:** ![gazpacho](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6f9a4e/32.png) [@gazpacho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gazpacho)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/63 "2010-10-27T00:39:51Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I wouldn’t go quite _that_ far, but my preference is to New Mexican over Texan. Now _that’s_ a cuisine I haven’t been able to find a decent outpost of outside of the New Mexico area. I have a good story about new Mexican food. I grew up in New Mexico and as this thread shows we are an opinionated lot when it comes to food. My brother in law recently taught a class in Albuquerque and asked the class where to go to eat. All 30 people in the class had strong opinions about where to go. Sadie’s vs. El Pinto vs Los Cuates etc. Red vs. Green. Was Sadie’s better 20 years ago when it was in the bowling alley? When I saw him a few weeks later he said that he always thought it was just my sister and myself that went on and on about New Mexican food. It is all of us. ---
**Author:** ![GameHat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ed655f/32.png) [@GameHat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GameHat)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/64 "2010-10-27T01:28:35Z")
> [@MikeG](#): > > Come to Chicago. I strongly agree. Even way out in the suburbs there’s lots of good Mexican (though admittedly mostly at the cheaper end). The suburb I work in is over 40% hispanic; mostly Mexican (by my guess). There are three taquerias that I frequent. All within 5 miles from where I work. All very cheap. All really good. For me it was a bit jarring at first to be the only anglo in a place; I got over this really quickly because the food is so damn good. You know I had never even heard of [Posole](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posole) until I moved here? My god, that’s up there for the world’s best comfort food. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/65 "2010-10-27T01:45:26Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I have a theory that, as a general rule, north of the Mason-Dixon line people care more about their food than those living south of the M-D line, and it shows in the quality of their restaurants. That’s the most hilariously incorrect thing I’ve read all day. I can’t wait to share it with my Southern friends. The ones from New Orleans, especially. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/66 "2010-10-27T02:44:06Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > I have a good story about new Mexican food. I grew up in New Mexico and as this thread shows we are an opinionated lot when it comes to food. > > My brother in law recently taught a class in Albuquerque and asked the class where to go to eat. All 30 people in the class had strong opinions about where to go. Sadie’s vs. El Pinto vs Los Cuates etc. Red vs. Green. Was Sadie’s better 20 years ago when it was in the bowling alley? When I saw him a few weeks later he said that he always thought it was just my sister and myself that went on and on about New Mexican food. It is all of us. MMMMM Los Cuates Green Chile Cheese Fries MMMMMMMMM :: begins drooling ::: Those are probably the most unhealthy things I have ever eaten but damned they are good. Red is nice but green is the bomb. I prefer the original Los Cuates\*, though Sadie’s rocks. I am meh on El Pinto. Garduno’s was pretty good for a while as well but I heard they got all jacked up due to a divorce/lawsuit/one partner ripping off the other/etc. > [@](#): > > I have a theory that, as a general rule, north of the Mason-Dixon line people care more about their food than those living south of the M-D line, and it shows in the quality of their restaurants. I am also going to have to totally disagree on this. The issue, I think, is that until recently a lot of food south of the Mason-Dixon line was considered just food, not fine cuisine. I know that for a long time Mexican and New Mexican was viewed differently than Italian. Italian was _real_ cooking while Mexican was something you got at Taco Bell. I do know that in New Mexico there are huge debates about which Mexican places are the best and people are very picky. Then there is the whole cilantro debate\*\*. And the red vs green debate can turn into a war… Slee \*Los Cuates is bizarre. The first store they opened is a little diner kind of place. The second store they opened is much nicer, a full restaurant kind of feel. The odd thing is that the two stores are directly across the street from each other. \*\* Cilantro tastes like soap. It is evil. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/67 "2010-10-27T03:37:55Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > I grew up in New Mexico and as this thread shows we are an opinionated lot when it comes to food. To be fair, that’s not particularly unique to New Mexico, though. Any area with a proud food culture is going to be pretty damned opinionated when it comes to local foods. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/68 "2010-10-27T03:40:28Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > Now _that’s_ a cuisine I haven’t been able to find a decent outpost of outside of the New Mexico area. Ain’t that the truth. I have fond memories of Tomasita’s in Santa Fe, and I remember back when Sadie’s in Albuquerque was just a bowling-alley diner, before it opened it’s spiffy huge new place next door to the bowling alley. People used to crowd into the bowling alley just to wait for a table in Sadie’s and to hell with bowling! (I think the quality steyd the same when they moved, too.) Introduced the wife to those places and more. Must be many other good restaurants there now since my day. Mmmmmm. As for finding Mexican food outside of the the US and Mexico, I recall eating Mexican in Kathmandu. Or was it upcountry in Pokhara? Maybe both! And there used to be a halfway decent joint in Bangkok called Tia Maria’s. Lasted 15 years or more, and we think it may have been some sort of drug-money laundering front or something. A large place, I don’t think we ever saw more than four tables filled at any time. Usually just one or two others. Once when my friend came down from upcountry, he and I and our wives whiled away a good two hours there during dinnertime on a Saturday night, and not one single other person came in. But it kept on going. Finally cloed down about five years ago maybe. It was actually not bad. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/69 "2010-10-27T03:46:36Z")
> [@gazpacho](#): > > I have a good story about new Mexican food. I grew up in New Mexico and as this thread shows we are an opinionated lot when it comes to food. > > My brother in law recently taught a class in Albuquerque and asked the class where to go to eat. All 30 people in the class had strong opinions about where to go. Sadie’s vs. El Pinto vs Los Cuates etc. Red vs. Green. Was Sadie’s better 20 years ago when it was in the bowling alley? When I saw him a few weeks later he said that he always thought it was just my sister and myself that went on and on about New Mexican food. It is all of us. I think Sadie’s quality stayed the same when it moved, but I don’t know about nowadays. Is Baca’s still there? On Central, not too far from the university. The food was not bad, but I especially liked sitting in the back room, the bar area, where they had this stunning giant 17th-century (I think it was the 17th) handcarved bar that someone had shipped over from Europe. Italy, I think it was. ---
**Author:** ![Aestivalis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Aestivalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aestivalis)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/70 "2010-10-27T03:57:20Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > Sure, you may be able to find a few good restaurants, but in Mexican-influenced areas of the US, Mexican food is not something special. It’s not something you go out for or go out of your way for. It’s just what food is. It’s like getting a hamburger. Imagine, for a moment, that you moved to a town where if you wanted a hamburger you would have to go out of your way. Imagine if there were just a couple restaurants that could serve a hamburger above McDonalds quality- that even the kind of hamburger you’d get at Denny’s is rare. THAT is how we feel. This is the key right here. If it’s considered “ethnic” food by the majority of patrons, it’s not likely to be as good as if it is just considered a normal meal. This is why the Mexican restaurants will generally be better in Mexican neighborhoods, which goes the same for the Chinese, Vietnamese, Korean, Japanese, Indian, Jewish, Polish, Czech, and African neighborhoods I’ve been to (and that’s just in Chicago and suburbs). The more natives of that ethnicity clamoring for that kind of food, the more competition there will be among restaurants to deliver better food. Now this doesn’t mean that it will necessarily fit your non-native palate, but that’s another conversation altogether. For example I hate going to the chain Mexican joints in Texas for work-related events, but I’m happy when I’m trying to find restaurants, dives and taco trucks that serve the community. You might not like sweetbread, tongue and tripe tacos, but I will go out of my way for some good ones. ---
**Author:** ![EvilTOJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee59a6/32.png) [@EvilTOJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilTOJ)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/71 "2010-10-27T09:35:04Z")
> [@beowulff](#): > > Pretty sad that they had to name it phonetically, instead of calling it Oaxaca. Most everyone would pronounce it “O-axe-akka” except Mexicans. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/72 "2010-10-27T12:46:40Z")
> [@Aestivalis](#): > > …Now this doesn’t mean that it will necessarily fit your non-native palate, but that’s another conversation altogether. For example I hate going to the chain Mexican joints in Texas for work-related events, but I’m happy when I’m trying to find restaurants, dives and taco trucks that serve the community. You might not like sweetbread, tongue and tripe tacos, but I will go out of my way for some good ones. I don’t _hate_ going to Pappasito’s for a work related event. Because that means somebody else is paying. Their margaritas are fine & I’ve never gotten sick there. On my own dime, I’ll go to neighborhood places like [Teotihuacan](http://teotihuacanmexicancafe.com/). [Taco trucks](http://www.robbwalsh.com/2009/03/houstons-top-10-taco-trucks/) are OK, even if you have to elbow your way through the foodies. [Pico’s](http://www.picos.net/) is worth the trip to Bellaire & [Hugo’s](http://hugosrestaurant.net/index.html) is great when I’m feeling rich. _Some_ chain places are OK because they are well managed (& of course the kitchens are full of Mexicans) & some “authentic” places are crap. At least we’ve got a huge choice down here. But more Mexicans living outside the Southwest means good food can now be found in unlikely places. Calvin Trillin said he preferred Mexican restaurants that served tripe. Even if he didn’t eat it, he considered its presence on the menu a good sign. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191/73 "2010-10-27T13:47:33Z")
> [@sleestak](#): > > Mexican food is pretty complex. I grew up in New Mexico and the Mexican food there is way different that Mexico’s Mexican food, vs Texas (TexMex) vs. California (cheese). > > I lived back east and was never able to find a decent New Mexican Mexican restaurant. New Mexican Mexican food is pretty much red and green chile. Getting decent green or red chile outside of New Mexico is quite hard, though Arizona has some ok places. California not so much, every time I eat at a Mexican joint out there I fear for my heart, they use a lot of cheese. In Texas, the food is ok for the most part but it seems to be more Tex-Mex than Mexican. > > The key to New Mexico Mexican food is the chiles, which only grow well in a certain area of New Mexico. The chiles are the key and are used in just about everything. The only difference between green and red chile is the age, green ripens into red. The standard in New Mexico for chile is Hatch. Hatch has great flavor and the heat ranges from pretty mild to fairly hot. Finding good chile outside of New Mexico can be hard. I had a hard time finding it in Vegas for a while. Now a chain store carries Hatch. > > My experience with New Mexican Mexican food back east was that a) it was all pretty mild b) they didn’t use nearly as much chile as I expected and c) a lot of places called Tex-Mex Mexican. Finding good chile back east was also hard. All the chile was mild and pretty tasteless. I found one joint that had decent chile but they watered it down so much it sucked. > > In New Mexico chile is close to a religion. The state question is ‘Red or Green’. Hell, one place makes green chile ice cream, which is surprisingly good. > > So finding good Mexican is going to depend first on what kind of Mexican you think is good. > > Slee Same here-I used to go to Albuquerque on business a lot-so I loved the local food. Nobody outside of New Mexico makes chiles rellenos correctly, and I haven’t seen sopapillas anywhere here (Boston, MA area). I wonder if I could opena a new Mexican restaurant here? Anyway, there is a very good Mexican place in Braintree, MA (the owner is from Sonora). But New mexican..no.. damn, I’m hungry for some pozole and sopapillas now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-why-cant-you-get-good-mexican-food-outside-the-southwest/558191.md?page=3)