Well, I used to work in a rape crisis center, and I can tell you that’s never how I saw it. The first question was usually, “Is she tellin’ the truth?” (from police)
True, in a crisis center, our job was to assume that the girl was telling the truth (or guy, depending on the client ), but I can assure you that very rarely did we feel we had the local PD on our side unless she was bloody, bruised, cute and they had no prior relationship.
Go out on a date with a football player and he rapes you? Ah, must just be regretting it. :rolleyes:
Alright, so if a child molester is on the loose, it’s maybe not okay if we don’t know, but if someone date rapes someone, we shouldn’t presume them innocent or guilty? Just kept in the dark? I don’t think the story should be a news story anyway as it greatly decreases the chances of her getting anything of a fair investigation, but whatever.
What if it’s a serial rapist? What if they don’t have drinks first?
A rapist is an effing rapist. It doesn’t matter if they knew each other or he pulled her behind a dark alley. I’m not sure why you think one is a worse crime or one man is more dangerous (since rapists like to seek out victims and the pulling behind the dark alley randomly thing isn’t as common), but it’s alarming.
From the little I’ve heard about this case, I would vote that neither name should be released.
It’s not fair to compare this to a child rape situation, IMO. That does not describe this situation at all.
The accuser has some suspect motivation and waited too long to make a report. I hope she was not raped and I hope the accused doesn’t get away with it if she was, but I also don’t think it’s fair for the accused to have his life ruined or even negatively affected by this if it’s false.
I do wonder what possible evidence there could be other than a he said/she said sort of thing.
No; the man “raped” the woman. Same with “statutory rape”*; if two 16 year olds have sex the boy is a vile rapist, the girl a poor Innocent victim who needs counseling. Laws related to sex are generally written with the assumption that males are universally predators, that male sexuality is inherently predatory, and that women & girls are passive, helpless idiots who have neither a sex drive nor will of their own.
A term I hate because it cheapens the real thing and creates disrespect for the law
True, but…assuming the general facts are correct (laws are written with gender bias such that drunken rape results in the charging of the man, not the woman, and statutory rape laws such that 2 equal-aged underaged people will find the male with a police record and the female not)…Assuming that, then he’s not wrong, is he? He’s got his own special style and vehemence, undeniably, but such laws *would *be grossly unfair and suggest exactly the sort of reasoning he purports.
You only have your narrow experience. A lot victims or accusers do not go to crisis centers. My unscientific guess would be that someone going to a crisis center would be more likely to be telling the truth. Unfortunately I have seen a lot of false claims. I can’t guess at a percentage.
Trihs: what state laws are you referring to? In Virginia, there is no reference to sex. And as far as statutory rape is concerned, the older party is the guilty party. In my capacity as a defense attorney for the last six years, I have had three women go to jail or prison for inappropriate relationships with boys. I have had approximately ten male clients go to jail or prison for inappropriate relationships with girls. All of these cases I would describe as an older person taking advantage of a post-pubescent child, where there was a clear imbalance of power.
And how is what I said an “anti woman tirade”? All my criticisms have been aimed at the law, not at women.
I’m not bashing women; I’m just not bashing men and that apparently makes what I said an “anti woman tirade”. Unless I talk about how women are morally superior to men and how men are all awful and the source of all the evil in the world I’m “anti-woman”. It reminds me of how the fundies interpret everything but uncritical praise of Christianity as persecution & a “war on Christianity”, actually.
He has to point out the exact laws for me to comment. Plus his posting history (search “rapes” or “feminism” + his user name) soils the argument unless it’s backed up with reasonable, thoughtful, cited and fair posts.
imho, of course.
edit: Drunken rape: I think that for reasons we’ve pounded on SDMB before, men can be raped by women, but typically are not. Physiology and all.
My narrow experience, is yes, narrow. It consists of: being a teacher and having to report these things when my students tell me, being female, having female friends, working in a crisis center, and, of course, studying whatever data is out there during my post-high school journeys.
How do you know you saw false claims if you didn’t give a percentage?
There may be a girl who says, “He raped me!” but stats come by two ways: hard data from a police or DA department or a survey. To say a man raped you and go to the police is <shudder> a horrible experience.
I was physically assaulted once and the cops acted as though they were pissed I interrupted their morning bagel patrol.
In Virginia, the only way two equally aged children could be accused of raping each other, merely based on age, would be two 12 year olds or younger. In six years I have never seen this kind of case before the court. Maybe our prosecutors are infinitely more reasonable than any where else in the country. I suspect this is just not the case.
The number of cases going to court doesn’t seem to be that high no matter where you are. And it’s not like all those result in guilty verdicts. RAINN graphic (citing credible resources).
Thanks for the clarification, doreen. You are right - ish. But you still can’t rape someone if they don’t give consent. The trick is trying to figure out if she did and how reasonable is it she didn’t. Or did. The likelihood is that he will be go free.
Didn’t the NYPD come under fire for raping a woman and getting away with it? An officer even admitted to fondling and touching her while she was pretty much unconscious.
It might even be the police who are more reasonable. When I worked in CPS, there was a family which was outraged to discover their 14 year old daughter had sex with her 14 year old boyfriend. At the time, it was illegal (not sure if it was rape or sexual abuse ) for anyone to have sex with a 14 year old and there were no allegations of force. They wanted the boyfriend arrested- right up until the police told her that their daughter had committed the same crime as the boyfriend and if he was arrested, she would be as well.
Just like with any crime in which only the victim is a witness there is always difficulty reaching the burden of proof. That is regardless of what crime you are talking about. But if it goes to court or not is not up to the police. Its up to the prosecutor’s office. Where I work any accusation of sexual assault gets immediately reported to the county prosecutor and they are with it every step of the way. Obviously something like this needs the full cooperation of the victim and sometimes they don’t wish to go through with it. Its unfortunate but it happens.
And yes sometimes they were lying. Most often it has happened because they were discovered having sex and tried to make up an excuse. Most often its someone young who doesn’t what their parent to know they were having sex. So they panic and say they were forced. Usually the story does not add up and its pretty obvious from the start. It happens.
The problem is he didn’t admit to doing anything when she was actually unconscious, nor (according to that article and my memory) was there a even a claim that she was actually unconscious.
“So sick that the officers should have called an ambulance” pretty much means she wasn’t unconscious- if that’s what was meant, that’s what they would have said.
yes, I was trying to recall from memory and ended up having to Google it and add in a quick edit link. I said “pretty much unconscious” – which is kind of how I am when I’m that wasted.
The idea that an officer can put his penis inside a woman’s vagina (or any other number of sexual things) while she’s shitfuck wasted and not go to jail is creepy. If, in fact, they had sex. But if she’s so foggy on the details, I think it’s safe to assume that she can’t really consent to the act. <sigh> Fucking law sometimes. I say he’s guilty of sexual assault of some kind in the very least.
Anyway, we went way off the OT, which is expected.
), but I can assure you that very rarely did we feel we had the local PD on our side unless she was bloody, bruised, cute and they had no prior relationship.