# So you think there's no such thing as employment discrimination? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 1, 2022, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511 "2022-06-01T17:06:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/83 "2022-06-03T19:26:20Z")
On my first professional programming job, being one of the young ones, I helped the Operators empty out the card closet. This included the heard about but never seen card sorter, a high-end machine from 1975 or so. As I just helped load it on a cart and heave it into a dumpster. I have no clue how it worked, but I’m sure there is a wiki page on it. And here it is: > **[Punched card sorter](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card_sorter)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > A Punched card sorter is a machine for sorting decks of punched cards. > Sorting was a major activity in most facilities that processed data on punched cards using unit record equipment. The work flow of many processes required decks of cards to be put into some specific order as determined by the data punched in the cards. The same deck might be sorted differently for different processing steps. A popular family of sorters, the IBM 80 series sort... For the record, I entered professional business programming in the time of reel data tapes. In fact I was kind of the expert in converting Ascii to EBCDIC and back going between the IBM AS400 to the Tandem. * * * That reminds me, I ended up with a Tandem terminal, an AS400 terminal and an early PC on my desk. It was a little crazy. I had figured out a way to move data to the PC also. Marketing and Finance loved this. This was back in 1993 & 1994. I was the only combination Cobol, RPG & C programmer on staff and knew Lotus 123 better than any other programmer. I was the triple threat plus. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/84 "2022-06-03T19:54:28Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > For the record, I entered professional business programming in the time of reel data tapes That reminds me. I was working when a person actually had to pull your tape and mount it on the reader. Calling the “back room” to get a rush on that was something I dreaded doing, but it’s why I kept my relations with those folks extremely cordial. I had a supervisor once who loved abusing support staff like that. I often had to go behind her and smooth the waters. Not in my job description! ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/85 "2022-06-03T20:13:36Z")
This discussion about hiring discrimination is riveting. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/86 "2022-06-03T21:55:05Z")
I think everyone is pretty much in agreement that the individual addressed in the o.p. is a misogynistic piece of work who is also probably lying through his teeth in a self-aggrandizing manner to appeal to the ‘wounded male’/crypto-trader/alt-right demographic. I’m not sure what more there is to say about that goon although there is obviously plenty more to say on the topic of hiring discrimination if someone wanted to address it. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/87 "2022-06-03T22:58:11Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > I think everyone is pretty much in agreement that the individual addressed in the o.p. is a misogynistic piece of work who is also probably lying through his teeth in a self-aggrandizing manner to appeal to the ‘wounded male’/crypto-trader/alt-right demographic. And, assuming he had people who reported under him, I’m sure he was shit to work for. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2022, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/88 "2022-06-03T23:30:40Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > And, assuming he had people who reported under him, I’m sure he was shit to work for. I’m pretty sure this guy was in charge of checking header file lists or some similarly stimulating responsibility. I’d be shocked if he actually produced any real production code much less managing a team. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/89 "2022-06-04T06:32:06Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > On my first professional programming job, being one of the young ones, I helped the Operators empty out the card closet. This included the heard about but never seen card sorter, a high-end machine from 1975 or so. The MIT Science Fiction Society Pinkdex (a listing of our holdings) was done on punched cards and was sorted once or twice a year on a standalone card sorter in the MIT Computer Center. I was responsible for this for 2 1/2 years when I was Librarian. Such fun. As for terminals, in 1979 I took a [Silent 700](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silent_700) terminal from TI home from grad school. So slow as to be practically useless, and it used paper. CRT terminals were much too bulky to drag around very much. We were on Multics. When I was at Illinois around 1975 I was able to move my compiler code for a class from cards to a system called PLORTS running on a 370, but that was only available within the computer science building, I think. I used 300 baud and 1200 baud modems, and while you could theoretically program on them, you couldn’t really go through any decent amount of code in reasonable time. You’d wind up going to work to get a listing. Editing at those speeds was real fun also. When I was in high school I wrote code for our LGP-21 at home on a coding form, so I suppose you could do it, but I don’t think you’d be very effective. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/90 "2022-06-04T22:46:12Z")
My experience with punch cards was from my Gap Year (1981-82) as a keypunch operator, and those were rapidly being phased out, in favor of magnetic tape, which was also basically obsolete when I went back to the same company 5 years later as a data entry operator, a job I took in part because they could work around my class schedule. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/91 "2022-06-04T23:19:26Z")
I remember in about 1975 (?) someone telling me their mom told them to learn to be a keypunch operator, because they’d have a job for life. They became a programmer instead. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [June 4, 2022, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511/92 "2022-06-04T23:39:57Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I know several people at Google Without disclosing too much about my own workplace, I _also_ know several people at Google. > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > I’m pretty sure this guy was in charge of checking header file lists or some similarly stimulating responsibility. I’d be shocked if he actually produced any real production code much less managing a team. I have no doubt that this guy did something useful during his tenure at Google. Google doesn’t employ people to do things that a machine could do. He may have even been pleasant to work with. But since his departure he seems to have found himself in a situation where some performative sexism benefits him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/so-you-think-theres-no-such-thing-as-employment-discrimination/965511.md?page=4)