# Soccer - Penalty Kick Shootout Questions **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [February 10, 2015, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326 "2015-02-10T20:04:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/1 "2015-02-10T20:04:20Z")
I was watching the Finals of the Africa Cup of Nations on Sunday, which went to a penalty kick shootout won by the Ivory Coast over Ghana. The shootout was probably the most exciting one that I’ve ever watched. The score was tied 8-8 after all 10 position players had taken their turn. Now it was time for the goalkeepers to shoot. While some goalies can be very good at PK’s, the position players are typically better at them. This appeared to be the case for both teams, as both GK’s were placed last by their teams in the shooting order. The Ghanian GK was the first to attempt a kick. His shot was turned away by the Ivorian GK. After stopping the shot, the Ivorian feigned an injury. It was just a bit of gamesmanship and he eventually got up and nailed the winning shot. But this led to a series of questions from me. What would have happened if the Ivory Coast GK was indeed injured on the play? Would the Ivory Coast have the ability to replace him with another player to take the shot, or would they just forfeit their turn? What happens if the score was still tied after all 11 active players took their turn? Do they then go to the benches, or do the active 11 just go again? What happens if 1 team is down to 10 (or even 9) men because of red cards, and it’s time for the 11th player to go? ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/2 "2015-02-10T20:11:35Z")
They go back through the team again until the deadlock is broken. A game not that long ago went to 16 shots and I started to wonder if they’d bring on the mascots to have a go 😃 ---
**Author:** ![mcgato](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac8455/32.png) [@mcgato](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mcgato)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/3 "2015-02-10T20:18:53Z")
The wiki on [penalty shoot outs](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penalty_shoot-out_%28association_football%29) covers most of those questions. Specifically: Injury to goalkeeper: can replace if they haven’t used all of their substitutes. A bit unclear here, though, as it may just be for goalkeeping side of things, not shooting a PK. Tie after all 11 went: start over with the same players, though the order may change. 1 team down at start of shoot out: other team eliminates enough players to make it even. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/4 "2015-02-10T21:15:31Z")
Officially the laws state: > [@](#): > > If a player is injured or sent off during the taking of kicks from the penalty > mark and the team has one player fewer, the referee should not reduce > the number of players taking kicks for the other team. An equal number of > players from each team is required only at the start of the taking of kicks > from the penalty mark (Page 137 of [this PDF](http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/footballdevelopment/refereeing/02/36/01/11/27_06_2014_new--lawsofthegameweben_neutral.pdf)) Which utterly fails to answer the question. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/5 "2015-02-10T21:27:48Z")
A bit more research on The Guardian’s “You are the ref” series, where they pose questions to referees, shows two questions, one related to a sending off during a shootout and the other to an injury. It seems that another player can be nominated to take the shot, but it is possible that this can only be from players that have already taken a shot. This does, however, beg the question of what happens if it is the first player that gets injured. > **[You are the Ref: Terry Connor, Wolves](https://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/mar/01/you-are-the-ref-trevillion)** > > Starring: A confusing trip, a missing coin and a highly suspicious punch > **[You are the Ref: Paul Robinson, Blackburn](https://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/apr/22/ref-trevillion-hackett-paul-robinson)** > > Starring: A dodgy hamstring, a hand on the line, and a rookie keeper fluffing his kick ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/6 "2015-02-10T21:34:33Z")
And I think this one is the definitive answer: > **[You are the Ref, Paul Trevillion, Keith Hackett](https://www.theguardian.com/football/2008/aug/12/youaretheref1)** > > Starring: Hernan Crespo, a waterlogged notebook, and a disaffected maverick with a grudge. > [@](#): > > You must always award the player the benefit of any doubt and accept he is authentically injured. In this case the player has been suffering from cramp during extra time and could quite possibly have broken down completely. The injured player can be excused from taking penalties, but he may not be replaced by another player. The next penalty will be taken by a player who has already taken a kick. ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/7 "2015-02-10T21:42:48Z")
Here are the actual rules, taken from the current FIFA rulebook: 1. The referee chooses the goal at which the kicks will be taken 2. The referee tosses a coin and the team whose captain wins the toss decides whether to take the first or the second kick 3. The referee keeps a record of the kicks being taken 4. Subject to the conditions explained below, both teams take five kicks 5. The kicks are taken alternately by the teams 6. If, before both teams have taken five kicks, one has scored more goals than the other could score, even if it were to complete its five kicks, no more kicks are taken 7. If, after both teams have taken five kicks, both have scored the same number of goals, or have not scored any goals, kicks continue to be taken in the same order until one team has scored a goal more than the other from the same number of kicks 8. A goalkeeper who is injured while kicks are being taken from the penalty mark and is unable to continue as goalkeeper may be replaced by a named substitute provided his team has not used the maximum number of substitutes permitted under the competition rules 9. With the exception of the foregoing case, only players who are on the field of play at the end of the match, which includes extra time where appropriate, are eligible to take kicks from the penalty mark 10. Each kick is taken by a different player and all eligible players must take a kick before any player can take a second kick 11. An eligible player may change places with the goalkeeper at any time when kicks from the penalty mark are being taken 12. Only the eligible players and match offi cials are permitted to remain on the field of play when kicks from the penalty mark are being taken 13. All players, except the player taking the kick and the two goalkeepers, must remain within the centre circle 14. The goalkeeper who is the team-mate of the kicker must remain on the field of play, outside the penalty area in which the kicks are being taken, on the goal line where it meets the penalty area boundary line ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2015, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/8 "2015-02-10T22:43:45Z")
Also a field player would have had to take the GKs position in goal (If all the subs were used up). If he were faking an injury to allow a ‘real’ player to take the final shot…that’s taking a slight chance. ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2015, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/9 "2015-02-11T00:19:28Z")
While it’s obviously not ethical, it looks like there are ways to game the system. For example, if you only trust 9 players to take penalties, why not have the other 2 pick up red cards right at the final whistle? Easiest way is to have them get into a fight with each other. ---
**Author:** ![blue\_infinity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_infinity/32/2817_2.png) [@blue\_infinity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blue_infinity)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2015, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/10 "2015-02-11T06:58:52Z")
> [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](#): > > why not have the other 2 pick up red cards right at the final whistle? A red card means you miss the next match (or more). ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2015, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soccer-penalty-kick-shootout-questions/712326/11 "2015-02-11T11:53:30Z")
> [@blue\_infinity](#): > > A red card means you miss the next match (or more). Right, but if it’s the final of the World Cup or Champions League, some might make that sacrifice.