# Society changing into a Rental Society **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 18, 2015, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809 "2015-06-18T00:33:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![phreesh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9fc29f/32.png) [@phreesh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phreesh)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/81 "2015-06-18T18:32:12Z")
I had to double-check to see if this was a zombie thread. What everyone is describing is the ‘sharing economy’. The internet has done a great deal to facilitate this. There are many, many examples of this, including the below list: Movies - Netflix Music - Spotify Cars - Car2Go/Uber Hotel Rooms - AirBnB Errands - Task Rabbit Finance - Lending Club/Kickstarter Buying/selling - eBay/Kijiji/Craigslist Tools - Tool library Toys - Toystrunk It’s makes a ton of economic sense. You avoid the upfront purchase costs that can be a barrier for people with limited resources. You need thousands to purchase a car. You need hundreds buy serious tools. Avoid that by renting. Anything that requires financing means that you are paying extra just to get the money to fund the upfront costs of purchase. That is economically wasteful. You also only pay for your use. I read that the average drill is used for 15 minutes in its life. I used to spend $20 per compact disk that I listened to for maybe 20 hours. That’s a lot of money for limited use. With movie/music ‘rental’ via a streaming service I pay maybe $10/month and get to consume as much music/movies/TV as I want. That’s good value for use. Renting is also (generally) convenient. Streaming is easy. I’m seconds away from millions of hours of movies/TV/music. A big barrier to the sharing economy that used to exist was trust. You never knew how trustworthy the counterparty was. Now, there are all sorts of tools to ferret out the trustworthiness of your counterparty - primarily through some sort of rating from former customers or other methods. Another barrier that has been reduced is the digitization of our lives. The idea of having bookshelves full of CDs/books/DVDs is now kind of silly. You can now have all that on a hard drive somewhere. Owning all that stuff just doesn’t make sense. Anyway, this is here to stay. And for good reason Good article on this in the economist: > **[The rise of the sharing economy](https://www.economist.com/leaders/2013/03/09/the-rise-of-the-sharing-economy)** > > On the internet, everything is for hire ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/82 "2015-06-18T18:39:58Z")
I just want to say I fully support the right of any generation of people to bitch about any other generation of people, whether older or younger. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/83 "2015-06-18T19:06:53Z")
I think sentimentality has a tendency to be more of a vice than a virtue. People who get so attached to their possessions tend to be the kind of people who won’t pick up and move to find a better job or escape a crappy situation. That mentality might have been tolerable in a more idyllic era. But that era isn’t now, especially if you’re young and trying to get your career off the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Wiggler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/red_wiggler/32/13190_2.png) [@Red\_Wiggler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Wiggler)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/84 "2015-06-18T19:31:05Z")
> [@phreesh](#): > > Good article on this in the economist: > [The rise of the sharing economy](http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21573104-internet-everything-hire-rise-sharing-economy) Good link, one of those articles that really gets me to thinking about coming change. The Millennials are a really interesting bunch to me; they seem both more individualistic and more collaborative at the same time. I don’t think they’ll stop at sharing cars and bedrooms, either. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/85 "2015-06-18T20:54:03Z")
The sticking point is when something transitions from being a true sharing society thing to a way of evading regulations put into place for a reason. Uber as a better ride sharing board, the kind you see in a college, is great. Uber today is trying to sign up full time drivers and not paying benefits or covering liability, except as a last resort. Not so great. AirBnB, which I love, started as a way of making money off of spare rooms and couches. However all the places we’ve stayed are pretty much 100% AirBnB, and is a way of opening up a small hotel without the overhead. Some books I’m happy to borrow. Most I want to have, especially because I collect old books and magazines. However I have no desire to own DVDs except in some very rare cases, so it is Netflix for me. It all depends on your circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/86 "2015-06-18T21:15:25Z")
We unfortunately see a lot of the same mentality in corporations. Sell off valuable assets and then lease them back, costing them far more in the long run, but due to accounting magic, somehow coming out ahead. ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/87 "2015-06-18T21:33:34Z")
Thanks for your responses Yes, I spent a large amount of time in the library when I was younger and yes, now a lot of that can be found on the computer which negates the usage of the library. Interesting that many people in the big cities would rather borrow or rent a car rather than own one for themselves and then use the rental I was wrongly associating the zip cars with communism. Not all places have bus service and then there is the entire cost of the bus service which is typically subsidized by the government. Yes, I know what you mean by this specialization that seems to be becoming more popular Looks like I really got a lot of people going which means that I must have touched a nerve for many people and fyi I am part of gen X. Thanks ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/88 "2015-06-18T22:32:03Z")
> [@zweisamkeit](#): > > **Anaamika** , **monstro** ’s reply to you pretty much says what I was going to reply with. I like you, but I just think you’re off base here: > > … no shit? 😛 🙂 > I’m one of the older Millennials. I don’t think that everything “older generations” did is teh dumb and obviously I know soooo much better than they do. > > But this OP is just one in a long, looooong series of bitchy snipes at Millennials and I’m seriously fed up. I particularly love the irony when I read (self-described) Gen-Xers\* rant about clueless and selfish Millennials… saying _the exact same shit that was said about them in the early/mid 1990s_. > > Newspaper columns, blog posts, random commenters or posters, talking heads on TV and random conversations you’re part of or overhear in person. Over and over hearing how we all feel entitled, are stupid, are lazy, don’t know what we’re doing, we think we’re speshul snoflaykes,\*\* we grew up with the “everyone gets a trophy!” mindset,\*\* any shift in cultural values (like renting instead of buying or not caring as much about getting your driver’s license and your own car asap as a teen, to give a couple examples from this board) is inexplicable and OBVIOUSLY completely moronic and ignorant and further proof of what utter failures we are. Our struggles to find jobs or careers and our higher proportion of people living with their parents or renting as a result can’t be related to the gigantic shit that was (is) the Great Recession and truly fundamental changes that mean it really isn’t like “how it was when [hypothetical you/they] was a kid”.\*\*\* Nope, it’s just further evidence of how stupid and shitty we are and that we can’t do anything right. > So, yeah. That’s why at least some of us are bitching right back. > > - this isn’t including you, just want to be clear. This is background context to explain why at least this particular Millennial replied as bitchily as she did. > \*\* which have never been universal or widespread anyway (hello, media’s focus on upper middle class+ white people!), but even if they WERE… Why should WE get the scorn and derision when our parents would be the ones who did this shit? > \*\*\* having a college degree doesn’t “guarantee” you a job, outsourcing most labor and manufacturing offshores, hiring more internationally via H1Bs, college tuition skyrocketing, etc etc etc. I was not intending to bitch at Millennial but it certainly took its toll. Yes, a lot of Millennials are extremely hardworking people. That was not my point. What I was pointing out is that the typical Millennial is far more likely to rent stuff rather than own it as the previous generations did, This change is going to be something that a lot of the previous generations (including myself) is going to have to deal with. Thanks for your comments ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/89 "2015-06-18T22:37:10Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > I think sentimentality has a tendency to be more of a vice than a virtue. People who get so attached to their possessions tend to be the kind of people who won’t pick up and move to find a better job or escape a crappy situation. That mentality might have been tolerable in a more idyllic era. But that era isn’t now, especially if you’re young and trying to get your career off the ground. A lot of people don’t want to move because they are happy where they are and have family and friends locally not to mention the schooling for their children. Believe me, it is not easy to pack up an entire family and move across the country in search for a more suitable job or better situation Have you ever heard the term “The grass is greener on the other side of the fence” ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/90 "2015-06-18T22:42:07Z")
> [@lazybratsche](#): > > If Zipcar is communist, I can’t even conceive of how the OP would view _public transportation_, or a city where a substantial fraction of the affluent and the middle-aged _prefer to ride the bus or the subway_ than commute by car. Not all places have public transportation and you are restricted to where the busses or subway can go. Not to mention that in most places the public transportation is subsidized. ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/91 "2015-06-18T22:46:35Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > It’s ok, 600,000 other folks seem to like it just fine. > > And honestly, I don’t think you’d fit in very well if Zipcar reminds you of communism. Been to Boston ONCE and have a cousin that lives there. Nice city and the surrounding area but too expensive for my tastes and too much snow in the winter (and this is coming from a Canadian) In my opinion, it is a better city than New York although ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/92 "2015-06-18T22:48:34Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > People who get so attached to their possessions tend to be the kind of people who won’t pick up and move to find a better job or escape a crappy situation. There are many reasons that relocation can be an undesirable choice, and a mountain of possessions is not one of the important ones. Some people are naturally more rooted than others. For every under-30 who can barely stay in one place for five minutes and thinks nothing of jumping 2000 miles for a job they know will only be short-term, there are probably a multiple who prize roots in a community or place enough not to abandon their baggage every time the wind shifts. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/93 "2015-06-18T22:51:15Z")
> [@even\_sven](#): > > It’s called specialization, and it’s old as dirt. No, this is different from specialization. While specialization is inevitable as economies grow in size and complexity, what we’re seeing now is a shift from greater ownership of assets by their users to concentrated ownership combined with short-term leases or licensing models to users. That you live in a house you didn’t build, listen to music you didn’t record, and use software you didn’t write isn’t surprising, but the fact that you are more likely to rent that house than own it, listen to music on Spotify than buy CDs, and pay a monthly fee for that software as a service rather than buy a CD-ROM is new. Perhaps soon you’ll subscribe to a wardrobe service, so you can always have new and well-maintained clothes to wear. I tend to believe that for the depreciating assets like cars or music collections, this is almost certainly a positive development. But it does worry me to concentrate ownership of appreciating real estate, since that has long been one of the few large assets that has been widely owned and has long representing a very large fraction of the net savings of most Americans. We’re clearly not at problems levels, since we still have 1990 levels of home ownership, but the trend is the opposite direction from then, so it makes sense to worry about it now even if we didn’t worry about it then. ---
**Author:** ![Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/do_not_taunt/32/2968_2.png) [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Do_Not_Taunt)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/94 "2015-06-18T22:52:53Z")
> [@ssgenius](#): > > Not to mention that in most places the public transportation is subsidized. I’m not sure the relevance of this, but if you’re going to throw it out there, it’s worth pointing out that private transportation is also subsidized: roads, highways, free parking in many places… ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/95 "2015-06-18T23:03:33Z")
I do feel sorry for these millennials as the costs have increased over the years To give you an example University tuition was $1000 - $1500 per year (1986-1991) First apartment was $280 / month (1991) Second apartment was $450/month (1996) First house was $108 000 in 1997 Second house was $92 000 (I went smaller) in 1999 Current house was $190 000 (paid off in 2011) in 2005 Compare those to prices these days and the current generation is paying a lot more for the same thing ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/96 "2015-06-18T23:04:20Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > We’re clearly not at problems levels, since we still have 1990 levels of home ownership, but the trend is the opposite direction from then, so it makes sense to worry about it now even if we didn’t worry about it then. I think you have to entirely discount the 2001-7 housing boom. It was not just artificially inflated, but possibly artificial in other respects as well. It was a perfect storm of several powerful industries seeing an opportunity to spin gold from dreams of homeowning. Billions upon billions in wealth were created almost literally out of the thin air over housing development lots. I haven’t done the specific homework, but I suspect that if you extrapolate using more grounded and linear assumptions, we are not in any particularly down time as far as home ownership levels go. ---
**Author:** ![ssgenius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@ssgenius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ssgenius)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/97 "2015-06-18T23:07:05Z")
> [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > I’m not sure the relevance of this, but if you’re going to throw it out there, it’s worth pointing out that private transportation is also subsidized: roads, highways, free parking in many places… Good point on that but without considering that infrastructure, public transportation is still more subsidized Thanks ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/98 "2015-06-18T23:23:53Z")
> [@ssgenius](#): > > In my opinion, it is a better city than New York although Them is fighting words. Pistols at dawn. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2015, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/99 "2015-06-18T23:39:55Z")
> [@ssgenius](#): > > Not all places have bus service and then there is the entire cost of the bus service which is typically subsidized by the government. > [@ssgenius](#): > > Not to mention that in most places the public transportation is subsidized. > [@Do\_Not\_Taunt](#): > > I’m not sure the relevance of this, but if you’re going to throw it out there, it’s worth pointing out that private transportation is also subsidized: roads, highways, free parking in many places… Yes, and that is an example of how government/public/subsidization activities increase _everyone’s_ wealth. Subsidizing transportation reduces costs for everyone. It makes cities more livable and pleasant for everyone. It saves everyone time. It lets people live healthier lives. It lets people more time (to care for their children, to engage in charity, to engage in creative work or entrepreneurship). It makes services cheaper. The same thing is true for subsidized education, subsidized child care, subsidized health care, and all kinds of other things. A world in which everyone around you is more secure, more healthy, more happy, etc., is a world in which _you_ are more secure, more healthy, more happy, etc. Looking at a subsidy solely as an expense ignores the fact that it makes living cheaper for everyone and makes everyone wealthier. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2015, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809/100 "2015-06-19T00:04:22Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > “Renting” books, newspapers, magazines, etc. has long been a function of an institution known as a “library”, which I’ve been visiting nearly 50 years now, and you can borrow more stuff from them these days than ever before. But, again, I choose to purchase a subset of what I read because I know I’ll return to it in the future. But libraries are free. > [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](#): > > A lot of people rent software like Microsoft Office or Adobe Creative Cloud now. You pay a monthly fee forever instead of buying a license once. You get to upgrade whenever new versions are released as long as you continue paying your monthly rental fee. I didn’t know about Office but I knew about Adobe. That was designed to prevent piracy though, it wasn’t because anyone wanted it. The [Adobe Creative Cloud](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Creative_Cloud#Reception) wiki page contains phrases like “was met with significant criticism” “caused disagreement and uncertainty” “incited annoyance and conflict” “the negative reaction across segments of Adobe’s user base was swift” “caused an unprecedented loss of trust in Adobe as a company.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/society-changing-into-a-rental-society/722809.md?page=6)