# Some details of Obama's Iran deal come out **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 22, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001 "2017-04-22T17:01:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/1 "2017-04-22T17:01:04Z")
Wow. It’s not even “we will see it after we sign it”. It’s “we sign it, but we will never see it”. > **[Opinion | Obama’s secret Iran deals exposed](https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/obamas-secret-iran-deals-exposed/2015/07/27/26d14dbc-3460-11e5-8e66-07b4603ec92a_story.html?utm_term=.02560b69c9df)** > > His verification system is based on trusting Iran. " In an interview, Pompeo told me that he and Cotton were meeting with the deputy director of the IAEA and the agency’s two top Iran negotiators just days after the nuclear accord was announced, when they asked how the agency will carry out verification at the Iranian military complex at Parchin. IAEA officials told them, quite casually, that the details were all covered in agreements negotiated between the IAEA and the Iranian government. It was the first they had heard of the side deals. ``` Pompeo says they asked whether they could see those agreements. He says IAEA officials replied, “ ‘Oh no, of course not, no, you’re not going to get to see those.’ And so everybody on our side of the table asked, ‘Has Secretary Kerry seen these?’ ‘No, Secretary Kerry hasn’t seen them. No American is ever going to get to see them.’ ” ``` ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/2 "2017-04-22T17:24:03Z")
Why are you just now reading and quoting from an opinion piece from 2015? I guess you mean “some details came out two years ago”? Here’s [an article](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/329425-trump-admin-iran-in-compliance-but-nuclear-deal-under-review) from a few days ago: > [@](#): > > The State Department informed Congress Tuesday that Iran is in compliance with the nuclear deal and that the United States will continue its ease of sanctions under the agreement. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/3 "2017-04-22T17:26:00Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/4 "2017-04-22T17:33:00Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Why are you just now reading and quoting from an opinion piece from 2015? > > I guess you mean “some details came out two years ago”? Here’s [an article](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/329425-trump-admin-iran-in-compliance-but-nuclear-deal-under-review) from a few days ago: Didn’t notice the date. It just amazed me to see it. This was mentioned in the article that talked about the Iranian Foreign Minister pointing out (in response to Tillerson’s words) that US is obligated, by the accords (not sure if that came out of the secret part of them or not) not to have senior US officials ever publicly criticize them. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/5 "2017-04-22T17:45:15Z")
Do you think the IAEA is stupid? They are the ones that discovered that North Korea was creating plutonium in the mid-1990s, under a so-called “side deal” just like this. The independence of the IAEA is needed so that they will have access to what they need to do to do their work. It’s a shame that so few people seem to recognize this basic idea. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/6 "2017-04-22T17:48:38Z")
Sources say Donald Trump set to announce a bid for 2016 Republican presidential nomination Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/7 "2017-04-22T17:53:13Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Do you think the IAEA is stupid? They are the ones that discovered that North Korea was creating plutonium in the mid-1990s, under a so-called “side deal” just like this. > > The independence of the IAEA is needed so that they will have access to what they need to do to do their work. It’s a shame that so few people seem to recognize this basic idea. “Independence” does not equal “secret agreements that the other parties are not allowed to see”. ---
**Author:** ![igor\_frankensteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/839c29/32.png) [@igor\_frankensteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igor_frankensteen)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/8 "2017-04-22T18:10:16Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > “Independence” does not equal “secret agreements that the other parties are not allowed to see”. Actually, you are wrong, especially because you clearly want to misinterpret what was said, just as some other people want to do. What we are not permitted to see, are the exact details of how the inspectors will go about doing their job, because those have nothing to do with the overall agreement. This is akin to the way that people marry publicly, but aren’t required to expose the details of how the maintain their marriage to everyone else. Except if they are a WWE star, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/9 "2017-04-22T18:21:30Z")
> [@igor\_frankensteen](#): > > What we are not permitted to see, are the exact details of how the inspectors will go about doing their job, because those have nothing to do with the overall agreement. The methods of inspections have nothing to do with the overall agreement? I beg to differ. I think it is entirely relevant to the agreement to know how the inspections are carried out. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/10 "2017-04-22T18:56:13Z")
I hacked past the [IAEA](https://www.iaea.org/newscenter/focus/iran) firewall for you so you could [take a look and sleep better at night](https://www.iaea.org/newscenter/news/new-iaea-uranium-enrichment-monitor-verify-iran%E2%80%99s-commitments-under-jcpoa). ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/11 "2017-04-22T19:00:31Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > “Independence” does not equal “secret agreements that the other parties are not allowed to see”. So for the past 60 years, you’ve decided the IAEA has been doing it wrong. What’s the source of your expertise here, exactly? A two-year old news article written by two of the most extreme partisans in DC? ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/12 "2017-04-22T20:24:08Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > So for the past 60 years, you’ve decided the IAEA has been doing it wrong. What’s the source of your expertise here, exactly? A two-year old news article written by two of the most extreme partisans in DC? Published in the ‘Opinions’ section of the Post, no less. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/13 "2017-04-22T20:48:49Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > “Independence” does not equal “secret agreements that the other parties are not allowed to see”. Isn’t that pretty much exactly what “independence” means? ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/14 "2017-04-22T20:51:56Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Isn’t that pretty much exactly what “independence” means? Not even remotely. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/15 "2017-04-22T20:58:32Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > Not even remotely. What’s your definition, that they can do what they want as long as we approve of it? ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/16 "2017-04-22T21:38:02Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > What’s your definition, that they can do what they want as long as we approve of it? They do what they do, but we know what they do, and how they do it. That does not detract from “independent”. And yes, if we don’t approve of how they do it, we do not base a nuclear agreement on it. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [April 22, 2017, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/17 "2017-04-22T23:18:00Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > They do what they do, but we know what they do, and how they do it. That does not detract from “independent”. > > And yes, **if we don’t approve of how they do it** , we do not base a nuclear agreement on it. Which essentially gives you a veto over how they do their jobs, which means _they’re not independent_. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/18 "2017-04-23T00:03:54Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > They do what they do, but we know what they do, and how they do it. That does not detract from “independent”. When I moved out of my parents’ house, they didn’t get to tell the police how to enforce laws against any of my behavior. The police just did their job because they were professionals. That whole “police don’t have to listen to kids’ parents” is what make the kids, and the police, independent. ---
**Author:** ![Okrahoma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90db22/32.png) [@Okrahoma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Okrahoma)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/19 "2017-04-23T00:32:06Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > When I moved out of my parents’ house, they didn’t get to tell the police how to enforce laws against any of my behavior. The police just did their job because they were professionals. That whole “police don’t have to listen to kids’ parents” is what make the kids, and the police, independent. Bad analogy. There is a difference between telling the police how to enforce laws and having the knowledge about police methods of enforcing the laws. We have no idea what methods are used to inspect Iran. They agreement may just be “Iranians tell us what they have in there and we believe them”. We don’t know. “No American is ever going” to know. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2017, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001/20 "2017-04-23T01:21:28Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > Bad analogy. > > There is a difference between telling the police how to enforce laws and having the knowledge about police methods of enforcing the laws. > > We have no idea what methods are used to inspect Iran. They agreement may just be “Iranians tell us what they have in there and we believe them”. We don’t know. “No American is ever going” to know. I provided you links that talk about methods used by IAEA. Did you even bother reading them? Or are you just going to ignore them and continue to plead guileless ignorance? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-details-of-obamas-iran-deal-come-out/785001.md?page=2)