# Some suggestions regarding the situation around George Floyd's death. Are these ideas simplistic? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 29, 2020, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661 "2020-05-29T12:57:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/41 "2020-05-30T11:55:03Z")
On the website Medium: [“75 Things White People Can Do For Racial Justice”](https://medium.com/equality-includes-you/what-white-people-can-do-for-racial-justice-f2d18b0e0234). Many of the above posts presume that cops are somehow above the common prejudices of their communities. The opposite is true. In reality, they embody those prejudices. They get paid to enforce those prejudices. As long as white people are terrified of black men, police will be beating them up and killing black men just for existing. Changing the white culture is the only way real change will come to the police. ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/42 "2020-05-30T12:49:20Z")
My opinion is that the “tragedy that led to the rioting” is that the police officer murdered a man. He’s now under arrest and will receive due process in court because we’re a society of laws, not vigilantism and mob rule. That human life is more important than property doesn’t mean that property is not important and that we shouldn’t arrest and throw the book at everyone that’s vandalizing, setting fires, blocking traffic, assaulting, or is out after curfew as well as anyone that commits a murder. ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/43 "2020-05-30T12:52:02Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > Some folks tried that, and the President himself demanded that they be blackballed from their profession for protesting. Let me rephrase that. You can protest if you do it not on company time and not on company property. I don’t think I’d be working too long if I started a protest in favor of 2nd amendment rights in the insurance company office after the morning coffee break. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/44 "2020-05-30T14:03:13Z")
> [@](#): > > He’s now under arrest and will receive due process in court because we’re a society of laws, not vigilantism and mob rule Except in the view of at least a number of the most angry protesters it is not just the death of one black man, its the deaths of many, and due process only appears to happen when there is video footage and large scale protests - otherwise it is unseen and the ‘law’ does not apply. Short of fatalities its also the stop and search, the feeling of intimidation when approached by white police officers for any simple inquiry through to a routine traffic stop. Those protesters simply feel that whatever law there is, it does not mean they are the beneficiaries of it, quite the reverse, for some the law is nothing but a form of repression that reinforces their social inequality. That is the hurdle that has to be crossed - how do you instill confidence in a police that gets flagged up on social media and anecdote that amplifies the authoritarian aspect and completely ignores the service aspect where police help the public out, all of them. Good news is never broadcast - bad news is like a bad smell, it follows and sticks to you. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/45 "2020-05-30T14:22:17Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > And: If the community has many minority people, it should be straightforward to put many minority people on the police force. There are many big city police forces with substantial minority people on the force. I do not know that they are better when it comes to racial profiling and how they treat minority communities. I would think Minneapolis would have a substantial number of minorities on the police force but I do not know their makeup. If they have a diverse police force it has not helped in Minneapolis: > [@](#): > > African-Americans account for about 20 percent of the city’s population, but they are more likely to be pulled over, arrested and have force used against them than white residents, Police Department data shows. And black people accounted for more than 60 percent of the victims in Minneapolis police shootings from late 2009 through May 2019, data shows. > > SOURCE: [https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/27/us/minneapolis-police.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/05/27/us/minneapolis-police.html) ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/46 "2020-05-30T15:21:02Z")
> [@Mdcastle](#): > > My opinion is that the “tragedy that led to the rioting” is that the police officer murdered a man. He’s now under arrest and will receive due process in court because we’re a society of laws, not vigilantism and mob rule. And my opinion on what led to the arrest was the threat of vigilantism and mob rule. It’s nice that the wheels of justice have been kicked into motion, but it would be even better if they didn’t have to be. > [@](#): > > That human life is more important than property doesn’t mean that property is not important and that we shouldn’t arrest and throw the book at everyone that’s vandalizing, setting fires, blocking traffic, assaulting, or is out after curfew as well as anyone that commits a murder. Sure, if your desire is to further oppress the population that is demonstrating that it is tired of being oppressed. I agree entirely on violence and murder, and that includes arson. Pure property damage or theft, OTOH, is simply the price a society should expect to pay for oppressing its people. > [@Mdcastle](#): > > Let me rephrase that. You can protest if you do it not on company time and not on company property. I don’t think I’d be working too long if I started a protest in favor of 2nd amendment rights in the insurance company office after the morning coffee break. So, let’s say your company has everyone stand for the pledge of allegiance every morning before work, do you think that you doing no more than sitting for the pledge because you are upset about something going on in your country should be grounds for dismissal? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/47 "2020-05-30T15:26:02Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > That is the hurdle that has to be crossed - how do you instill confidence in a police that gets flagged up on social media and anecdote that amplifies the authoritarian aspect and completely ignores the service aspect where police help the public out, all of them. Good news is never broadcast - bad news is like a bad smell, it follows and sticks to you. That’s easy. You discipline and fire any police officer who abuses their authority. You make it known that it will not be tolerated, and that citizen complaints will be taken seriously and investigated. Any death or serious injury of anyone due to being in custody or contact with law enforcement will be investigated fully by those who have an interest in getting justice for victims of violence, rather than by those who have an interest in covering the crimes of their peers. Put the interests of the community that is served above the interests of the individual police who “serve” them. Knowing the solution is easy. Getting people to go along with it may be a bit harder. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/48 "2020-05-30T15:44:08Z")
From a CBS news station: > [@](#): > > John Harrington, commissioner of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety, says officials have intel that may point to agitators — including white supremacist groups and drug cartels — possibly playing a role in the anarchy. > [@Mdcastle](#): > > My opinion is that the “tragedy that led to the rioting” is that the police officer murdered a man. He’s now under arrest and will receive due process in court because we’re a society of laws, not vigilantism and mob rule. > > That human life is more important than property doesn’t mean that property is not important and that we shouldn’t arrest and throw the book at everyone that’s vandalizing, setting fires, blocking traffic, assaulting, or is out after curfew as well as anyone that commits a murder. As **k9bfriender** points out “And my opinion on what led to the arrest was the threat of vigilantism and mob rule.” It’s good to hear you speak out against murder, **Mdcastle**. But this latest post, like the one I quoted earlier, makes your priority clear. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/49 "2020-05-30T16:54:18Z")
> [@Mdcastle](#): > > Let me rephrase that. You can protest if you do it not on company time and not on company property. I don’t think I’d be working too long if I started a protest in favor of 2nd amendment rights in the insurance company office after the morning coffee break. And this is the President’s concern… how? Understand… An American Citizen protested the American Government, and the President demanded he be forced into silence. This isn’t an employer/employee conversation, it’s the boldest attack on the First Amendment I’ve ever seen, and millions of supposedly patriotic Americans were cool with it, because it was a white man telling a black man to shut up. ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/50 "2020-05-30T18:45:45Z")
> [@split\_p\_j](#): > > This was personal, they worked as bouncers in the same place. Yeah, who saw _that_ coming? > **[Former club owner: Officer Chauvin and George Floyd once worked together](https://www.fox9.com/video/689319)** > > A former Minneapolis club owner reflects on her experiences working with both Officer Chauvin and George Floyd, both of whom worked at her establishment at the same time. It sounds like Chauvin (and other police) stayed outside, while non-police like George Floyd worked inside. See 5:45 point in that interview: they worked for the same boss but didn’t probably know each other. Very interesting interview. ---
**Author:** ![split\_p\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@split\_p\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/split_p_j)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/51 "2020-05-30T18:48:03Z")
Bullshit, you really think they worked at the same spot and didn’t know each other? ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/52 "2020-05-30T18:57:03Z")
> [@split\_p\_j](#): > > Bullshit, you really think they worked at the same spot and didn’t know each other? I’d be surprised if they didn’t recognize each other as employees of the same place but that (so far) seems to be about it. I work in a hi-rise and there are couple dozen people I recognize as I pass them often enough walking through the building but I do not know them at all. Beyond that we know of no other interactions between the two. Maybe there was but, as of now, there is no indication of that at all. tl;dr I would not read too much in to this unless more info comes out. As is…coincidence. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/53 "2020-05-30T18:57:50Z")
> [@split\_p\_j](#): > > Bullshit, you really think they worked at the same spot and didn’t know each other? I heard that interview, too, and the club owner said that the outside and inside security people rarely interacted. They might have “known” each other by sight, but it’s not impossible they didn’t really “know” each other. ---
**Author:** ![split\_p\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@split\_p\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/split_p_j)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/54 "2020-05-30T18:59:08Z")
My guess is that they were both into some dirty shit, either with the cops or as competition to them. We know for sure the deceased was, although that crime shouldn’t be a death sentence. The cop was know bad with multiple complaints against him. He was a gangster not a peace officer. I think what we are seeing is a hit for personal reasons and everyone is using this to further their onw agendas. ---
**Author:** ![split\_p\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@split\_p\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/split_p_j)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/55 "2020-05-30T19:02:28Z")
We are not talking about a huge place where the both worked. This would be called a clue in any real investigation. Yes, I’m black and a son of a black detective. This one is a no brainer ---
**Author:** ![split\_p\_j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e19b73/32.png) [@split\_p\_j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/split_p_j)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/56 "2020-05-30T19:07:30Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > I’d be surprised if they didn’t recognize each other as employees of the same place but that (so far) seems to be about it. I work in a hi-rise and there are couple dozen people I recognize as I pass them often enough walking through the building but I do not know them at all. > > Beyond that we know of no other interactions between the two. Maybe there was but, as of now, there is no indication of that at all. > > tl;dr I would not read too much in to this unless more info comes out. As is…coincidence. Yes of course everything is just a coincidence ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/57 "2020-05-30T19:13:39Z")
> [@split\_p\_j](#): > > Yes of course everything is just a coincidence Until you have evidence to the contrary then yeah…it is. Time will tell on this. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/58 "2020-05-30T19:19:37Z")
> [@split\_p\_j](#): > > My guess is that they were both into some dirty shit, either with the cops or as competition to them. We know for sure the deceased was, although that crime shouldn’t be a death sentence. The cop was know bad with multiple complaints against him. He was a gangster not a peace officer. I think what we are seeing is a hit for personal reasons and everyone is using this to further their onw agendas. How do you know that the deceased was “into some dirty shit”? At the very worst, he knowingly tried to pass a fake $20 to buy some cigarettes. It is entirely possible that he didn’t know it was fake, and not having seen the bill, I don’t even know if it actually was fake or if the cashier simply thought it was. If it was a hit, even an idiot wouldn’t do it in broad daylight with cameras on them. I think it was exactly as it looks, the cop wanted to assert his dominance and had a sociopathic desire to inflict pain and humiliation on others. This is not the first time that he has abused his authority in this manner, it’s just the first time that he did so on camera. He didn’t mean to kill him, just to harm and dehumanize. That doesn’t make it all that much better, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/59 "2020-05-30T19:21:08Z")
Bullshit? I was surprised at some of the things she was willing to discuss. At the beginning of the interview she says some things about the cop that are not at all friendly to his cause, so to speak. He sounds like he was a bully when he worked for her and she told him so. She said he was in a zone, didn’t have any reason, and she’d seen it before, and he’d gone too far but he’d make excuses. So she hardly gave him a pass. Is she out to get the cop? If so, she probably wouldn’t have said that they didn’t recognize each other on that fateful day. Let the public think it was murder for an old grudge or whatever. But she didn’t link them together as friends, enemies, or anything at all. I think she’s telling the truth. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2020, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661/60 "2020-05-30T19:23:20Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > Except in the view of at least a number of the most angry protesters it is not just the death of one black man, its the deaths of many, and due process only appears to happen when there is video footage and large scale protests - otherwise it is unseen and the ‘law’ does not apply. > … However, protests dont do anything productive unless it is in the cause of getting a more are less specific thing accomplished. So, a protest to see that the cop gets arrested and charged can have a productive outcome. Protests “just because” even if the cause is worthwhile\*- can’t accomplish much. And since the Black blok anarchists and some looters will show up hoping to turn the peaceful protest into violence, mass protests that have no specific goal will just mean violence. - I mean, yes we’d all love a end to racism. But I dont see how a protest can do that. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/some-suggestions-regarding-the-situation-around-george-floyds-death-are-these-ideas-simplistic/854661.md?page=4)