# Something that always bothered me about the X-Men **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 27, 2018, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834 "2018-06-27T13:42:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/21 "2018-06-27T18:03:40Z")
Yeah, at times it doesn’t really make sense. Take the mutant Elixir(who has gold skin and the mutant power to heal others) for example. I’m trying to imagine a scenario where he would be discriminated against: Crowd of anti-mutant bigots: “He’s got gold skin. He’s a mutant. Let’s kill him.” Elixir: “I have the mutant power to heal you and everyone else.” Crowd: “He can heal us of all our chronic medical problems. Let’s kill him.” Yeah I just don’t see that happening. If mutants like him were using their powers to help all the normal people, I don’t think anti-mutant bigotry would last very long. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/22 "2018-06-27T18:13:32Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I think George R.R. Martin’s version of the X-Men, _Wild Cards_, was closer to reality. In his stories (written with other writers), the “Jokers”, meaning people with harmful or physically deforming mutations, were indeed discriminated against, but “Aces”, meaning people whose mutations were purely benign and superpower-like, were treated as heroes and worshiped by the public. I think it would be the same way with the X-Men: Beast, Mystique and Rogue might be shunned, but Magneto, Professor X and probably Wolverine would be invited to sleep in the Lincoln Bedroom. That series was disgusting. The numbers of rapes and sexual assaults was off the charts. Nothing lastingly good happened to anyone, ever. it was like there was a contest among the participating authors to see who could torture their characters the most. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/23 "2018-06-27T18:50:21Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I was surprised to find that, too. I think they live in the same continuity with Avengers, too, but I’m not sure. That’s really a bit much. Yeah, all the Marvel characters co-exist with all the other Marvel characters. It’s the same on the DC side. > [@](#): > > I’m also surprised Spiderman isn’t classed as a mutant. Because he really is. Spider-Man should be regarded as a mutant by the public, because it fits into his sad-sack, can’t-catch-a-break characterization. But he’s not a mutant himself - he wasn’t born with major genetic differences from other humans (the real-world definition of a mutant) and he doesn’t carry the X-gene (Marvel comic’s definition of a mutant). > [@](#): > > And what about Blade? Doesn’t he exist in the same universe? So they have genetic mutants, naturally ocurring (X-men, Scarlet Witch); genetic mutants, artificially occurring (Spidey, FF, Hulk); supernatural beings (Blade, Dr Strange); altered humans (Cap, Winter Soldier), powered humans, (Ironman, Ant Man); artificially created super humans (Vision); actual gods (Thor); regular Joes who work out a lot (Hawkeye, Romanov). Any other groups? You left off [space aliens](https://news.marvel.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/56cb7f8c1a2ad.jpg), [time travelers](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/8/85/Lucas_Bishop_%28Earth-1191%29_from_Marvel_Masterpieces_Trading_Cards_1992_0001.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20080506084634), [lycanthropes](https://i.pinimg.com/736x/6c/af/d8/6cafd819b069c0c9ef7cc8a151cb89d2--marvel-comics-werewolf.jpg), [Native American myths](https://i.pinimg.com/474x/30/4a/0f/304a0f3c2c2a8c068513be97b5bf9576--enemies-marvel-comics.jpg), [talking animals](https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/516edU4mtCL._SX323_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg), [cyborgs](http://cdn1us.denofgeek.com/sites/denofgeekus/files/styles/main_wide/public/deathlok1.jpg?itok=ti5VszFO), [spirits](https://img00.deviantart.net/fc21/i/2016/279/1/6/ghost_rider_wip_by_uncannyknack-dak4xr2.jpg), [faeries](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/8/8e/Fairies.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/298?cb=20131223221833), [elves](http://berkeleyplaceblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/IMG_5841.jpg), [actual Dracula](http://www.denofgeek.us/sites/denofgeekus/files/styles/article_width/public/0/74/marvel-dracula-x-men.jpg), [anthropological personifications of abstract philosophical concepts](https://i.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel//universe3zx/images/c/c5/Eternitystand.jpg), [angels](https://img.purch.com/w/640/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5uZXdzYXJhbWEuY29tL2ltYWdlcy9pLzAwMC8xNDIvNjk5L2kwMi9BTkdFTEEyMDE0MDAzMDA5X2NvbF9jb2xvcnNfcmV2aXNlZDNfc21hbGwuanBnPzE0MjI4ODg1OTg=), [demons](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/c/ce/Demons.gif/revision/latest?cb=20120219083434), [whatever the fuck is up with these guys](https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/5/5e/Headmen_%28Earth-616%29_from_Defenders_Vol_2_001.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20110524030557), [space knights](https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--7i5YNGfJ--/c_scale,f_auto,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/1281891733687562818.jpg), [Micronauts](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/32/Micronauts-1.jpg/250px-Micronauts-1.jpg), [Time Lords](https://d1466nnw0ex81e.cloudfront.net/n_iv/600/671727.jpg), and [The United Federation of Planets](http://filmonic.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/star-trek-xmen.jpg). > [@](#): > > The Marvel universe should be called the kitchen sink universe. They have more incompatible groups than Harry Potter. Yeah, that’s sort of the point – it’s like emptying out your toybox when you were a kid, and playing with GI Joes and He-Man and Transformers and maybe there’s a My Little Pony there, all at the same time. DC’s exactly the same, FWIW. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/24 "2018-06-27T19:01:03Z")
> [@CaptMurdock](#): > > Chris Claremont, in particular, ran the anti-mutant hysteria angle into the friggin ground during his long run on X-Men. As his erstwhile collaborator John Byrne was fond of pointing out, after a while it didn’t make sense: the same people who adored Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four were all “Muties! I hate 'em!” In what universe does prejudice have to make sense? ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/25 "2018-06-27T19:13:46Z")
Keep in mind, it wasn’t that long ago in the U.S. that “Black” blood was segregated, and some people would explicitly refuse life-saving transfusions if they were “White” and the blood on offer was “Black”. Even today, it’s tragically not unknown for people in the U.S. to refuse treatment from Muslims, or other “Others.” Just because a mutant could save their lives, doesn’t mean a “realistic” treatment of the subject would see people welcoming a mutant with healing powers with open arms. In the Marvel Universe, mutants are widely seen as freakish horrors. The religious often view them as ungodly abominations (see the classic “God Loves, Man Kills” graphic novel). The secular see them as an existential evolutionary threat, that Homo Sapiens Superior will inevitably overwhelm and replace mere Homo Sapiens (the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants in various incarnations explicitly avowed this view). See the current immigration debate for how “unrealistic” it to depict this sort of fear of the Other existing. Also, just like LeBron and Beyonce, there are celebrity mutants who are treated better, at least sometimes. The Beast, in his blue furry form (the first one, before he de-mutated, then re-mutated…), became an Avenger, and was treated as a celebrity by most of the public, while the X-Men, even the pretty ones, were still widely viewed with suspicion, or outright hatred and fear. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/26 "2018-06-27T19:25:29Z")
> [@dorvann](#): > > Yeah, at times it doesn’t really make sense. > > Take the mutant Elixir(who has gold skin and the mutant power to heal others) for example. > > I’m trying to imagine a scenario where he would be discriminated against: > > Crowd of anti-mutant bigots: “He’s got gold skin. He’s a mutant. Let’s kill him.” > > Elixir: “I have the mutant power to heal you and everyone else.” > > Crowd: “He can heal us of all our chronic medical problems. Let’s kill him.” > Yeah I just don’t see that happening. > > If mutants like him were using their powers to help all the normal people, I don’t think anti-mutant bigotry would last very long. After the last ten years of health care debates in this country, that seems like an entirely plausible scenario. “He’s a socialist! Get him!” “I want to give affordable health care to everyone!” “GET A ROPE!” More seriously: anti-mutant bigots believe that mutants are inherently opposed to humanity, and are actively plotting to replace them as a species. I can absolutely see anti-mutant bigots refusing to let someone like Elixir work on them, because “Who knows what other changes he’s making in there?” And in the Marvel universe, that’s not a crack-pot fear. Villains infecting people with mind-altering nanobots, or chemicals, or magic happens kind of a lot, and it often happens under the guise of a benevolent organization. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/27 "2018-06-27T19:46:46Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I was surprised to find that, too. I think they live in the same continuity with Avengers, too Yes. [17 characters](http://www.denofgeek.com/us/books-comics/avengers/245924/14-avengers-who-were-also-x-men) have been members of both the X-Men and the Avengers. Their first cross-over was in 1964. [Here is a list of 15 of them](https://www.cbr.com/avengers-x-men-the-15-greatest-crossovers/). ([Here](https://uncannyxmen.net/story-arc) are some other cross-over events, which doesn’t even count “minor” issue or two crossovers.) The MCU is really, really, really limited compared to the several decades of comic history. > [@](#): > > I’m also surprised Spiderman isn’t classed as a mutant. Because he really is. A mutant is someone born with “the X gene.” > [@](#): > > And what about Blade? Doesn’t he exist in the same universe? The majority of all comic titles produced by Marvel are in the same universe. [There was an arc a few years back](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curse_of_the_Mutants) involving Dracula (yes, Dracula is in the Marvel Universe) his son, and Blade where an X-Man member is turned into a vampire by being splashed with blood from a vampire suicide bomber (who exposed himself to the sun in a crowd, exploded, splashing blood on everyone.) That member then bit Wolverine, turning him into a vampire. But it turned out that it was all a trick to get Wolverine inside the vampire clan–he had had his healing ability “switched off”–when it was switched back on, it de-vampired him. The other X-man remained a vampire, though. [(Demons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spider-Man:_One_More_Day) also exist in the Marvel Universe.) Other groups in the Marvel Universe that cross over with the X-Men include aliens, including the Kree, Skrull, Shi’ar, Brood, and [Dire Wraith](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dire_Wraith). The X-Men have crossed over with the majority (if not all) of the current and upcoming Marvel movies and TV series, including the recent _Runaways_ and the current _Cloak and Dagger_ (and Runaways also crossed over with _The Avengers_, _Cloak and Dagger_, _Spiderman_, _The Punisher_, and _Power Pack_.) Both Deadpool and Legion were originally introduced in _New Mutants_, a “junior team” spinoff of X-Men, currently in production for a movie. ---
**Author:** ![Dante](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dante/32/9673_2.png) [@Dante](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/28 "2018-06-27T20:11:21Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Villains infecting people with mind-altering nanobots, or chemicals, or magic happens kind of a lot, and it often happens under the guise of a benevolent organization. Geez, one Transmode virus and everybody freaks out… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/29 "2018-06-27T20:18:34Z")
Also, remember that Elixir isn’t actually healing everyone. He might heal everyone he encounters… but even with a really good support structure, that’s going to be restricted to mostly people in one particular city. There are going to be a heck of a lot more people who never get the chance to be healed by him than those who do, and that’s going to foster resentment. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/30 "2018-06-27T20:19:22Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > What always bothered me about the X-Men is that you really can’t compare them to race or sexual preference because a lot of them really ARE dangerous and the fears of the anti mutant side are quite justified. Yes, it is interesting. The same people that want to registering guns, are horrified by the idea of registering mutants, some of which have the power to \*destroy the world. \* ---
**Author:** ![Dante](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dante/32/9673_2.png) [@Dante](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dante)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/31 "2018-06-27T20:25:39Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Also, remember that Elixir isn’t actually healing everyone. He might heal everyone he encounters… but even with a really good support structure, that’s going to be restricted to mostly people in one particular city. There are going to be a heck of a lot more people who never get the chance to be healed by him than those who do, and that’s going to foster resentment. Let’s be honest. His powers wouldn’t be used for good. He’d be snatched up and turned into a weapon. Or ground up into a fine paste to find out how to make battalions of Elixir soldiers. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/32 "2018-06-27T20:30:23Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > That series was disgusting. The numbers of rapes and sexual assaults was off the charts. Nothing lastingly good happened to anyone, ever. it was like there was a contest among the participating authors to see who could torture their characters the most. Yeah, it got too damn dark too damn fast. When they put the alien protagonist into a female body so as he/she could be repeatedly raped, that was way over the top. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/33 "2018-06-27T20:35:06Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yes, it is interesting. The same people that want to registering guns, are horrified by the idea of registering mutants, some of which have the power to \*destroy the world. \* But guns are inanimate objects - if an innocent one gets “imprisoned” or “killed” (confiscated or destroyed), it’s no big deal. If that happens to an innocent person, it is a big deal. Doesn’t help that when I read mutant registration storyline, there was no intent to only register _potentially dangerous_ mutants. X gene - registered you are, even if all you do is glow. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/34 "2018-06-27T21:04:13Z")
Also, “mutant registration” was the governments Plan B. Plan A was building giant purple robots to indiscriminately kill anyone with the x gene. That’s going to cause some trust issues down the road. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/35 "2018-06-27T21:05:07Z")
> [@Tzigone](#): > > But guns are inanimate objects - if an innocent one gets “imprisoned” or “killed” (confiscated or destroyed), it’s no big deal. If that happens to an innocent person, it is a big deal. > > Doesn’t help that when I read mutant registration storyline, there was no intent to only register _potentially dangerous_ mutants. X gene - registered you are, even if all you do is glow. Well, often when the confiscate a illegal or dangerous weapon the owner faces legal issues and criminal charges. ---
**Author:** ![G0sp3l](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c68b51/32.png) [@G0sp3l](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/G0sp3l)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/36 "2018-06-27T21:15:01Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > What was wrong with Beast in his original form? His huge feet? Feet and hands, as well as how he was out of proportion to normal humans. I’m not saying I understand why a family would shun a child for those reasons, but I have read of enough atrocities visited on RL children to make the leap. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/37 "2018-06-27T21:18:45Z")
In the first (real) _Fantastic Four_ movie, the FF were instantly recognized as heroes and applauded for stopping fights and crises which they caused. If they hadn’t shown up, there would have been no danger, violence or destruction, but somehow, they’re the good guys. > [@Just Asking Questions](#): > > I’m also surprised Spiderman isn’t classed as a mutant. Because he really is. One of my favorite Texts from Superheroes… Professor X: Spiderman, be on the lookout. There’s a sentinel in your area and it’s hunting mutants. Spiderman: I’m not a mutant, I got bit by a radioactive spider. Professor X: Good luck explaining that to the giant robot. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/38 "2018-06-27T22:05:39Z")
Although Spidey is pretty well-equipped, as super-folk go, to deal with a giant robot. “Did you ever see this really old movie called _The Empire Strikes Back_?” I know that Peter Parker is generally portrayed as sympathetic to mutants. Are there any prominent non-mutant supers who are generally in favor of registration? Well, probably Stark, because he’s a dick, but aside from him? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/39 "2018-06-27T22:07:09Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > A mutant is someone born with “the X gene.” In the old 1980s Marvel Super Heroes Roleplaying Game, they made the distinction between mutants (born with a genetic mutation / the X gene, though the mutation itself often didn’t manifest until puberty), and “altered humans” (normal humans who received powers due to later exposure to some outside energy or radiation, such as Spider-Man, the Fantastic Four, Hulk, Daredevil, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2018, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834/40 "2018-06-27T22:13:38Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Although Spidey is pretty well-equipped, as super-folk go, to deal with a giant robot. “Did you ever see this really old movie called _The Empire Strikes Back_?” > > I know that Peter Parker is generally portrayed as sympathetic to mutants. Are there any prominent non-mutant supers who are generally in favor of registration? Well, probably Stark, because he’s a dick, but aside from him? US Agent is Marvel’s conservative superhero… I’m sure he’s for registration. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/something-that-always-bothered-me-about-the-x-men/816834.md?page=3)