# Songs that try to use mythology to add gravitas and look smart that totally F it up. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 14, 2017, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458 "2017-12-14T00:59:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/21 "2017-12-14T15:43:53Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > I forgive Led Zeppelin for suggesting that Golem and Sauron kidnapped Aragorn’s girlfriend. I thought the “her” in reference was the Ring. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/22 "2017-12-14T15:49:14Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > I thought the “her” in reference was the Ring. A “girl so fair?” ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/23 "2017-12-14T15:52:29Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > A “girl so fair?” Yes, it’s supposed to be a metaphor. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/24 "2017-12-14T15:52:33Z")
Blue Oyster Cult knows how to do it right. > **[Blue Oyster Cult - Black Blade Lyrics | AZLyrics.com](https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/blueoystercult/blackblade.html)** > > Blue Oyster Cult "Black Blade": I have this feeling that my luck is none too good This sword here at my side don't act the way it sh... Black Blade ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/25 "2017-12-14T15:55:21Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Blue Oyster Cult knows how to do it right. > > [Blue Oyster Cult - Black Blade Lyrics | AZLyrics.com](https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/blueoystercult/blackblade.html) > > Black Blade Needs more cowbell. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/26 "2017-12-14T15:56:45Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > Yes, it’s supposed to be a metaphor. For a ring? They say “In the darkest depths of Mordor I met a girl so fair and then Golum and the evil one crept up and slipped away with her.” That would be a hell of a tortured metaphor for a ring, don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/27 "2017-12-14T16:24:39Z")
I love Toto’s “Africa” but “I know that I must do what’s right / As sure as Kilimanjaro rises like Olympus above the Serengeti” irritates the crap out of me. Apart from the fact that it’s nonsense, “this mountain rises just like a completely different mountain” isn’t exactly deathless verse even if one intends to imply some sort of deity involvement. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/28 "2017-12-14T16:32:19Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > For a ring? > > They say “In the darkest depths of Mordor I met a girl so fair and then Golum and the evil one crept up and slipped away with her.” > > That would be a hell of a tortured metaphor for a ring, don’t you think? And yet that’s what it’s supposed to be. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/29 "2017-12-14T16:41:39Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > I was going to suggest Rush’s “Hemispheres”, with Apollo as the god of reason and Dionysus as the god of love. While I don’t think that’s what the two gods are primarily known for (I associate Apollo with the sun and Dionysus with wine or the harvest) I think they both cover enough ground that you can stretch it and make it work. It’s not a stretch (or at least not by Rush); it’s a pre-existing dichotomy: [Apollonian](https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/us/Apollonian) - “Relating to the rational, ordered, and self-disciplined aspects of human nature.” [Dionysian](https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/us/dionysian) - “Relating to the sensual, spontaneous, and emotional aspects of human nature.” ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/30 "2017-12-14T16:45:57Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > I was going to suggest Rush’s “Hemispheres”, with Apollo as the god of reason and Dionysus as the god of love. While I don’t think that’s what the two gods are primarily known for (I associate Apollo with the sun and Dionysus with wine or the harvest) I think they both cover enough ground that you can stretch it and make it work. I couldn’t think of anything specific, but I figured if anyone used tortured mythology, it had to be Rush. However, those lyrics might be a reference to Nietzsche’s book “The Birth of Tragedy” - at least, Nietzsche heavily posits Apollo as the god of reason, and Dionysus as the god of… It’s complicated. I’ll have to read the lyrics and see if it fits. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/31 "2017-12-14T16:48:11Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > And yet that’s what it’s supposed to be. Really? I’m intrigued. It was a hobbit that crept away with the ring, not golum, and Sauron had nothing to do with it and would have been alarmed to learn the ring was being taken to Mt. Doom or whatever to be destroyed, and he didn’t encounter the ring in Mordor he encountered it at a bar. Other than all that, it fits great. :smack: A girl so fair being a metaphor for a ring is pretty unique. Seeing as they bitched up everyth8ng else possible about the reference, what makes you think they got that part right and intended girl to mean ring? ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/32 "2017-12-14T16:48:15Z")
Gyrate, do you know if that dichotomy first came from Nietzsche, or predates him? Just curious. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/33 "2017-12-14T17:18:49Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I love Toto’s “Africa” but “I know that I must do what’s right / As sure as Kilimanjaro rises like Olympus above the Serengeti” irritates the crap out of me. Apart from the fact that it’s nonsense, “this mountain rises just like a completely different mountain” isn’t exactly deathless verse even if one intends to imply some sort of deity involvement. There is a mount Serengeti? I know Kilimanjaro is in its own national park and not in Serengeti National Park, but when I hear “Serengeti” the colocation that comes to mind it “the plains of”, not a mountain. ---
**Author:** ![Filbert](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/filbert/32/3433_2.png) [@Filbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Filbert)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/34 "2017-12-14T17:34:59Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > There is a mount Serengeti? I know Kilimanjaro is in its own national park and not in Serengeti National Park, but when I hear “Serengeti” the colocation that comes to mind it “the plains of”, not a mountain. Not a mount Serengeti; mounts Kilimanjaro and Olympus. Personally, I try and avoid paying too much attention to lyrics, most of the time they get the meter right or the meaning right, but there’s a lot of fuzzy nonsense in there when you stop and think. So I don’t; I’d rather the sound was right, even if it makes less sense. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/35 "2017-12-14T17:40:40Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Hercules and his gifts? What gifts? He was known for his strength and his tasks. The myths of Hercules depict him as the quintessentially stereotypical lunkhead, douchebag alpha male. However, the myths do relate that the two areas where he did excel quite were well were: 1) physical strength/endurance of course, 2) strategic thinking. The stories of the 12 labors demonstrate that he was not only strong, but also remarkably shrewd and crafty when faced with finding a solution to a difficult challenge, such as cleaning out the Augean stables. So he does have some gifts, just extremely poor interpersonal relationship skills. As far as songs that get myths wrong, I get rankled by Martha Wainwright’s “Prosperina”, about the myth of the rape/abduction of Persephone (whose Roman name was Prosperpina.) Snippet of yrics: “Prosepina, Prosepina, come home to momma, come home to momma now. Prosepina, Prosepina go home to your mother, go home to Hera. Prosepina, Prosepina go home to your mother, go home to Hera now.” OK, I am even willing to let go the fact that, if you are going to use the Roman name of Prosperina/Persephone, then why not use the Roman name of Hera (Juno) as well. What really bothers me is that Hera/Juno is NOT Prosperina’s mother. Her mother was Demeter (whose Roman name was Ceres.) It’s not even a case of “Demeter” not fitting into the rhyme scheme, as “Ceres” would work just perfectly in its place (and be more appropriate as then the goddesses’ Roman names would match up.) ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/36 "2017-12-14T17:56:02Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I love Toto’s “Africa” but “I know that I must do what’s right / As sure as Kilimanjaro rises like Olympus above the Serengeti” irritates the crap out of me. Apart from the fact that it’s nonsense, “this mountain rises just like a completely different mountain” isn’t exactly deathless verse even if one intends to imply some sort of deity involvement. This is a good news/bad news moment for me. Now I finally know what word is between “like” and “above.” The bad news is that now the line is poorly written for the reason you state. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/37 "2017-12-14T18:10:36Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Since the song came out in 1991, I’m not inclined to give the Crash Test Dummies credit for how the character was later used by DC. Well, yeah, but the point is, Solomon Grundy was already a Silver Age character before then, not just a poat-1991 one. Heck, I knew who he was. I didn’t much care for him, but I knew him. So he wasn’t just an antiquated Golden Age villain. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/38 "2017-12-14T18:17:01Z")
The Kilimanjaro Olympus thing makes sense to me. Olympus is the home to the Gods in Greece, and is such a commanding presence. I hear that line and I picture a pantheon of African deities commanding Africa, and I imagine Kilimanjaro as a similar commanding presence. I am more troubled by “I guess the rain’s Down in Africa.” The whole song is basically nonsensical ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/39 "2017-12-14T18:20:52Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > The Kilimanjaro Olympus thing makes sense to me. Olympus is the home to the Gods in Greece, and is such a commanding presence. I hear that line and I picture a pantheon of African deities commanding Africa, and I imagine Kilimanjaro as a similar commanding presence. > > I am more troubled by “I guess the rain’s Down in Africa.” > The whole song is basically nonsensical Isn’t it “I bless the rains down in Africa” ? ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2017, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458/40 "2017-12-14T18:35:23Z")
I checked. Yup. “I bless the rains.” The dumb Kilamanjaro line notwithstanding, there are some pretty interesting lines in there. According to the wiki, the song is about a white boy trying to imagine visiting and falling in love with Africa even though he’s never been there. So maybe the description is intentionally wrong? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-that-try-to-use-mythology-to-add-gravitas-and-look-smart-that-totally-f-it-up/804458.md?page=3)