# Songs un/justifiably cut from/added to movie musicals **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 10, 2017, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148 "2017-04-10T03:31:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/1 "2017-04-10T03:31:04Z")
I’m going to talk about one of my favorite musicals: _How to Succeed in Business Without Really Trying_. Music and lyrics by the great Frank Loesser (also known for the musical _Guys and Dolls_, hit songs, etc.). Wiki, original musical: [How to Succeed in Business Without Really Trying (musical) - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Succeed_in_Business_Without_Really_Trying_(musical)) Wiki, film: [How to Succeed in Business Without Really Trying (film) - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/How_to_Succeed_in_Business_Without_Really_Trying_(film)) IMDb, film: [http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0061791/?ref\_=nv\_sr\_1](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0061791/?ref_=nv_sr_1) No songs were added for the movie, but four were cut. Two of the cuts were right in my opinion, and two were bad. Note that I haven’t seen the Broadway musical, but the movie is a favorite. **Good cuts** \*\*“Paris Original.” \*\*This song has one of the main characters, Rosemary, showing up at an event thinking she has a great dress on (the titular Paris original), but the joke is that every woman there is wearing the same dress. This was probably visually amusing on the stage, but the song just isn’t very good. Not catchy, dull. **“Love From a Heart of Gold.”** This is number for Rudy Vallee (brilliant casting in the musical and movie, btw) and the Worldwide Wicket Treasure Girl. It’s a song satirizing true love and all that. I think it’s passable, but its absence in the movie is not to be very much regretted. **Bad cuts** **“Happy to Keep His Dinner Warm.”** First, just a great song. Aptly satirizes both housewife and businessman roles–quite advanced for 1961 (when the stage musical was mounted). And I think advanced as well for 1967 (when the movie came out). I can sorta understand _why_ they didn’t put it in the movie. Rosemary sings it, and she is introduced later, after Finch actually visits the company. Plus, they didn’t seem to want to give Michele Lee a lot of singing parts (although she does fine). Worth shoehorning in somehow, however! **“Coffee Break.”** Inexcusable cut! It would have been very easy to put this in the movie–basically a standalone scene. Oddly, this song is on the movie soundtrack, even though it’s not in the actual movie! They knew it was brilliant. OK, feel free to comment on the above and… what’s yours?! ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/2 "2017-04-10T03:32:39Z")
I will add that I don’t think any other songs _should_ have been cut from the movie. Everything that has been left is great! ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/3 "2017-04-10T03:49:18Z")
Overview: MOST musicals, instead of having a real plot, are a thin skeleton of excuse onto which are attached a diverse array of musical numbers that seldom propel the plot forward or elaborate on what is going on in the story, and also don’t have diddly squat to do with each other either. A few musicals in the history thereof have departed from that. Typical musical guilty of the phenomenon: _The Sound of Music_ ; should have ditched: Sixteen Going on Seventeen, The Lonely Goatherd, I have Confidence, So Long Farewell; worthy of keeping: How Do you Solve a Problem like Maria; Climb Every Mountain; My Favorite Things, Do-Re-Mi, The Sound of Music, Edelweiss Musical less guilty of the phenomenon: _The Music Man_: should have ditched: Goodnight my Someone; Gary Indiana; Shipoopi; worthy of keeping: If you Don’t Mind My Saying so; 76 Trombones; The Sadder but Wiser girl; Marian the Librarian; Being in Love; the Wells Fargo Wagon; Lisa Rose; Till There was You The music should be written for the damn musical and not vice versa. Tell a goddam story. Or don’t pretend to it and just have a performance of a bunch of musical numbers and don’t pretend they’re connected. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/4 "2017-04-10T03:55:32Z")
“You Can’t Do That” shouldn’t have been cut from _A Hard Day’s Night_. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/5 "2017-04-10T13:21:37Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > Overview: MOST musicals, instead of having a real plot, are a thin skeleton of excuse onto which are attached a diverse array of musical numbers that seldom propel the plot forward or elaborate on what is going on in the story, and also don’t have diddly squat to do with each other either. A few musicals in the history thereof have departed from that. Absolute nonsense, especially for musicals after _Oklahoma_, where every song had a purpose, either for plot or character reasons. So let’s look at your choices: “Sixteen Going on Seventeen.” Absolutely essential. Establishes the relationship between Liesl and Rolph, something that makes Rolph’s action in the climax believable. “The Lonely Goatherd.” They are singers, and supposedly good enough to compete in the talent show. This establishes they can sing. “I have Confidence.” The establishes Maria’s character. “So Long Farewell” Also essential. First, it also establishes their singing talent. And the reprise has a very smart double meaning – they are saying goodbye to Austria. _The Music Man_ “Goodnight my Someone” Establishes Marian’s character. More importantly, musically it’s basically “76 Trombones,” forming a musical connection between Harold and her. “Gary Indiana” Gary, Indiana is an important plot point. By singing about it, it ensure the audience picks up on it. “Shipoopi” – you’re right about this. Though, IIRC, it covers for Hill’s escape. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/6 "2017-04-10T13:29:50Z")
“The Jitterbug” was removed from _The Wizard of Oz_ because they thought the movie was too long, and because they thought it would date the piece. They were right. They almost ditched “Over The Rainbow”, but it prevailed. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/7 "2017-04-10T13:54:15Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Absolute nonsense, especially for musicals after _Oklahoma_, where every song had a purpose, either for plot or character reasons. > > So let’s look at your choices: > “Sixteen Going on Seventeen.” Absolutely essential. Establishes the relationship between Liesl and Rolph, something that makes Rolph’s action in the climax believable. > > “The Lonely Goatherd.” They are singers, and supposedly good enough to compete in the talent show. This establishes they can sing. > > “I have Confidence.” The establishes Maria’s character. > > “So Long Farewell” Also essential. First, it also establishes their singing talent. And the reprise has a very smart double meaning – they are saying goodbye to Austria. > _The Music Man_ > > “Goodnight my Someone” Establishes Marian’s character. More importantly, musically it’s basically “76 Trombones,” forming a musical connection between Harold and her. > > “Gary Indiana” Gary, Indiana is an important plot point. By singing about it, it ensure the audience picks up on it. > > “Shipoopi” – you’re right about this. Though, IIRC, it covers for Hill’s escape. QFT. There’s more to a musical than plot; character development is equally important. And who the hell would fuck with _The Sound of Music_? As with all other R&H musicals, all the songs are there for a reason. ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/8 "2017-04-10T20:04:16Z")
1776: The song “Cool, Cool, Considerate Men” was cut from the original film, reportedly demanded by Richard Nixon. (It was restored on the special edition DVD.) And I know this is heresy, but I always fast-forward past “Mama, Look Sharp” – too boring and pointless. ---
**Author:** ![Southpaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@Southpaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Southpaw)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/9 "2017-04-10T20:56:04Z")
I can’t watch the movie version of **Guys and Dolls** because of the weird omissions and replacements that were made: “A Bushel and a Peck” was replaced with “Pet Me Poppa”. “I’ve Never Been in Love Before” was replaced by “A Woman in Love” “My Time of Day”, “More I Cannot Wish You”, and “Marry the Man Today” were all omitted. These changes make no sense. “Bushel” was a big hit so why replace? “My Time of Day” helped establish Skye’s character and “INBILB” advances the Skye/Sarah romance along. “Marry the Man” is the only time Sarah and Adelaide are in a scene together and without the song, the ending seems very abrupt. I’m OK with “MICWY” being omitted. I never thought it added much to the story. The addition of “Adelaide” is only because Frank Sinatra was in the movie. It’s an OK song, but could’ve been cut for “INBILB” or “Marry the Man”. ---
**Author:** ![Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Ulf\_the\_Unwashed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulf_the_Unwashed)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/10 "2017-04-10T21:00:11Z")
Well, a few corrections. The Sound of Music actually got fucked with a lot on its way from stage show to movie musical. Regarding “I Have Confidence”–it doesn’t fit the OP at all, as it did not appear in the stage musical. It was written especially for the movie. “The Lonely Goatherd” does appear in both but in a different scene and with a different role. In the movie it establishes that the family can sing, true, as it is part of a performance the kids give for friends of their father’s. But in the original Broadway show it is sung during the thunderstorm scene (where “My Favorite Things” appears in the movie). Its purpose is as a distraction for the kids. Maybe it makes more sense in the movie position, but that’s not where it originally was. Harold does not make his escape during Shipoopi, at least not in the stage show: it comes early in Act 2. Shipoopi’s only real purpose is as background for having Harold ask Marian to dance, which she does very well, which in turn impresses the Mean Ladies, including Mrs. Shinn, who are now ready to accept her (and even go as far as to read Bal-zac). ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2017, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/11 "2017-04-10T23:19:33Z")
The movie version of, “Jesus Christ, Superstar,” added a Caiaphas/Annas song (“Then We Are Decided”) to the first act. It not only gave some additional story to those characters, but split up a pair of Jesus/Judas-hollering-at-each-other songs. I’ve never seen that song performed in any live version, nor the 2001 "[Great Performances" PBS version](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0275434/). ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/12 "2017-04-11T00:16:56Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > “The Jitterbug” was removed from _The Wizard of Oz_ because they thought the movie was too long, and because they thought it would date the piece. They were right. They almost ditched “Over The Rainbow”, but it prevailed. Funny you should mention OTR. Did you know that it was the final, denouement tune in _Close Encounters of the Third Kind_, when the giant ship had descended? I know this because I was given an advance copy of the soundtrack LP, and I couldn’t believe the last tune. Apparently I wasn’t the only one who broke out laughing, for it was replaced before the movie hit the streets. I only wish I had saved a copy of the record to prove it. It would certainly be a collector’s item now. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/13 "2017-04-11T00:42:53Z")
I wish they had cut “He Plays the Violin” from 1776. I find it embarrassing to listen to it. “Shipoopi” is such a throwaway song. But otherwise I think all of the music in “The Music Man” pulls its weight. ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/14 "2017-04-11T00:51:41Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > Funny you should mention OTR. Did you know that it was the final, denouement tune in _Close Encounters of the Third Kind_, when the giant ship had descended? I know this because I was given an advance copy of the soundtrack LP, and I couldn’t believe the last tune. > > Apparently I wasn’t the only one who broke out laughing, for it was replaced before the movie hit the streets. I only wish I had saved a copy of the record to prove it. It would certainly be a collector’s item now. So John Williams worked, “When You Wish Upon a Star,” into the replacement tune, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/15 "2017-04-11T01:38:22Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > 1776: The song “Cool, Cool, Considerate Men” was cut from the original film, reportedly demanded by Richard Nixon. (It was restored on the special edition DVD.) > > And I know this is heresy, but I always fast-forward past “Mama, Look Sharp” – too boring and pointless. Yes, heresy. “Mama, Look Sharp” is the one instance in a show about powerful influential men to see things from the point of view of a common soldier. The debates are about ideas: the injustice of excessive taxes, the lack of representation, the disregard for the legal rights of men who are the King’s subjects, the difference of opinion (to put it lightly) on slavery. But it is the weary dispatch rider who, in a quiet moment, reminds us that people are dying out there. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/16 "2017-04-11T03:10:03Z")
> [@Kizarvexius](#): > > Yes, heresy. “Mama, Look Sharp” is the one instance in a show about powerful influential men to see things from the point of view of a common soldier. The debates are about ideas: the injustice of excessive taxes, the lack of representation, the disregard for the legal rights of men who are the King’s subjects, the difference of opinion (to put it lightly) on slavery. But it is the weary dispatch rider who, in a quiet moment, reminds us that people are dying out there. I agree with your analysis, but in the end, the song itself–the tune is boring and the lyrics maudlin (IMO). A song filling that function is critical, but not that particular one, if you see what I mean. Also, to the OP’s point, the humor of Love From A Heart of Gold is that it’s very specifically a parody written for Rudy Vallee based on the type of song he once sang and IIRC, he sang it to Miss LaRue through a megaphone while wearing the Old Ivy Sweater with the letter embroidered on it like he did in the 1930s. It’s a parody that _only_ works if you have Vallee playing the role, but they did. And Paris Original is a short song…what, 4 minutes? It’s a catchy melody and any scene that gives Michelle Lee more screen time is ok with me. 😉 It was a bad move to cut it. ---
**Author:** ![Kizarvexius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/da6949/32.png) [@Kizarvexius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kizarvexius)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/17 "2017-04-11T03:24:30Z")
> [@Fenris](#): > > I agree with your analysis, but in the end, the song itself–the tune is boring and the lyrics maudlin (IMO). A song filling that function is critical, but not that particular one, if you see what I mean. Well, de gustibus non est disputandum and all that. It’s one of my favorite moments in the show. When well done (such as in the movie) it gives me chills. But that’s me. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/18 "2017-04-11T04:05:51Z")
> [@AHunter3](#): > > Overview: MOST musicals, instead of having a real plot, are a thin skeleton of excuse onto which are attached a diverse array of musical numbers that seldom propel the plot forward or elaborate on what is going on in the story, and also don’t have diddly squat to do with each other either. A few musicals in the history thereof have departed from that. I would second the objection made to this point while also conceding that you are right sometimes. BUT, I think it’s OK to tack on songs if the songs themselves are great. A musical is like a concert in story form. The concert and story serve each other, but often the concert wins a little bit. > [@](#): > > Typical musical guilty of the phenomenon: _The Sound of Music_ ; should have ditched: Sixteen Going on Seventeen, The Lonely Goatherd, I have Confidence, So Long Farewell; worthy of keeping: How Do you Solve a Problem like Maria; Climb Every Mountain; My Favorite Things, Do-Re-Mi, The Sound of Music, Edelweiss I just realized that I don’t know the songs “I Have Confidence” and “Something Good,” which were added to the movie. So I don’t object to IHC because I just don’t know (I’ve seen the movie, of course, several times, but they apparently didn’t stick–so maybe they suck?). I don’t agree with your other desired eliminations, however, as they are all great songs. Two great songs were omitted, however: “How Can Love Survive” and “No Way to Stop It.” Both great tunes, both quite character-building. > [@](#): > > Musical less guilty of the phenomenon: _The Music Man_: should have ditched: Goodnight my Someone; Gary Indiana; Shipoopi; worthy of keeping: If you Don’t Mind My Saying so; 76 Trombones; The Sadder but Wiser girl; Marian the Librarian; Being in Love; the Wells Fargo Wagon; Lisa Rose; Till There was You “Shipoopi” is one of the worst songs I’ve ever heard in my life, so I agree with you on that one! I think The Music Man is a bit uneven, and I only know the really standout songs. “Gary, Indiana” and “76 Trombones,” however: keepers because they’re good, memorable songs. ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/19 "2017-04-11T04:08:19Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > “You Can’t Do That” shouldn’t have been cut from _A Hard Day’s Night_. I have seen the movie but it was a while back, before I knew the album’s songs very well. That’s one of my faves from the album, so I agree! ---
**Author:** ![Aeschines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aeschines/32/16251_2.png) [@Aeschines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aeschines)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2017, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148/20 "2017-04-11T04:10:35Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > “The Jitterbug” was removed from _The Wizard of Oz_ because they thought the movie was too long, and because they thought it would date the piece. They were right. They almost ditched “Over The Rainbow”, but it prevailed. Yeah, “The Jitterbug” actually sucks, and if you look at the footage they had for it, that sucks too. Good move. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-un-justifiably-cut-from-added-to-movie-musicals/784148.md?page=2)