# Songs with historical errors that bug you **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [August 28, 2023, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246 "2023-08-28T21:37:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/101 "2023-08-30T20:09:34Z")
But there is southern Alberta, southern Saskatchewan, etc., no? ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/102 "2023-08-30T20:37:38Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > Neil Young in Cortez The Killer completely ignoring that Montezuma was likely much more of a murderer than Cortez was bugs me a lot more. First there is absolutely no way that in Cuba and Mexico Cortez did not kill far more people than Montezuma. He played a big part in wiping out upwards of 90% of the population of both places, the Aztec empire was no peaceful utopia, but they were compared to the Spanish conquest (those non-Aztec groups that allied with Cortez because they had been victims of the Aztec empire very soon regretted their decision) Secondly yeah, the song does not go into the details of the violent nature of the Aztec empire, but its a (completely justified) polemic against Cortez and the conquistadors, that’s the nature of a polemic, its pretty hard to write a catchy song (or even a slightly noodely overlong song, in Neil Young’s case 🙂 ) railing against some great injustice if you have to add a footnote that says “but actually the opposing side were also not perfect and had some pretty serious issues, which I’ll now lay out …”. You can’t criticize a songwriter for not doing that IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Wallaby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/dc4da7/32.png) [@Wallaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallaby)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/103 "2023-08-30T21:12:57Z")
The anti-war song about the Vietnam war [_ **I was Only 19** _](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGDhzVi1bqU) contains the line: ‘_ **Then Frankie kicked a mine the day that Mankind kicked the moon** _ _**God help me (he was going home in June)**_’ Mankind kicked the moon on July 20 1969 (I suppose Frankie could have been going home _next_ June, but I think it’s more likely a lyrical device because not much rhymes with July). ---
**Author:** ![Mallard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Mallard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mallard)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/104 "2023-08-30T21:24:59Z")
In the song Raised on robbery, Joni Mitchell sings: First he bought a '57 Biscayne He put it in the ditch He drunk up all the rest That son of a bitch Chevrolet didn’t make a Biscayne model until the 1958 model year. (I know only the pickiest of car guys would get that one) 😇 ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/105 "2023-08-30T22:01:44Z")
> [@Maserschmidt](#): > > Other than the north side of my town was facing east, and the east side was facing south. File that under topological errors that bug me. Seriously Pete is Chiswick non-Euclidean? That’s news to me 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Mallard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Mallard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mallard)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/106 "2023-08-30T23:09:49Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > > [@Spoons](#): > > > > Couldn’t have been. By convention, Toronto has a downtown, an east end, a west end, and a north end. No south anything, nor any sides. > > Just like there’s no region in Canada known as “southern Canada.” There’s Atlantic Canada, the Maritimes, Central Canada, the Prairies, Western Canada, and the North, but no Southern Canada. If you lived in north portal Saskatchewan would that not qualify as “southern Canada”? (Although I agree I’ve never heard of “southern Canada” having any regional significance) ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2023, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/107 "2023-08-30T23:53:30Z")
I always say that I (in Vancouver area) live in the Pacific Southwest, because it is—of Canada. ---
**Author:** ![Seanette](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/seanette/32/9139_2.png) [@Seanette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seanette)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/108 "2023-08-31T01:54:52Z")
> [@Mallard](#): > > Chevrolet didn’t make a Biscayne model until the 1958 model year. (I know only the pickiest of car guys would get that one) 😇 Since cars are released prior to 1 January of their model year, the owner still could have bought it in 1957, perhaps? ---
**Author:** ![Mallard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Mallard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mallard)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/109 "2023-08-31T03:23:04Z")
He could perhaps have purchased the car in later 1957 but it sill would have been a 1958 model year as the Biscayne name plate wasn’t used until the 1958 model year. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/110 "2023-08-31T04:15:06Z")
> [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](#): > > Oh God, not Paper Lace again. As I point out _every time_ we discuss this song and its alleged error, _Chicago has an East Side!_ > > It’s in the southeast, right against the Indiana border. It’s a Chicago neighborhood just like Pilsen or Streeterville. There are craploads of businesses with “East Side” in their name, and if you ask people from there where they live, they’ll say “the east side”. > > It’s a remote part of Chicago that many locals never visit, or even thin about, **BUT IT EXISTS!** While you guys argue about that, the real historical error in the song is the alleged gun fight between Capones gang and the police resulting in over one hundred cops dead. It never happened. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/111 "2023-08-31T04:20:42Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Just like there’s no region in Canada known as “southern Canada.” Especially when the snowdrifts cover the windows, we like to call ourselves _Baja Canada._ ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/112 "2023-08-31T05:05:30Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Just like there’s no region in Canada known as “southern Canada.” Right, there is no region KNOWN as … But of course there is . ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/113 "2023-08-31T08:50:58Z")
I don’t get it. Some parts of Chicago are further east than other parts. Obviously. There may not be any area that is officially called East Chicago but there must be an east Chicago. Isn’t there an east everywhere? ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/114 "2023-08-31T10:26:47Z")
Not at either Pole ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/115 "2023-08-31T12:04:37Z")
The first thing I thought of after reading the OP were all the [_Schoolhouse Rock!_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schoolhouse_Rock!) songs on the subject of [America](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schoolhouse_Rock!#America_Rock). ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/116 "2023-08-31T13:51:13Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > While you guys argue about that, the real historical error in the song is the alleged gun fight between Capones gang and the police resulting in over one hundred cops dead. It never happened. I have mentioned this already. No use getting into the middle of a silly argument, no one cares. . ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/117 "2023-08-31T14:27:55Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > the real historical error in the song is the alleged gun fight between Capones gang and the police resulting in over one hundred cops dead. The singer is the cop’s son, quoting someone who heard something, probably from someone. The song isn’t claiming it was the truth. You know how rumors go? Hate the song because you hate it, but don’t make up reasons. ---
**Author:** ![sciurophobic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@sciurophobic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sciurophobic)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/118 "2023-08-31T14:43:08Z")
Snoopy could not have fought the Red Baron, as Snoopy was born in 1950 and the Red Baron was killed in 1918. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/119 "2023-08-31T14:50:25Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > The singer is the cop’s son, quoting someone who heard something, probably from someone. The song isn’t claiming it was the truth. You know how rumors go? > > Hate the song because you hate it, but don’t make up reasons. Some things are annoying even if they are fictional. That Hyacinth Bucket was meant to be annoying doesn’t make her less annoying nor make Keeping Up Appearances any better of a show. Then again, sometimes the gambit of putting unbelievable words in a character’s mouth where it isn’t immediately obvious that the author does not necessarily believe it themselves _does_ work for me, and there isn’t any hard and fast rule as to when I like it or when I don’t like it. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/120 "2023-08-31T15:00:20Z")
Mother and son hear a rumour that 100 police were killed. They get scared thinking the husband/ father is dead. Cop comes home and is unhurt. The rumour that 100 cops were killed turns out not to be true. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246.md?page=7)