# Songs with historical errors that bug you **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [August 28, 2023, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246 "2023-08-28T21:37:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/121 "2023-08-31T15:01:05Z")
> [@sciurophobic](#): > > Snoopy could not have fought the Red Baron, as Snoopy was born in 1950 and the Red Baron was killed in 1918. Ach der lieber! ---
**Author:** ![I.Dunno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9f8e36/32.png) [@I.Dunno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I.Dunno)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/122 "2023-08-31T15:42:33Z")
As I am (apparently) a picky car guy, that still doesn’t make it a '57 Biscayne. ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/123 "2023-08-31T15:43:37Z")
Not if it has dual headlights. ---
**Author:** ![Mallard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Mallard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mallard)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/124 "2023-08-31T17:16:07Z")
> [@I.Dunno](#): > > As I am (apparently) a picky car guy, that still doesn’t make it a '57 Biscayne. Exactly ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/125 "2023-08-31T17:32:14Z")
So why is it The Night Chicago Died? The song clearly states that there was a riot between cops and gangsters. Paper Lace was an English band who thought they were making a cool song about Chicagoland but they only knew about it from movies. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/126 "2023-08-31T19:23:41Z")
> [@sciurophobic](#): > > Snoopy could not have fought the Red Baron, as Snoopy was born in 1950 and the Red Baron was killed in 1918. Curses, foiled again! ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2023, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/127 "2023-08-31T20:48:39Z")
> [@sciurophobic](#): > > Snoopy could not have fought the Red Baron, as Snoopy was born in 1950 and the Red Baron was killed in 1918. Blame that on Schulz then. He’s the guy who made Snoopy fantasize about being a WWI flying ace. So, it’s all canon. So there. ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/128 "2023-09-01T01:46:55Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > it’s all **canon**. Another error! They only used machine guns on WWI planes. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/129 "2023-09-01T04:52:56Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > > [@pkbites](#): > > > > the real historical error in the song is the alleged gun fight between Capones gang and the police resulting in over one hundred cops dead. > > The singer is the cop’s son, quoting someone who heard something, probably from someone. The song isn’t claiming it was the truth. You know how rumors go? > > Hate the song because you hate it, but don’t make up reasons. The part about hearing a hundred cops were dead isn’t what I was talking about. It’s the entire premise that there was such a “war” in the first place. There wasn’t and it makes the song fit the OP perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/130 "2023-09-01T05:02:39Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Paper Lace was an English band who thought they were making a cool song about Chicagoland but they only knew about it from movies. It’s always a tad askew when a song is written by someone about someplace they’ve never been. Remember “_Illegal Alien_” by Genesis? Why in the world would British musicians do a song about that? I always found that weird. ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/131 "2023-09-01T06:28:28Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > > [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > > > I always thought the song said “there goes THE Robert E Lee”, the riverboat, but I see the lyrics do omit the definite article. > > That’s what I thought but I watched The Last Waltz on the weekend and no “the” in the closed captions or in the way it was sung that time. I just listened to the Joan Baez version, and she sings, “the Robert E. Lee.” That must be why I, too, thought _the_ Robert E. Lee was a ship or maybe a train. As for the significance of May 10th, it was the date Jefferson Davis was captured, and _On that same day, President Andrew Johnson announced that armed resistance in the South had come to an end. From the day Richmond had fell (Confederates abandoned the town on April 2 and Federals occupied it on the 3rd) up until May 10, the various organized Confederate forces continued to surrender. By May 10, most if not all had accepted their paroles. On a side note, William Quantrill was fatally wounded on the 10th and died on June 6. So something big did happen on the 10th. **Unfortunately, it got confused in the telling, with the author confusing the fall of Richmond with the official end of the war**._ [bolding mine] [[source](https://theband.hiof.no/articles/dixie_viney.html)] The late, great Robbie Robertson was Canadian, and as he said, Canadian schools didn’t really cover the Civil War. He did do some research, but a few historical inaccuracies are maybe understandable. ---
**Author:** ![eburacum45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eburacum45/32/8690_2.png) [@eburacum45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eburacum45)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/132 "2023-09-01T07:41:08Z")
> [@solost](#): > > I’m thinking Johnny Horton took a wee bit of artistic license in his telling of “The Battle of New Orleans”: Not as many as Lonnie Donegan did in his version, which was a major hit when I was a kid in the UK. For some reason, Donegan replaced Jackson with Pakenham in his version, so that the winning general appeared to be the British one. I have no idea why he did this, especially since he mentioned that the British lost several times, both in the preamble and during the song. Donegan certainly didn’t change it out of pro-British sentiment. > **[Lonnie Donegan – Battle of New Orleans](https://genius.com/Lonnie-donegan-battle-of-new-orleans-lyrics)** > > (Spoken)Well, this here's the story about the Battle of New Orleans / Which was fit between the Yankees of course and them there English people / In which the British came off ---
**Author:** ![Dialo\_Malison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dialo_malison/32/14734_2.png) [@Dialo\_Malison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dialo_Malison)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/133 "2023-09-01T08:34:29Z")
> [@solost](#): > > I’m thinking Johnny Horton took a wee bit of artistic license in his telling of “The Battle of New Orleans”: Actually, the Johnny Horton’s recording of “The Battle of New Orleans” was a cover. The song was written (and originally recorded) by Jimmie Driftwood. Johnny’s version is a stripped down version (several verses and mild expletives removed). The full lyrics to Jimmie Driftwood’s version can be found here: [The Battle of New Orleans - By Jimmy Driftwood](https://billslater.com/battle_of_new_orleans_.htm) ---
**Author:** ![joper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e47774/32.png) [@joper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joper)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/134 "2023-09-01T10:01:37Z")
Only fish live in South Toronto. Robbie Robertson’s mom was Mohawk-Cayuga and his dad, as he eventually discovered, was a Jew. Maybe it’s not surprising that he had feelings about loss and its legacies. He also wrote Acadian Driftwood, a song about Britain’s expulsion of French settlers from Atlantic Canada. In his autobiography, Levon Helm wrote that he and Robbie worked up the Dixie song together. Sure, he was bitter about not being credited. But it seems normal that a white guy from Arkansas who sang lead on the track would at least have had something to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![joper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e47774/32.png) [@joper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joper)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/135 "2023-09-01T10:10:07Z")
Only fish live in South Toronto. Robbie Robertson’s mom was Mohawk-Cayuga and his dad, as he eventually discovered, was a Jew. Maybe it’s not surprising that he had feelings about loss and its legacies. He also wrote Acadian Driftwood, a song about Britain’s expulsion of French settlers from Atlantic Canada. In his autobiography, Levon Helm wrote that he and Robbie worked up the Dixie song together. Sure, he was bitter about not being credited. But it seems normal that a white guy from Arkansas who sang lead on the track would at least have had something to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/136 "2023-09-01T11:43:12Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Remember “_Illegal Alien_” by Genesis? Why in the world would British musicians do a song about that? I always found that weird. Though that was meant as a joke based on the band’s real life issues with US immigration trying to get a visa. Though let’s just say [it hasn’t aged well](https://faroutmagazine.co.uk/illegal-alien-crass-racial-stereotype-genesis/). ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/137 "2023-09-01T12:09:55Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > I just listened to the Joan Baez version, and she sings, “the Robert E. Lee.” That must be why I, too, thought _the_ Robert E. Lee was a ship or maybe a train. [Mississippi riverboat.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_E._Lee_(steamboat)) See post #57. This is just a guess, but someone upthread said that Baez never saw the lyrics, she just got them from listening to The Band’s version. She was a folksinger, though, so might have heard of the _Robert E. Lee_’s 1870 New Orleans to St. Louis race with another steamboat, the _Natchez_, and thought that the " ‘Quick, come see/There goes the _Robert E. Lee_!’ " line referred to the famous race. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/138 "2023-09-01T14:37:26Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > I just listened to the Joan Baez version, and she sings I just relistened. She also sings “'till so much cavalry came”. No wonder I have such a different version in my head! I, like Joan, learned it by listening to her version. It’s like a game of telephone, except on the radio. > [@joper](#): > > Only fish live in South Toronto. I say, it’s a joke son. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/139 "2023-09-01T18:39:38Z")
> [@Dialo\_Malison](#): > > The full lyrics to Jimmie Driftwood’s version can be found here: [The Battle of New Orleans - By Jimmy Driftwood](https://billslater.com/battle_of_new_orleans_.htm) Thank you- very interesting! ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2023, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246/140 "2023-09-01T19:16:40Z")
> [@joper](#): > > Only fish live in South Toronto. That’s because in North Ontario, they get eaten by Big Birds. It’s a grand conspiracy masterminded by the Children’s Television Workshop and Neil Young to bring about equality for the letter “Zed”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songs-with-historical-errors-that-bug-you/989246.md?page=8)