# Songwriters with Something to Say **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 11, 2004, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429 "2004-08-11T21:35:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2004, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/1 "2004-08-11T21:35:17Z")
It seems that most rock-type songwriters either state things that are rather obvious (“The Times, They are a Changin’”, “Blackbird”, etc.) or completely nonsense (“I Am the Walrus”, “Loser”). I can’t think of any who really put much into their work, in terms of multi-layered poetry or true imagery. Can any of you? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/2 "2004-08-12T00:43:15Z")
Two words: **Warren Zevon** ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/3 "2004-08-12T00:44:20Z")
Two more: **John Prine** ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/4 "2004-08-12T01:29:15Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Two more: **John Prine** Guess we should’ve seen THAT one coming. Let me add: Paul Westerberg. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/5 "2004-08-12T02:22:31Z")
Kate Bush Tori Amos Sarah Maclachlan ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/6 "2004-08-12T02:29:41Z")
**Jackson Browne** **Bruce Springsteen** and I second **Sarah Maclachan** and **Warren Zevon**. ---
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/7 "2004-08-12T04:50:02Z")
Elvis Costello Andy Partridge Roger Waters Patti Smith David Byrne John Wesley Harding Neil Young Paul Westerberg Louis Perez (Los Lobos) Sinéad O’Conner Sinéad Lohan (talking of Sinéads) Ray Davies Peter Townshend … and so on. In other words, there are a lot. I would also include Lennon, Dylan, McCartney and Beck, who all have written lyrics that are simultaneously sophisticated, lucid, and aesthetically accomplished. And “I Am the Walrus” is not gibberish … see Ian MacDonald’s excellent exegesis in _Revolution in the Head_. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/8 "2004-08-12T05:14:25Z")
Yeah… it’s kind of a false dichotomy there. Lennon did like to free-associate, but he created some great imagery at times and also made social statements. They seem obvious now, I’m sure, but there’s a reason his songs and Dylan’s (for example) caught people’s imaginations. ---
**Author:** ![LifeOnWry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/96bed5/32.png) [@LifeOnWry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LifeOnWry)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/9 "2004-08-12T05:18:27Z")
Indigo Girls REM Pink Floyd Queen Mark Knopfler Ian Anderson Peter Gabriel Suzanne Vega ---
**Author:** ![Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Hey\_It\_s\_That\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hey_It_s_That_Guy)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/10 "2004-08-12T05:22:01Z")
Tom Waits Nick Cave Neko Case Elvis Costello Elliott Smith ---
**Author:** ![gyt\_fx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@gyt\_fx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gyt_fx)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/11 "2004-08-12T07:02:29Z")
**Zach De La Rocha** - Rage Against The Machine **Thrice** (I dunno who writes their lyrics) **NOFX** (some songs… many are just funny gibberish like She’s Nubs or We Threw Gasoline on the Fire and Now We Have Stumps for Arms and No Eyebrows) ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/12 "2004-08-12T08:04:14Z")
Annie Lennox Kirsty MacColl ---
**Author:** ![jinty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/dbc845/32.png) [@jinty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jinty)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/13 "2004-08-12T11:59:55Z")
Frank Zappa. Flaming Lips (esp recent Yoshimi-era stuff). Jeff Mangum of Neutral Milk Hotel. Frank Black (esp Pixies era). And I’ll second Tom Waits. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/14 "2004-08-12T13:33:43Z")
I was going to start naming names, but then I thought: nah, too easy. Once I started thinking up names, I’d never stop. Perhaps the reason the OP is having trouble thinking of any is that (at the risk of overgeneralizing) the songs and songwriters with real depth and complexity to their lyrics aren’t the ones you hear played all over the place on the radio and in stores and bars and so forth, because in situations like that, most people don’t want something they have to pay attention to. They don’t want something that makes them think or touches them deeply while they’re buying Doritos or washing their car. If the songwriter has something to say, what if I’m not in the mood to hear it right now? Some people don’t pay much attention to lyrics at all; if it has a good beat and they can dance to it (or bang their head to it), they’re satisfied. But those who do pay attention can’t always give a really good song, with a lot in it, the attention it deserves. So the really substantial songs lyrically tend, perhaps, to be the more obscure ones, the ones you have to seek out and play for yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Shoeless](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shoeless/32/7099_2.png) [@Shoeless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shoeless)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/15 "2004-08-12T13:37:22Z")
**Richard Thompson** ---
**Author:** ![Labdad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/439d5e/32.png) [@Labdad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labdad)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2004, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/16 "2004-08-12T14:50:16Z")
John Hiatt Robbie Fulks ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/17 "2004-08-13T00:33:56Z")
Neil Peart of Rush writes some good lyrics, if a tad pretentious and intellectual. Also, Marillion lyrics from the Fish era are pretty poetic. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/18 "2004-08-13T00:50:40Z")
> [@gyt\_fx](#): > > **NOFX** (some songs… many are just funny gibberish like She’s Nubs or We Threw Gasoline on the Fire and Now We Have Stumps for Arms and No Eyebrows) WTGOTFANWHSFAANE Says more than most of their songs. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/19 "2004-08-13T02:26:35Z")
Aimee Mann The Pogues ---
**Author:** ![dry\_gear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@dry\_gear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dry_gear)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2004, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429/20 "2004-08-13T02:36:59Z")
> [@jinty](#): > > Flaming Lips (esp recent Yoshimi-era stuff). > Frank Black (esp Pixies era). > And I’ll second Tom Waits. Are you kidding? Wayne Coyne? Frank Black? Tom Waits? Well, they didn’t say anything cliched, but I’d put them in the just weird category. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/songwriters-with-something-to-say/259429.md?page=2)