# Sons of Anarchy 9/11 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 10, 2012, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311 "2012-09-10T18:27:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Bambro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@Bambro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bambro)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2012, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/81 "2012-10-24T18:39:26Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Never was going to happen. Same sort of thing would have happened to them. Clay don’t share. He kills his close friends regularly. He would kill Jax if he could. > > That is the final straw for me. Too manipulative. I won’t watch anymore unless the kid survives mostly unharmed. He’s bleeding enough to be dead in minutes. I almost stopped watching when they kidnapped him. Yeah, evil blows back on innocent kids, but I don’t find it entertaining. I suspect that he will survive but they are going to use this as a catalyst for Wendy really pushing for custody. Just a SWAG though. But it seems to me that Sutter wouldn’t have spent so much time in the earlier episodes of the season pulling Wendy back into the show to then just remove her one and only connection to anything by having Abel die. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2012, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/82 "2012-10-24T22:30:46Z")
Just think that it is a really shitty thing to do to a kid, even if he is fictional. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2012, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/83 "2012-10-25T00:34:02Z")
> [@Minnie\_Luna](#): > > Regarding Juice-both Sutter and Rossi have said Juice isn’t necessarily the sharpest tool in the drawer. I think he is pretty easily manipulated and got really lucky last season that his shit didn’t hit the fan. Even a rock would start questioning Clay at this point. He looked like he wanted to spill it when they came in to say that the Nomads had been killed. “Clay asked me to watch until these guys showed up at Unser’s. And then he tells me to leave when they get there. How did he know they were gonna show up there _today_?? And then they got shot!” ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2012, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/84 "2012-10-25T01:11:29Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > Just think that it is a really shitty thing to do to a kid, even if he is fictional. And this is why kids in film and TV are usually nigh-immortal. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2012, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/85 "2012-10-25T05:32:23Z")
Does pot make you sleepy? I still don’t get why Gemma crashed. It looked as if she was dozing off. IME people who are high drive really slowly and carefully, they don’t fall asleep at the wheel. The whole thing seems manipulative and unnecessary. Someone jog my memory - did Jax tell Tara that Clay had tried to kill her? ---
**Author:** ![Enright3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/enright3/32/2897_2.png) [@Enright3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enright3)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2012, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/86 "2012-10-25T14:11:18Z")
> [@HazelNutCoffee](#): > > Does pot make you sleepy? I still don’t get why Gemma crashed. It looked as if she was dozing off. IME people who are high drive really slowly and carefully, they don’t fall asleep at the wheel. The whole thing seems manipulative and unnecessary. > > Someone jog my memory - did Jax tell Tara that Clay had tried to kill her? I don’t think so, but I’m pretty sure Gemma told her. ---
**Author:** ![jayrey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/47e85d/32.png) [@jayrey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayrey)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2012, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/87 "2012-10-26T20:31:20Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > That is the final straw for me. Too manipulative. I won’t watch anymore unless the kid survives mostly unharmed. He’s bleeding enough to be dead in minutes. I almost stopped watching when they kidnapped him. Yeah, evil blows back on innocent kids, but I don’t find it entertaining. I have to say, **TSS** , that that was my first thought after the last episode. (Well, really, it was my second thought. My first thought was, “Oh holy fuck, did I really see that?!?” :eek:) I think, however, that we’re going to learn that Abel had a nasty head wound that bled a lot but that he didn’t die. That said, just thinking out loud about other possible scenarios: If Abel dies, Tara will kill Gemma, if Gemma doesn’t kill herself first. Does Tara go to jail? Or does Unser/the club/Pope/somebody with connections clean it all up? Regardless of whether Abel lives or dies, Gemma now will be cast out and ultimately will kill herself, either with pills, a gun or through reckless behavior. Not much different than how she’s been behaving all season. :dubious: IMHO, Gemma’s days are numbered. Now I’m wondering that, if Abel does die, would his death serve to set up some weird sort of “complete the circle” idea, a reprise of the idea of Gemma’s first son dying and Jax, the second son, having to carry all her love and compulsions for the remainer of her life? Jax’s first son will have died and Thomas, the second son, will get to carry the burden, handed down from generation to generation. A sins of the fathers kind of thing. Possible but too banal, IMO: Abel is severely injured. We go through several tense episodes waiting to learn, finally, that he’ll live. Wendy now has plenty of ammo to fight for custody. If so, so what? The tension of that seems pretty thin compared to everything else that’s been going on so far this season. I’m almost afraid to watch next week’s episode. ---
**Author:** ![Bambro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df705f/32.png) [@Bambro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bambro)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2012, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/88 "2012-10-30T13:44:41Z")
> **['Sons of Anarchy' season 5: Get ready for some extended episodes](https://cartermatt.com/38353/sons-of-anarchy-season-5-get-ready-for-some-extended-episodes/)** > > You have to love the sort of freedom that FX gives “Sons of Anarchy” showrunner Kurt Sutter. Not only does he often get to make the content that he wants, but he also does not have to frequently worry about trying to cram all of his story until 42... > [@](#): > > In a recent video, Sutter explained that episode 9 (which you can find a bit more about here) is going to be 75 minutes long; in addition to that, every episode moving forward from there is going to be 90 minutes long. Woohoo! Extended episodes the rest of the season. ---
**Author:** ![MeanJoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanjoe/32/5693_2.png) [@MeanJoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanJoe)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/89 "2012-10-31T14:09:26Z")
I feel like a cheerleader here each week, running in waving pom-pons about how good this season is so far! Haha. From the previews, when they kept showing someone on their knees with the samcro patch, and as the episode played out I was convinced we were going to see Juice killed for being an informer. Juice is probably the one character I feel the most empathy towards. A part of me knows his days are probably numbered and confessing to Clay was just one more bone-numbingly stupid thing he has done. I can’t help but hoping though that somehow he will be instrumental in bringing Clay down and escape getting killed. Also, no way Gemma delivers on Clay. She is far to broken inside - she needs people like Clay to fill that emptiness inside her and be her partner in plots and manipulation and secrets. She is always looking for any angle to gain advantage and I don’t see her being a compliant pawn in this plan of Jax. Speaking of Jax and plans, here is a plan Jax. With all those times you are alone with Clay and all that you know about him and what he has done, just shoot the son of a bitch. I mean seriously, think about all the shit Clay has done to Jax starting with murdering his father. Just. Shoot. Him. Anyway, for the first time this season I got a little trepidation on the previews for next week. Frankie has mob protection? C’mon, do we need another illegal organization on this show thrown into the mix? ---
**Author:** ![SykoSkotty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c0e974/32.png) [@SykoSkotty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SykoSkotty)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/90 "2012-10-31T14:36:47Z")
I’m starting to get fed up with this show. I’m a huge fan but this whole Clay thing just keeps going in circles with no explanation. Last season Jax needed to keep Clay alive for the gun deal with the Irish. Well, that deal’s done, so why hasn’t Jax killed Clay? It makes no sense. Now all of a sudden Jax has a new plan to prove that Clay was behind the Nomad home invasions? He told Tara that if he proves it, then they can put it to a vote to oust Clay and kill him… Great. Just great. Another “plan” that will take up an entire season (or two) only to have it fall apart at the end because something else will happen. I’m getting really tired of running in circles with this show. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2012, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/91 "2012-10-31T23:28:31Z")
That was like watching 24 last night. There was too much going on. And I finally felt manipulated over the whole car crash with Gemma thing. It went all haywire and back too quickly. I’d like to see more club stuff that didn’t focus on the Clay dilemma. More Nero would be nice. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/92 "2012-11-01T02:25:52Z")
Why is Juice so bloody stupid? Also, I can’t take Frankie seriously. His facial hair is ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![Xan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ac8455/32.png) [@Xan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xan)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/93 "2012-11-01T05:58:02Z")
> [@HazelNutCoffee](#): > > Why is Juice so bloody stupid? > > Also, I can’t take Frankie seriously. His facial hair is ridiculous. Because someone needs to be or the plot won’t go anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![RogueRacer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7ab992/32.png) [@RogueRacer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RogueRacer)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/94 "2012-11-01T17:48:29Z")
> [@HazelNutCoffee](#): > > Also, I can’t take Frankie seriously. His facial hair is ridiculous. Just don’t tell that to the actor’s (Chuck Zito) face. He was in the Hells Angels for 25 years, was a professional body guard for some pretty big name celebrities, and has a black belt in Karate. ---
**Author:** ![Xan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/ac8455/32.png) [@Xan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xan)\ **Post date:** [November 1, 2012, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/95 "2012-11-01T18:23:33Z")
> [@RogueRacer](#): > > Just don’t tell that to the actor’s (Chuck Zito) face. He was in the Hells Angels for 25 years, was a professional body guard for some pretty big name celebrities, and has a black belt in Karate. In other words he’s as scummy as his character. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/96 "2012-11-02T08:24:43Z")
> [@SykoSkotty](#): > > I’m starting to get fed up with this show. I’m a huge fan but this whole Clay thing just keeps going in circles with no explanation. Last season Jax needed to keep Clay alive for the gun deal with the Irish. Well, that deal’s done, so why hasn’t Jax killed Clay? It makes no sense. Now all of a sudden Jax has a new plan to prove that Clay was behind the Nomad home invasions? He told Tara that if he proves it, then they can put it to a vote to oust Clay and kill him… > > Great. Just great. Another “plan” that will take up an entire season (or two) only to have it fall apart at the end because something else will happen. > > I’m getting really tired of running in circles with this show. I can’t defend many of the show’s implausibilities and other unlikely machinations, but Jax can’t just kill another, very senior member of the gang without backing from a vote brought to the table. He does that, and then none of the members can be sure if/when he’s just going to up and kill them, and every internal power struggle gets bloody. The whole gang is supposed to be built on trust and brotherhood; you don’t just kill another member without consensus - that’s the kind of stuff that led to Clay’s (and the club’s) downward spiral. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2012, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/97 "2012-11-08T02:00:44Z")
What the hell was that Tara masturbating scene about. Why is she turned on by Luann’s perfume? The whole thing seemed pretty creepy. So what do you think Jax is going to do to Juice? Force him to spy on Clay? Kick him out of the club? Execute him outright? ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2012, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/98 "2012-11-08T07:56:49Z")
> [@HazelNutCoffee](#): > > What the hell was that Tara masturbating scene about. Why is she turned on by Luann’s perfume? The whole thing seemed pretty creepy. LOL! \*She \*wasn’t masturbating and \*she \*wasn’t turned on by the perfume. She brought that perfume to tug at Otto’s heartstrings and try to get him to come back around to the club with some fond memories. It was \*Otto \*who wanted to catch a whiff of femininity and feel her touch while _he_ masturbated himself. The whole thing took her by surprise, and I’m sure she wasn’t thrilled by it, but she took one for the team, and let him get his rocks off while she stood there caressing his (big) head. ---
**Author:** ![HazelNutCoffee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@HazelNutCoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HazelNutCoffee)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2012, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/99 "2012-11-08T08:01:13Z")
I meant after she got home. She took out Luann’s perfume, applied it on her own wrist, sniffed it, and started touching herself. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2012, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311/100 "2012-11-09T01:22:38Z")
Yes, she did that right after she got out of the shower and while she was looking in the mirror. Very strange. Unless she now finds herself attracted to Otto. \< shocked \> [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sons-of-anarchy-9-11/634311.md?page=6)