# Sorry people, but Linux sucks! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 21, 2003, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501 "2003-11-21T15:03:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/141 "2003-12-27T05:06:06Z")
Yep. Linux, seeing as how it’s basically unix under the hood, is a complicated, nasty beast when everything doesn’t work just right. If you _want_ to learn how to look under the hood, it’s a heck of a fun thing, stable, and a delight to use. Especially for getting work done. (Like movies. Lots of films made with FilmGimp these days… probably anything by Lucas or Disney, for starters) Also, it’s a great server operating system. You know, serving files, web pages, what have you. If you don’t want to look under the hood… probably not the best thing in the world to use. Yet. Working on it. Lynn: Actually, yeah, you can _definately_ play the Zorks in Linux. I think Fallout works, too. But that’s not really all that relevant. Gorilla: “Yep, if it doesn’t work, it’s ignored, it’s frustrating, it’s got a steeper than heck learning curve.” That’s about how it goes, about the size of the issue. Statement of agreement. Not pitworthy. Note: Your Alcatel. Is it connected via USB or through the network card? If it’s routed through the network card, it should just plain work. USB is trickier… generally, not a great idea, either, even in XP. ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/142 "2003-12-27T06:33:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by leenmi \* > **Not sure what you mean by hardware based. I’m talking about PCI modems.** [Here’s a page](http://www.56k.com/reports/winmodem.shtml) about the differences between software and hardware based modems. Basically, you can imagine a modem as made of two parts - one part translates 1s and 0s into audio signals (and vice versa); the other part implements the AT command set, compression and encryption protocols, and is responsible for deciding _which_ 1s and 0s get sent. The cheapest modems implement both parts in software, and the modem hardware itself is little more than a sound card connected to a phone jack. This creates the biggest drain on your CPU and is the hardest to use from another operating system. The most portable modems implement both parts in hardware; they can work with any OS and don’t use up CPU cycles. Some “controllerless” modems implement the first part in hardware and the second part in software. If you see a modem for $10, you can be 99% sure that one or both parts is implemented in software, even if it’s PCI or USB. [Linmodems.org](http://www.linmodems.org) has information about using winmodems from Linux. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/143 "2003-12-27T09:12:44Z")
> [@](#): > > Lynn Bondoni: The reason that there’ll likely never be an OS that’s fully compatible with all of the others is because Microsoft and Apple have closed API’s. There have been projects with some success (WINE, etc), but it’s an uphill battle. HOWEVER, my real question is… I understand, you like your Fallout, but ZORK? As in, Infocom text adventure, likely to be eaten by a grue ZORK? A quick search on [freshmeat.net](http://freshmeat.net) reveals at least six Infocom interpreters, and even an app for reading the Invisiclues. > > …not quite pit-worthy. Not just my text adventures. I have Return to Zork, Zork: Nemesis (which I don’t recommend) and Zork: Grand Inquisitor (which I DO recommend). NOBODY will separate me from my Zorks! Well, I might let you have Zork: Nemesis if you asked real nice… ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/144 "2003-12-27T09:25:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mr2001 \* > **… the other part implements the AT command set, compression and encryption protocols …** Er, “encryption” should read “error correction”. ---
**Author:** ![outside\_artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@outside\_artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outside_artist)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/145 "2003-12-27T20:05:05Z")
Kind of off the subject, but… I was justwatching this documentary about the whole Linux thing as I really do not know a great deal about it. According to the film, they sort of closed up in 2001 due to Bill Gates setting the dogs on them, and they didn’t have the dough to do anything about it. It really seemed as thought the guy (Stallman?) who conceived of the thing was trying to do good for the masses, and I sort of felt bad for him, although such altruistic goals always make me suspicious. What was the deal with it? How did they get back on track after Gates shut them down, and is it really a free system? ---
**Author:** ![black\_rabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/f19dbf/32.png) [@black\_rabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/black_rabbit)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/146 "2003-12-27T20:39:32Z")
How in the world would Bill Gates shut down Linux? I duon’t know what documentary you saw, but nothing of the kind has ever happened. [Ragib Hasan’s History of Linux](http://ragib.hypermart.net/linux/). Worth a read, if you’re especially fascinated. ---
**Author:** ![alterego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6bbea6/32.png) [@alterego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alterego)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/147 "2003-12-27T21:06:48Z")
Linux and Unix are good for servers, and thats about it. I tried installing Linux on my laptop and they both had an effing conniption fit. So did I, for that matter. ---
**Author:** ![outside\_artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@outside\_artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outside_artist)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2003, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/148 "2003-12-27T22:23:28Z")
**Black…** , The name of the docu was “Revolution OS”. It wasn’t the best production I have ever seen, as it was at times vague and hard to follow. The way one was aware of how Microsoft responded to the fact that, once Linux went public and it’s stocks traded up for the first time at a higher ratio than any other stock up until that time, was they just showed a bit of writing on the screen at what was practically the final scene of the film, to show that Micro launched a program that screwed it up so badly that the stocks then plummeted. This was really all that was said about it , and then boom. End of film. So I don’t know . Maybe I’d better look at that book. ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2003, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/149 "2003-12-28T02:00:37Z")
Linux doesn’t have stocks, it’s not a corporation. Linux is developed by thousands of people worldwide, some being paid by various companies to work on it, some working in their own free time. Perhaps they were talking about Red Hat or another company that sells Linux _distributions_ and tech support. The distribution is a package containing the Linux kernel (the very core of the OS, which is free), a bunch of other software that users expect their operating system to have (usually also free), and some customized software to help with installation and maintenance (often not free). ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2003, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/150 "2003-12-28T02:14:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by alterego \* > \*\*Linux and Unix are good for servers, and thats about it. > > I tried installing Linux on my laptop and they both had an effing conniption fit. > > So did I, for that matter. \*\* This does not prove that Linux and Unix are only good for servers. It proves that Linux was not right for you. I use Linux on the desktop, on my laptops and make a living working with Unix on servers. I’m thrilled with Mandrake Linux. With the exception of comprehensive hardware support (which is not Mandrake’s fault, it’s a matter of hardware vendors not needing to put forth the effort), I believe Mandrake is superior to Windows. Not kidding. And **Not a Well Woman** , Microsoft hasn’t come close to killing Linux. They have spread some FUD and played up perceived strengths of Windows versus weaknesses of Linux, but this is what almost all companies do when faced with competition. Also, Stallman is more appropriately identified with GNU and Free Software. Stallman, depending on your point of view, is a visionary or a kook. He believes, amongst several other things, that software should be free. GNU aims to put out free alternatives to proprietary or cost based software. (gcc - GNU c compiler, GNOME - GNU window manager, etc…). More information can be found at [www.gnu.org](http://www.gnu.org) Linus Torvalds started the whole Linux thing (Linux is a play on his name). GNU software runs on Linux (and Solaris and Windows and AIX and HP-UX and FreeBSD). In fact, GNU software provides much of the functionality for the Linux user’s experience. (Try getting by without gcc). But this is because it is free software governed by the general public license (GPL) and free. Did I mention free? Being free, it is possible for the Linux, BSD and other communities to create software, build on other’s experience and distribute their efforts without running into legal or financial trouble. I’ll stop now. ---
**Author:** ![outside\_artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@outside\_artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outside_artist)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2003, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/151 "2003-12-28T22:51:39Z")
**Mr2001, leenmi** , I think you have a point. I didn’t know the diff between Linux and Linux kernel OS, which is more what the film was talking about. Have you seen it? I would be interested in your opinion. Stallman struck me as a real character. How did he intend to recieve any sort of compensation for his product, or didn’t he care? If he didn’t, I am curious as to what type of lifestyle he has that he could waive such an opportunity. Weird guy, but knowing some MIT grads as I do, I’m not surprised. ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2003, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/152 "2003-12-29T01:00:31Z")
Haven’t seen the film. GNU’s [free software philosophy](http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) can be found here. Stallman isn’t opposed to making money or commercial software. He’s opposed to closed-source and proprietary standards standing in the way. Red Hat and other distributions are examples of commercial uses of free software. Red Hat bundles together an operating system that includes the kernel, configuration tools and useful apps. They wrap it up in a pretty package and give it away. They even give away their source code so you can see exactly how they did it or maybe find a better way of doing things. And when you have a problem, you can fix it yourself or pay them for support. They’ll also sell you a boxed copy of what they give away for free. It sounds silly when put bluntly, but sometimes, it’s worth it. ---
**Author:** ![outside\_artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7993a0/32.png) [@outside\_artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outside_artist)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2003, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/153 "2003-12-29T23:37:30Z")
How interesting. I will look into it . Right now I have very little computer knowledge. Thank You ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_Holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a5b964/32.png) [@Mycroft\_Holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_Holmes)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/154 "2003-12-30T13:18:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GorillaMan \* > \*\*Sorry, I was ranting about my Alcatel ADSL modem, which seems to have been distributed throughout Europe judging by the nuumber of French, German and Dutch Google results…Trouble is, it supposedly has ‘great’ support online, but everything suggested came out with errors or blanks, and every appeal to a message board or a mail list either got “rtfm” (as if), or “go back to windows” (durrrrrr), or “never mind it’s still better than M$”…or “tell us every log file you’ve ever had and we’ll try and work it out” ARRGHHH \*\* **GorillaMan** , if it’s an Alcatel modem connected via USB (is it the SpeedTouch, that looks kind of like a fat, green manta ray?), Mandrake 9.1 and 9.2 (and I think the newest SuSe and RedHat distros) has the drivers for this modem included. I have Mandrake 9.1 installed at home, and it connects my Alcatel SpeedTouch USB modem at boot up automatically, and it works just fine. You can also download the driver, etc. as an rpm from [here.](http://rpms.mandrakeclub.com/rpms/mandrake/9.2/i586/Mandrake/RPMS/speedtouch-1.2-1mdk.i586.html) ---
**Author:** ![Cerri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3bc359/32.png) [@Cerri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cerri)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/155 "2003-12-30T13:27:36Z")
When Linux can run all the latest PC games, maybe I’ll give it a shot. However, since one of my big hobbies is beta testing the games of the future, it doesn’t really sound like Linux is for me. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/156 "2003-12-30T14:27:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mycroft Holmes \* > \*\ ***GorillaMan** , if it’s an Alcatel modem connected via USB (is it the SpeedTouch, that looks kind of like a fat, green manta ray?), Mandrake 9.1 and 9.2 (and I think the newest SuSe and RedHat distros) has the drivers for this modem included. I have Mandrake 9.1 installed at home, and it connects my Alcatel SpeedTouch USB modem at boot up automatically, and it works just fine. > > You can also download the driver, etc. as an rpm from [here.](http://rpms.mandrakeclub.com/rpms/mandrake/9.2/i586/Mandrake/RPMS/speedtouch-1.2-1mdk.i586.html) \*\* Intrtiguing…I’ll give it a go, once I’ve got a new hard drive (amazing how quickly 40GB fills up 😉 ). Although Mandrake’s hardware database doesn’t list it as supported… ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_Holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a5b964/32.png) [@Mycroft\_Holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_Holmes)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/157 "2003-12-30T15:07:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GorillaMan \* > \*\*Intrtiguing…I’ll give it a go, once I’ve got a new hard drive (amazing how quickly 40GB fills up 😉 ). Although Mandrake’s hardware database doesn’t list it as supported… \*\* You’re right. I checked also, and the Alcatel SpeedTouch USB modem is only listed as “known hardware”, which means that it has been reported as compatible by someone in the community of users and developers. That’s strange, because I _know_ that the drivers are included in the full distribution of Mandrake 9.1 (three .iso images). [Here](http://www.speedtouchdsl.com/pdf/datasheetusb.pdf) is a .pdf with a picture of my modem and some more specs on it. If you have the same Alcatel modem, Mandrake 9.1 or 9.2 should work for you. They also have the additional advantage of being pretty easy to install and configure, without once having to use a command line. That can be pretty handy for someone just starting to use Linux. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/158 "2003-12-30T15:44:21Z")
Thanks 🙂 …it’s not the same modem, but I’m guessing (hoping) it’s similar, or even just a redesigned case - lol it’s silver and looks less silly :p. Mandrake here I come…and I might end up taking back a lot of what I said ^ 😃 ---
**Author:** ![leenmi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f1d935/32.png) [@leenmi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leenmi)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/159 "2003-12-30T16:56:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cerri \* > \*\*When Linux can run all the latest PC games, maybe I’ll give it a shot. However, since one of my big hobbies is beta testing the games of the future, it doesn’t really sound like Linux is for me. \*\* Thanks for stopping by. And I’m sure I speak for all of us when I say good for you. Your mother must be proud. Got anything else off topic that you want to brag about? Linux _can_ run the latest PC games. Nothing stopping it except the vendors haven’t ported the software. So, your statement should be _when software makers start making versions of the latest PC games for Linux_, maybe you’ll give it a shot. Sweet of you. So glad that you might, someday, consider Linux. ---
**Author:** ![Ms2001](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ms2001/32/18463_2.png) [@Ms2001](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ms2001)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2003, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501/160 "2003-12-30T22:47:37Z")
With [WineX](http://www.transgaming.com/), Linux can run a lot of newer PC games, even if they haven’t been ported. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sorry-people-but-linux-sucks/214501.md?page=7)