# Source? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 19, 2013, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647 "2013-08-19T17:31:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/21 "2013-08-19T23:16:33Z")
As I like to say, before you can debate WHY something is true, you must first establish IF it is true. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/22 "2013-08-19T23:18:17Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Wikipedia does not allow its editors to do original research, not because they are in any way opposed to original research, but because that’s not what an encyclopedia is for. IIRC, though, there are other projects run by the same organization that do allow and encourage original research. I read an [article](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/30/magazine/jimmy-wales-is-not-an-internet-billionaire.html) about Jimmy Wales (the founder of Wikipedia). It described how when he meets celebrities, they often complain to him about errors on their Wikipedia pages. One such example, “the hip-hop artist Will.i.am stopped Wales to complain about an error on his Wikipedia page. ‘Everyone thinks he’s William James Adams Jr., but it’s not James and it’s not junior’”, Wales told the journalist as Wales changed the page for Will.i.am. This was followed by complaints that the change was uncited. It’s a little bit ridiculous. But on the other hand, how else are you going to police and verify changes on a giant encyclopedia like that, if you don’t insist on published sources? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2013, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/23 "2013-08-19T23:34:48Z")
> [@runningdude](#): > > When people replying with “source?” to then end of an argument, I am so frustrated. It is intended as an intellectual reply, but demonstrates a complete lack of critical thinking, and not to mention rude. [checks forum] You really are an idiot, aren’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/24 "2013-08-20T00:20:43Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > [checks forum] > > You really are an idiot, aren’t you? Well, he’s got me agreeing with you, in the Pit…so I think he must be Satan. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/25 "2013-08-20T01:32:36Z")
**Satan**? Can we accuse members of being socks in the Pit? ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/26 "2013-08-20T02:39:38Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > **Satan**? Can we accuse members of being socks in the Pit? As far as I know, we can, but I wasn’t in this instance. Satan the poster was before my time. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/27 "2013-08-20T03:17:59Z")
There’s someone else named Satan? It’s a cool-sounding name but **Satan** and I did not see eye to eye and it kinda ruined the name for me. But that was 13 years ago and since this one made you and **BG** agree on something, is this one worthy of my worship? ;)\<–Something **Satan** hated. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/28 "2013-08-20T03:34:27Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > You are really new at this huh? I think his problem is that he is new here and doesn’t know that the lion’s share of posters at the SDMB generally don’t pull facts out of their asses, and citations are usually asked of newbies and the usual gang of idiots because everybody else knows the rules and doesn’t come to a gunfight without supporting evidence, and how that differs from many other boards. He may also not know that near the bottom of a Wikipedia entry there is a list of references used in preparing the entry and if you follow those links to the original source nobody knows you got your info from Wikipedia. That is the mistake lazy students make. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/29 "2013-08-20T03:45:10Z")
> [@runningdude](#): > > I am flaming a specific incident, albeit on a different forum, where I posted a complicated argument in response to the topic, and got the “sauce?” from some misguided soul. Other people provided perfectly helpful or valid criticism, but then this guy… Turns out he only wanted clarification on a particular factual point, but how the hell would I know that? Similar things have happened more than once… Well I should tell you a secret, one of the reasons I come to this forum is to learn, not only English, but the information behind many controversial topics, If I was an expert on an specific topic I would report on the specifics, and when a “Cite?” request appears I do know were to link to. But what happens when I’m not an expert in a subject? How to get the proper cite? Ah, then the educational aspect of the searches I like to do enters the picture, I do think that Nate Silver of political polling fame does this, I think he is good because he checks if the polling organizations he uses are giving him good data, but he does not stop there, he also qualifies how accurate the polling organizations are and looks at the quality of the methods that they use. I admit that this takes awhile, but once I identified several sources that are not afraid of debunking popular assumptions (some that even exist among your peers) then very relevant citations appear on the ready. “Right” you can say, “but who has time for that?” I would say that then you need to clean and get better bookmarks. 🙂 What I’m saying here is that sometimes good sources of information are hard to identify, but once you know what to look for the process that allows you to separate the good from the bad gets easier. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/30 "2013-08-20T05:35:20Z")
> [@runningdude](#): > > When people replying with “source?” to then end of an argument, I am so frustrated. All your Base are? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/31 "2013-08-20T06:20:32Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Well I should tell you a secret, one of the reasons I come to this forum is to learn, not only English, but the information behind many controversial topics . . . Was English not your native language? You are very good at it indeed! Alas, one of the most important reasons I read the SDMB is not to learn the truth, but to “unlearn” all the things that I have picked up over the years, which I thought were true but which turn out to be crap. I’m filtering out all my “un-knowledge,” with far more vigor than I am picking up new true knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/32 "2013-08-20T11:14:18Z")
I’m just here for the kitty cat pictures, myself. ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/33 "2013-08-20T11:36:45Z")
I was told there would be cake. I am still waiting. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/34 "2013-08-20T14:21:37Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > I was told there would be cake. I am still waiting. The cake is a lie. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/35 "2013-08-20T14:44:20Z")
There is cake. There has always been cake. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/36 "2013-08-20T15:23:58Z")
> [@Lynn\_Bodoni](#): > > I’m just here for the kitty cat pictures, myself. [Source.](http://icanhas.cheezburger.com/) ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/37 "2013-08-20T15:55:59Z")
[Sores](http://www.webmd.com/skin-problems-and-treatments/picture-of-cold-sores) ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/38 "2013-08-20T16:13:14Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > The cake is a lie. The pie is a pun. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/39 "2013-08-20T16:21:47Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Was English not your native language? You are very good at it indeed! 🙂 Thank you for that, yes, English is my second language, however as I work in an educational setting I have to accept that good enough is not good for teaching students, so I stick to science and technology. Still, I have to say that I’m aware of even native Americans 😉 that are teaching grammar that are worse than I am so I constantly wonder if I’m sandbagging myself. Dunn and Krueger reported on what happens to the ones that have good meta cognition, in essence it is a confirmation of the old saying that: \* The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.\* - Bertrand Russell [knee jerk search] Dammit, you see! I got so accustomed to doubt quotes that I had to confirm it, in reality Russell said thus: > **[Bertrand Russell - Wikiquote](https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bertrand_Russell)** > [@](#): > > The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. Yeah, the paraphrase is more popular, but one should be accurate. 🙂 > [@Trinopus](#): > > Alas, one of the most important reasons I read the SDMB is not to learn the truth, but to “unlearn” all the things that I have picked up over the years, which I thought were true but which turn out to be crap. I’m filtering out all my “un-knowledge,” with far more vigor than I am picking up new true knowledge. Oh, don’t worry, I can tell you that just realizing that one has “blind sports” in knowledge is a great advantage over the stubborn asses, one is then aware of what to look for. ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2013, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/source/666647/40 "2013-08-20T20:58:02Z")
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