# South Carolina police officer charged with murder. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 8, 2015, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087 "2015-04-08T01:36:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/81 "2015-04-08T19:29:51Z")
> [@Fallen](#): > > The fight or flight instinct or decision aside, the thing is that police don’t require an excuse to make the decision to arrest, harm or kill you … not until after the fact anyway. I believe the guy must have been terrified not to reason that they had his car and knew who he was and where he lived. If he eluded the police, they would be waiting for him at his home. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/82 "2015-04-08T19:34:02Z")
We had that happen to a guy in my high school. He did the Dukes of Hazard thing down in the oilfields in South Arkansas. Ripping down these country roads that he knew really well. Cops broke off the pursuit. Arrested him that night at his mom’s house. He had a long, long list of charges from that incident. I have no idea how long his license was suspended. Had to be several years. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/83 "2015-04-08T19:58:54Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I certainly didn’t mean to sound as though I am one the side of the policeman. > Allow me to rephrase: Certainly most Black people in the country know that if you run, the murderous bastard will have an excuse to shoot you. Or, “When will they learn to bow to their masters?”! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Stuffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f17d59/32.png) [@Stuffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stuffy)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/84 "2015-04-08T19:59:48Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I believe the guy must have been terrified not to reason that they had his car and knew who he was and where he lived. If he eluded the police, they would be waiting for him at his home. This happened on an episode of COPS. As the cop brings out the cuffs the dude took off, the last you see of him is his tennis shoes fading away in the distance. After the cop and camera man walk back to patrol car the guy trots back up apologizes and says something like… > [@some vaguely remembered black dude](#): > > I don’t know why I ran, you have my license and that’s my adress… ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/85 "2015-04-08T20:01:11Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > AFAIK, at least up here, the cops run your plates before they get out of their car. > > By running away, he could have come up on the officer from behind! Well, as we’ve been told many times on the dope, black people are just genetically faster than other people. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/86 "2015-04-08T20:04:51Z")
> [@Kaio](#): > > At that point you have to press the contacts against a person’s body to stun them. There’s only one set of projectiles. Likely true but not 100%. Taser does make a model, the X2, with two modules (seriously that’s the model name :smack:… silly marketers.) > [@aceplace57](#): > > The problem for the police is they don’t know the reason why a suspect runs. Is it for something non-violent like drugs or back child support? If so, then there’s no reason to use force. But the cops don’t know why he’s running. You need reason to pull the trigger. It’s not a matter of needing a reason to NOT pull the trigger. Simply running/hiding in a lot of states is only a misdemeanor unless there are other elements to bring it up to felony status. Of course the question is SC law… ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/87 "2015-04-08T20:08:17Z")
> [@Si\_Amigo](#): > > Or, “When will they learn to bow to their masters?”! :rolleyes: I continue to come off badlt. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/88 "2015-04-08T20:15:07Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > :rolleyes: yeah right. You’re really going to abandoned a $12,000 car on the street and run away because you’re so terrified of the cops. All because of a broken taillight. > > A $50 ticket and it becomes a felony for fleeing from the police. That makes a lot of sense for a law abiding, and upstanding citizen. Some people have incredible fear of the police. You may or may not consider it rational, but it’s within the realm of possibility that some people’s personal experiences are such that the police are _extremely dangerous_ to be around, or even to cooperate with. I’ll put it this way – 100 years ago, it would have been entirely reasonable for a black person in South Carolina to be mortally afraid of police officers. The situation is better now overall, but there may still be some people, black and police, who have interacted in ways that some portion of that fear is still reasonable and rational. ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/89 "2015-04-08T20:16:51Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No, absolutely not. The jury’s conclusion is meaningless – they never heard from government witnesses and the trial did not give the government any chance to defend itself. Moreover, the jury simply said, “Government,” and the quasi-verdict did not specify state, federal, or local government. > > There’s an old adage about the population of China being asked about the length of the Emperor’s nose, and the answers averaged together. Is that answer considered very accurate because of the large number of people that contributed to it? Is it more credible because so many people participated? Credulous today, aren’t you? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/90 "2015-04-08T20:17:01Z")
There’s a standard line I use with third graders who try this sort of distraction. The conversation goes something like this: Me: Bill, did you hit Joe in the bathroom? Bill: JOE WAS TALKING TO ME AND HE SAID– Me: Hold up. Stop. Think about what you’re about to say. Do you think that the thing Joe said means that you’re allowed to hit him? Do you think you’re going to tell me what Joe said, and I’ll say, “Oh, that’s fine, never mind”? Bill: . . . no. And then I can continue with the conversation. AFTERWARD, if necessary, I’ll ask what Joe said, and figure out if that requires further action. But it generally has no bearing on whatever Bill did. **aceplace** , Hold up. Stop. Think about what you’re about to say. Do you think that the thing the dead guy did means that the cop was allowed to shoot him? Do you think you’re going to tell me what the dead guy did, and I’ll say, “Oh, that’s fine, never mind”? Because if you don’t think so, then leave that shit out of the conversation. It’s not relevant. Shit. Lots of time when someone gets murdered, they did something to provoke the murderer. Maybe they cheated on their spouse, or maybe they cheated with the murderer’s spouse. Maybe they stole some drugs. Maybe they made fun of the murderer’s mom. Maybe they deliberately and willfully put on that game show that the murderer hates. But guess what kind of defense we don’t allow in court cases? ---
**Author:** ![get\_lives](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@get\_lives](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/get_lives)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/91 "2015-04-08T20:22:12Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > The same “Deep South” people on which you are such a self reported expert, the ones who according to you don’t give a F%&\*, concluded 30 years after the fact that the government murdered a black man in the 60’s. The same “Deep South” people who, again according to you, would never convict a cop of the same thing in 2015 despite much more evidence. > > Facts don’t appear to matter to you and even your unsupported opinions conflict. :rolleyes: Didn’t you just get embarrassed by me in a GQ thread? I’m just going to leave you alone so you can lick your wounds. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/92 "2015-04-08T20:24:13Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Geez. I can’t even _agree_ with you people without you finding something to complain about, can I? I’d feel better if you would say the cop committed murder. Screwed up big time sounds too much like “mistakes were made”. This was a cold-blooding killing coupled by planting of evidence and false testimony. I hope he gets life and is put in a cell with about 4 burly black guys. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/93 "2015-04-08T20:31:32Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > Right keep it simple. Don’t run from the cops over a silly tail light or back child support. Be a man, let the officer write the ticket and go on your way. If he arrests you for child support you’ll get bonded out probably that day or the next morning. > > This is simple stuff. Thousands and thousands of citizens interact with the police every day. There’s no reason to do something stupid like running. That just escalates it to a felony… As long as we’re keeping it simple, how about police don’t murder people? Is that on your checklist of things to simplify? Cops not murdering people? And as far as escalating things to a felony, that felony is murder. Just because the shooter was white and just because he wore a badge and just because the victim was black doesn’t make it not murder. Simple, right? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/94 "2015-04-08T20:38:01Z")
I’m assuming he did have outstanding warrants, why else run? That’s not the point - he was an obese 50-year old more jogging than running in the direction of the cops partner, and the cop himself at no time issued a verbal warning. It’s idle, callous, murderous policing. ---
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/95 "2015-04-08T20:46:18Z")
Here is the local newspaper’s article on the story before the video came out. Note how the cop’s version of the story is the one taken at face value. [http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20150406/PC16/150409558/1268/north-charleston-police-say-officer-who-fatally-shot-man-pulled-him-over-because-of-brake-light&source=RSS](http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20150406/PC16/150409558/1268/north-charleston-police-say-officer-who-fatally-shot-man-pulled-him-over-because-of-brake-light&source=RSS) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/96 "2015-04-08T20:48:11Z")
This thread is interesting to say the least. You don’t run from cops. You just don’t. When you do you are signalling that you’re potentially dangerous. If you’re lucky the cop will taser you and arrest. The gun is option 2. There’s consequences for people’s poor choices and actions. Drive 90 mph down a city street. You will probably wreck and die. Running from a cop runs the same risks. I agree in this situation the cop over reacted. He has been charged with murder and now the facts can be brought before a jury. It does appear in the video that he manipulated the crime scene. That makes him a bad cop. He’ll probably end up in prison. This wouldn’t have happened if the guy had stayed put. Offered no resistance. Bail bondsman are on call 24/7. He would have been home in time for supper. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/97 "2015-04-08T20:48:32Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I continue to come off badlt. :dubious: No, I just couldn’t pass up the opportunity to make a smart ass remark. Or maybe I was afraid if I ran from it you would shoot me. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/98 "2015-04-08T20:52:20Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > This wouldn’t have happened if the guy had stayed put. Offered no resistance. Bail bondsman are on call 24/7. He would have been home in time for supper. And just how do you know that he wouldn’t have just killed him right there and planted the taser in his hand? I mean, because that is actually what the cop did anyway. Does he have to just stand there and take it? The cop was pretty much shown to be a cold blooded killer on video and yet you contend that he should have just stayed put. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/99 "2015-04-08T20:52:21Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > This wouldn’t have happened if the guy had stayed put. Offered no resistance. Bail bondsman are on call 24/7. He would have been home in time for supper. You can’t know that. Maybe the officer would have shot him in the parking lot next to his car. But I agree, running from the police is almost always a bad decision. Many people make many bad decisions. Generally, we don’t excuse murder when that happens. ---
**Author:** ![Fallen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e99b99/32.png) [@Fallen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fallen)\ **Post date:** [April 8, 2015, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087/100 "2015-04-08T20:52:57Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > This wouldn’t have happened if the guy had stayed put. Offered no resistance. Bail bondsman are on call 24/7. He would have been home in time for supper. No one is in any position to declare any part of this. (For all we know, the cop said “hey, I’ll give you a head start … before I start tasering and then shooting”, right?) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/south-carolina-police-officer-charged-with-murder/717087.md?page=6)