# Southern bakers: say goodbye to White Lily flour. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 23, 2008, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946 "2008-06-23T17:55:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/1 "2008-06-23T17:55:51Z")
I have a related Pit thread [here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=472870). The gist is that White Lily Flour, milled since 1883 in downtown Knoxville, Tennessee, is soon to be no more. It is the ultimate flour for biscuits, cakes, and pies, and has been relied upon by generations of Southern cooks. It is an absolute institution here, being so highly prized that, once upon a time, it was saved strictly for use in family Sunday dinners. Smuckers (who bought the mill) have issued statements that, even though they are moving production of the flour to a Midwestern facility, it will be exactly the same. This has thus far proven to be false, since in several blind tests, bakers have been able to identify the differences by sight alone, as well as taste. Read the rest here: > **[Biscuit Bakers’ Treasured Mill Moves North (Published 2008)](https://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/dining/18flour.html?ex=1214452800&en=c7fed15309132e12&ei=5070&emc=eta1)** > > For generations of Southern bakers, the closing of the White Lily flour mill is causing ripples of anxiety that Southern biscuits will never be the same. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/2 "2008-06-23T18:04:40Z")
A lot of people swear by White Lily; just won’t be the same. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/3 "2008-06-23T18:16:51Z")
Time to switch to Martha White. I’ve always preferred Martha White flour for biscuits, anyway. Plus, Martha White has a kick-ass bluegrass jingle. (And it’s got Hot-Rize!) On the other hand, White Lily makes (_made_) the very best cornmeal. ETA - Hmm. Upon further investigation, it looks like Martha White has been a subsidiary of Smuckers for some time now. Sentimental attachment to all things Southern aside, their flour is just fine. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/4 "2008-06-23T18:37:52Z")
Upon even further investigation, Martha White is apparently still milled at Jackson Tennessee. If Smuckers is trying to consolidate milling operations, why not move the White Lily operations to Jackson? (Or Martha White operations to Knoxville?) Odd. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/5 "2008-06-23T19:39:28Z")
With a name like Smuckers, it’s bound to piss somebody off. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/6 "2008-06-23T20:29:42Z")
I only purchase flour endorsed by the Pappy O’Daniel Flour Hour. ---
**Author:** ![RiverRunner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/977dab/32.png) [@RiverRunner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RiverRunner)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/7 "2008-06-23T21:19:21Z")
[QUOTE=spoke-] On the other hand, White Lily makes (_made_) the very best cornmeal. [/QUOTE] This is much truth. RR ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2008, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/8 "2008-06-23T21:22:45Z")
Well, that sucks. Oddly enough, they make Adluh right here but there aren’t many places you can find it for sale. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2008, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/9 "2008-06-24T21:48:15Z")
[QUOTE=KneadToKnow] With a name like Smuckers, it’s bound to piss somebody off. [/QUOTE] With a name like Smuckers, it ought to be easy to compose a limerick appropriate to the situation. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Two\_and\_a\_Half\_Inches\_of\_Fun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea666f/32.png) [@Two\_and\_a\_Half\_Inches\_of\_Fun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_and_a_Half_Inches_of_Fun)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2008, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/10 "2008-06-24T21:53:17Z")
[QUOTE=Ogre] Smuckers (who bought the mill) have issued statements that, even though they are moving production of the flour to a Midwestern facility, it will be exactly the same. This has thus far proven to be false, since in several blind tests, bakers have been able to identify the differences by sight alone, as well as taste. Read the rest here: [http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/dining/18flour.html?ex=1214452800&en=c7fed15309132e12&ei=5070&emc=eta1](http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/dining/18flour.html?ex=1214452800&en=c7fed15309132e12&ei=5070&emc=eta1) [/QUOTE] Have there been several taste tests? The only thing is the article is that two bakers could tell the difference in a blind test. But the article did not even go into whether there were bakers who could not tell the difference or how many bakers were involved. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2008, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-bakers-say-goodbye-to-white-lily-flour/453946/11 "2008-06-24T22:55:05Z")
This seems like a problem the free market is eminently suited to solve. If there’s a demand for this type of flour, I’m sure someone else will produce it.