# Southern Evangelicalism, Arabic Islam and the power of religious communities over individuals **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 8, 2019, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416 "2019-01-08T18:17:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416/21 "2019-01-09T18:33:55Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > No. I’m doing my damnedest to stay out of this thread, but this phrase really bugs me. ‘Arab Muslim’ if it is equivalent to anything is closer to ‘English-speaking Christian’ or in other words it is so broad as to be virtually meaningless. It includes everything from cultural Muslims who are happy to meet you down at the bar for a drink after work, to whackadoo Salafist jihadis and everyone in between. You think you have it bad? I am an actual Muslim here.;)😛 I could call it orientalists clap trap, but that attempted to have a veneer of intellectualism about it. The OP is as deep and knowledgable as KKK pamphlets were. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2019, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416/22 "2019-01-09T18:34:02Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > No. I’m doing my damnedest to stay out of this thread, but this phrase really bugs me. ‘Arab Muslim’ if it is equivalent to anything is closer to ‘English-speaking Christian’ or in other words it is so broad as to be virtually meaningless. It includes everything from cultural Muslims who are happy to meet you down at the bar for a drink after work, to whackadoo Salafist jihadis and everyone in between. Fair enough. Mashriqis? Many white Southern Evangelicals are ok too. Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton are both Baptists from the South or adjacent to it yet their existence doesn’t disprove that white southern Evangelicals have a cultural problem. ---
**Author:** ![JB99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/439d5e/32.png) [@JB99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JB99)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2019, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416/23 "2019-01-09T19:40:24Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > Turkey and Jordan seem to be doing ok (with big caveats since it’s still the Middle East). In the case of Turkey, it’s at least partly because they got a mix of Washington and Robespierre in the person of Ataturk. For Jordan, I’m not sure but it’s not because Jordan is in a particularly advantageous geographic position or wasn’t subjugated by outside powers. Like I said. Some Middle Eastern countries have done a better job of adapting to the modern world. Some have not. I’d be wary about using Turkey as an example, because under Edrogan their situation re: religion vs liberty seems to be getting worse rather than better. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2019, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416/24 "2019-01-09T20:24:55Z")
> [@MichaelEmouse](#): > > The OP doesn’t merely talk about imposing rules (that’s the paraphrasing you used). It more specifically says: > > " have the State impose many rigid rules about how everyone should conduct their own lives. Many Catholics might think that alcoholism is a terrible thing and that we should keep alcohol consumption low but they would balk at the idea of using criminal penalties to stop people from having a cocktail at a bar or a glass of wine at home." I kind of think it’s a bit interesting how you are separating out Catholicism as a faith that doesn’t want the State to impose rigid rules about how everyone should conduct their own lives. Most anti-abortion laws and anti-LGBTQ laws were pushed forward (and their repeal opposed) by the Catholic Church. Just because they were cool with alcohol doesn’t mean they are against the state dictating moral laws. Ask someone from Ireland if the Catholic Church doesn’t have the State impose many rigid rules about how everyone should conduct their own lives. I also think there is a strange linking of Evangelicalism and Muslims and also separating out Catholics. As someone raised Muslim and now Lutheran living in the South (with a 10 year sojourn in atheism between the two), Southern Evangelicalism is FAR more individualistic than Islam, Catholicism, or Lutheranism. The later 3 stress communalism and communal values far more. Evangelicals can be Evangelicals even if they never go to Church on Sundays because communalism and fellowship isn’t that important. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/southern-evangelicalism-arabic-islam-and-the-power-of-religious-communities-over-individuals/827416.md?page=1)