# Sovereign Citizens-- Please tell me this is fake **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 24, 2016, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572 "2016-10-24T07:38:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 51
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1001 "2024-04-29T23:55:01Z")
> In a backpack, Judd said deputies found a fully loaded 40mm handgun. Duh, even in the handgun form factor the 40mm isn’t a reasonable choice for holstered carry. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1002 "2024-04-29T23:55:29Z")
So what is the relationship in general between SovCits and constitutional sheriffs? They seem cut from the same cloth, but it also appears that they have fundamentally different views on who has power and why. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1003 "2024-04-30T00:00:04Z")
I’d say constitutional sheriffs take the existing legal framework of society and twist it to justify their worldview. SovCits don’t acknowledge the framework to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1004 "2024-04-30T00:08:51Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > > In a backpack, Judd said deputies found a fully loaded 40mm handgun. > > Duh, even in the handgun form factor the 40mm isn’t a reasonable choice for holstered carry. For the non-technical folks, the Sheriff misspoke and/or the transcript was in error. It should have been, “a fully loaded .40 caliber handgun”. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1005 "2024-04-30T00:10:06Z")
I bet you the kinda folk that knows the difference between a clip and a magazine too. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1006 "2024-04-30T00:11:03Z")
I don’t think you need to be technical to understand how big a 40mm caliber gun would be! I’m probably as gun-illiterate as it gets, and I chuckled at the joke. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1007 "2024-04-30T00:23:43Z")
> **[\[King Arms\] M79 SAWED-Off Grenade Launcher\[Short Ver.\]](https://www.sixmm.com/products/king-arms-m79-sawed-off-grenade-launcher)** > > Description:\[King Arms\] M79 SAWED-Off Grenade Launcher Clearly modeled after the classic M79 40mm grenade launcher, this so called sawed-off version is infact a total redesign aiming to closely emulate the full size version but nipped and tucked all... ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1008 "2024-04-30T00:27:22Z")
Full size. [![](https://www.thearmorylife.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/M79-Grenade-Launcher.jpg) ](https://www.thearmorylife.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/M79-Grenade-Launcher.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1009 "2024-04-30T00:30:46Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > I’d say constitutional sheriffs take the existing legal framework of society and twist it to justify their worldview. SovCits don’t acknowledge the framework to begin with. They both acknowledge frameworks, just different ones. The sheriffs recognize the US Constitution as some sort of religious text, not to actually be read, studied, or understood but as a inviolable document which gives them the right to do whatever the hell they want. SovCits, to the extent I understand them, recognize not the US Constitution but other, older documents as some sort of religious text, not to actually be read, studied, or understood but as inviolable documents which give them the right to do whatever the hell they want. Basically, the difference boils down to which magic words they use. The sheriffs use magic words that people vaguely recognize as something they might have learned in school, so they don’t sound quite as insane to most people as the SovCits. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1010 "2024-04-30T00:31:03Z")
Fooking A? Where’s Hellboy? ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1011 "2024-04-30T06:47:46Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Duh, even in the handgun form factor the 40mm isn’t a reasonable choice for holstered carry. Yeah. Here’s the long gun version for comparison. [![](https://www.usni.org/sites/default/files/styles/hero_image/public/US-MdAnUSNI-216004040.jpg?itok=Z2zFa0ZV) ](https://www.usni.org/sites/default/files/styles/hero_image/public/US-MdAnUSNI-216004040.jpg?itok=Z2zFa0ZV) ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1012 "2024-04-30T09:59:59Z")
That’s a weapon that can only be fired twice; after all, you only have two wrists. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1013 "2024-04-30T21:23:01Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > It should have been, “a fully loaded .40 caliber handgun”. That decimal point is pretty important. I have a .40 caliber pistol. It does not fire bullets that are 4 cm (over an inch and a half) in diameter. That’s more like a mortar shell size. 😆 (To be precise, mortar shells are 60mm on the low end, but that’s only half again bigger than the supposed 40mm round.) ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2024, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1014 "2024-05-10T05:50:48Z")
I saw this on Reddit today. Not sure if this is a new video or a re-post of an old one (re-posts happen a LOT on that site). Shows a sovereign citizen losing his shit by refusing to answer whether he is a US citizen or not at a federal immigration checkpoint (not the border). I think it is clear he is a US citizen and had he answered “yes” he’d have been on his way in 10 seconds. Honestly, I agree that the whole 100-mile zone where our rights are curtailed is bullshit and a problem but that is not the place to have that fight. Call your congresscritter (that won’t help much either but is a better route than this is). - [To attempt to get past the Texas border patrol checkpoint.](https://old.reddit.com/r/therewasanattempt/comments/1co2t1i/to_attempt_to_get_past_the_texas_border_patrol/) ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2024, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1015 "2024-05-10T11:00:14Z")
Yes, saw that on another site. Blasting the officer about your 5th & 6th (weird) amendment rights until you get hauled out of the truck facing tasers and handcuffed is just stupid - mah freedumb. I guess he thought he could intimidate the female; then the bigger bodies showed up. The officers tried to diffuse the situation, very professional. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2024, 11:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1016 "2024-05-10T11:08:38Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > 6th (weird) amendment rights > _In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to_ have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence. ‘All righty then if that’s the way you want it, given the prerequisites of “a speedy and public trial”, your under arrest!’ ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2024, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1017 "2024-05-17T23:24:01Z")
More action. Another special snowflake talks himself into an arrest. > **[Sovereign Citizen Demands To Speak To Cop's Supervisor, And You Can Probably...](https://jalopnik.com/sovereign-citizen-demands-to-speak-to-supervisor-and-y-1851485150)** > > You would think that people who consider themselves sovereign citizens would have learned their lesson by now. “The esteemed sovereign citizen in question was apparently visiting a park and failed to pay when he entered and began illegally flying a drone. A park ranger then confronts him about those issues, as well as his lack of a valid license plate. He responds that it’s a private vehicle, refuses to hand over his registration when asked and then demands to speak to their supervisor.” “He starts arguing over the difference between a crime and an infraction and explains that “in [his] law,” another person has to be harmed for that to count as a crime, claims he doesn’t live in the “state of” California but does live in California, and then insists he doesn’t know what a sovereign citizen is, calling the term an oxymoron.” ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1018 "2024-05-17T23:55:48Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > he doesn’t know what a sovereign citizen is, calling the term an oxymoron.” Damn. One of them finally started talking sense. (Yes, the term is an oxymoron. The sovcits, on the other hand, are simply morons, dangerous morons.) ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2024, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1019 "2024-05-18T13:12:45Z")
It all seems to boil down to semantics for these bozos, doesn’t it? When is a smeerp not a smeerp? ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2024, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572/1020 "2024-05-18T13:18:28Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > It all seems to boil down to semantics for these bozos, doesn’t it? When is a smeerp not a smeerp? - When it’s a gentintang. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572.md?page=50) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sovereign-citizens-please-tell-me-this-is-fake/769572.md?page=52)