# Soy causes growth retardation and infertility? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 19, 2000, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647 "2000-02-19T17:08:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/1 "2000-02-19T17:08:00Z")
I keep hearing these things at iVillage and quite frankly I don’t believe them. I was wondering if anyone has some REAL documentation on this subject. Can anyone help me out? (It hasn’t stunted my children’s growth even a little BTW) ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/2 "2000-02-20T06:12:00Z")
Soy what? Soy Milk? Soy beans? Soy sauce? ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 6:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/3 "2000-02-20T06:23:00Z")
Yes. More specifically a high amount of soy in the diet like what someone allergic to dairy or following a vegetarian diet would have. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/4 "2000-02-19T19:17:00Z")
## Main Entry: to·fu Pronunciation: 'tO-(")fü Function: noun Etymology: Japanese tOfu Date: 1771 : BEAN CURD ## Main Entry: bean curd Function: noun Date: circa 1889 : a soft vegetable cheese prepared by treating soybean milk with coagulants (as magnesium chloride or dilute acids) – called also tofu What do you think? Infertility? 😃 Peace, mangeorge * * * I only know two things; I know what I need to know And I know what I want to know Mangeorge, 2000 ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/5 "2000-02-19T19:27:00Z")
I think I understand what you are getting at, Mangeorge, but the story goes that it only causes lessened fertility for 2 generations and then after that is returned to “normal”. When I first heard about this I mentioned “How many Chinese people are there?” That was the response that I got. ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/6 "2000-02-19T22:44:00Z")
You can check out this webpage, but it looks to be definitely anti-soy and provides no real backup to its’ theories. It mentions that soy has estrogen stimulating properties and thus may cause low sperm count. It doesn’t state much evidence on any of its’ claims though. An article linked to early in the site is no longer available so we can’t read about that either. With the standard reminder of don’t believe everything you read… [http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/4620/what.htm](http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/4620/what.htm) ---
**Author:** ![douglips](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@douglips](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/douglips)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/7 "2000-02-19T22:51:00Z")
> [@](#): > > I think I understand what you are getting at, Mangeorge, but the story goes that it only causes lessened fertility for 2 generations and then after that is returned to “normal”. When I first heard about this I mentioned “How many Chinese people are there?” That was the response that I got. **What?** What the hell does that mean? If I eat it then for two generations my family is cursed but then it’s OK? If all of my children eat it it’s OK because I started the two generation clock and their children will be OK? What about this makes any sense at all? ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/8 "2000-02-19T23:20:00Z")
[http://www.parentsplace.com/fertility/conception/qa/0,3105,12153,00.html](http://www.parentsplace.com/fertility/conception/qa/0,3105,12153,00.html) The best explanation I could find on the net. Includes names of several studies. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2000, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/9 "2000-02-19T23:56:00Z")
Adam Yax asked: > [@](#): > > Soy sauce? It’s a fair bet that if all you feed your child is soy sauce, they’re bound to suffer some ill effects. * * * “I guess one person can make a difference, although most of the time they probably shouldn’t.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Asbestos_Mango)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/10 "2000-02-20T04:21:00Z")
I’ve been drinking a lot of soy milk, eating tofu and tempeh, and sometimes snack on a variety of soy beans that you boil in the pod, and they almost taste like snow peas. I haven’t been able to get pregnant. But I think the fact that I haven’t had sex in almost two years might be a contributing factor… Maybe I need a husband? Or a turkey baster? * * * The trouble with Sir Launcelot is by the time he comes riding up, you’ve already married King Arthur. ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/11 "2000-02-20T16:30:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by funneefarmer: > \*\* [http://www.parentsplace.com/fertility/conception/qa/0,3105,12153,00.html](http://www.parentsplace.com/fertility/conception/qa/0,3105,12153,00.html) > > The best explanation I could find on the net. Includes names of several studies.\*\* Gee, whiz! Is iVillage the only place to find information on this subject? :rolleyes: Thanks for the link. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![funneefarmer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9fc348/32.png) [@funneefarmer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/funneefarmer)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/12 "2000-02-20T21:37:00Z")
Sorry ma. Didn’t even see their little logo when I was reading. ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/13 "2000-02-20T22:56:00Z")
OK, I’ve found this. The conclusion seems to be “some people think this but no one really knows. It’s probably nuthin’.” I’m waiting for an answer from the Price-Pottenger people. They are apparently the ones that have the Nutrition Physician at iVillage that soymilk for children is bad, bad, bad. ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/14 "2000-02-20T22:59:00Z")
CONVINCED, sorry, I left that out. DD woke up just as I got to that word. They have the NP convinced that soymilk is bad. ---
**Author:** ![Akatsukami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ea666f/32.png) [@Akatsukami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akatsukami)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/15 "2000-02-20T23:33:00Z")
I don’t see any particular relationship of soy products with growth retardation or infertility, although [http://www.cfs.purdue.edu/extension/efr/efr9-14.htm](http://www.cfs.purdue.edu/extension/efr/efr9-14.htm)_does_ emphasize that soy-based infant formula ought not to be indiscriminantly substituted for breast milk or other formulas. Vegetarian diets _may_ lack sufficient protein, or specific amino acids, causing growth retardation or general debility including infertility. Generally, the nutritional claims of manufacturers or retailers of any foodstuff should be treated with a healthy suspicion. I would suggest e-mail to c-hasler@uiuc.edu (that’s at the University of Illinois) for the – ahem – straight dope on this topic. * * * “I don’t just want you to feel envy. I want you to suffer, I want you to bleed, I want you to die a little bit each day. And I want you to thank me for it.” – What “Let’s just be friends” _really_ means ---
**Author:** ![SoMoMom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@SoMoMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SoMoMom)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/16 "2000-02-20T23:35:00Z")
I found this: [http://www.vegansociety.com/info/info18.html](http://www.vegansociety.com/info/info18.html) I realize they are automatically considered biased, but it does give the histury on this debate. ---
**Author:** ![NanoByte](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecc23a/32.png) [@NanoByte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NanoByte)\ **Post date:** [February 20, 2000, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/17 "2000-02-20T23:50:00Z")
You want [advice from Bezerkeley](http://www.paradisebpu.com/metagenics-misc.html)? Mix some of each and stir well. Then head for the bathroom. Ray (I had tofu yesterday (which I almost never eat) with some kind of hot sauce. Got sharp pains at the top of my sigmoid loop. Forget it. Soyanara!) ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2000, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/soy-causes-growth-retardation-and-infertility/7647/18 "2000-02-21T07:33:00Z")
Well, I got interested, from the OP, and have been reading up. Here is my best take, minus polysylabic chemistry terms. Some herbs and food plants, including soy, contain chemicals which are similar in some critical ways to estrogen compounds in animals, including humans. A couple of parrot breeders in New Zealand back in '93 or so, examined their feeding practices and found out that birds fed entirely on soy products had generally lower growth and reproductive rates than did other parrots raised on mixed feeds. Soy is particularly rich in the chemicals in question. (Phytoestrogens) Ok, so this is big money related stuff, it turns out. Parrots be damned, soy is used in a lot of places. So the various elements of scientific opinion making began to gear up. Archer Daniels Midlands funds a big research carefully aimed at only a few mammalian species. The Milk marketing folks fund a rather larger, and more narrowly defined set of examinations. The folks at La Leche League get involved, and the Vegan pitch in as well. In half the length of time in which we have done nothing about the AIDS epidemic we have learned the following. Phytoestrogens and some other chemicals do have an effect on the moderation of the levels of estrogen in animals. The effect is most likely to be the result of binding with the normal hormones used to regulate the levels of estrogen in the animal. The effect can, and in some cases does alter the rates of growth in test animals of various species. Birds do show a measurable reduction in fertility and reproductive frequency on a diet very high in soy.           There are no clinical studies supporting, or refuting effects of soy formula on reproduction in humans, if any. There is a small amount of evidence that estrogen levels in several mammalian species is slightly elevated from those in control groups when soy is the major source of food intake. Politics outweighs the science in this matter, by a ten to one ratio. Every study I read was “preliminary” or “limited” in its scope. No one seems to want to be the ones who gave their boss the proof of the wrong answer. \

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