# Spector case.....run by idiots? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 25, 2007, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456 "2007-05-25T04:41:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/1 "2007-05-25T04:41:04Z")
[http://www.cnn.com/2007/LAW/05/23/spector.trial.ap/index.html](http://www.cnn.com/2007/LAW/05/23/spector.trial.ap/index.html) **Judge: Spector’s expert hid victim’s fingernail** That’s the title of the story. It’s an awful title and not really supported by the text but that is another rant. This rant is about a bad investigation ran by morons. The prosecution claims that Dr. Henry Lee (really famous forensic-type guy) absconded with evidence he found at the crime scene where Phil Spector allegedly shot someone. They told this to the Judge. A reporter relays the story. Nobody seems to ask the rather obvious questions that a person really ought to ask in a situation like this. So I will ask them here. > [@](#): > > The judge said that of all the witnesses who testified over several weeks in hearings on the issue, the only one that he found completely credible was attorney Sara Caplan. Caplan said she saw Lee pick up a white object with a rough edge and place it in a vial during a defense search of the foyer of Spector’s mansion after police were through. You saw him pick up the evidence? You were standing right there and you saw him? Did you, well…_ask him about it?_ Did you say “Hey, What did you find there?? If it’s evidence, you need to turn that over to us!” Isn’t that procedure? Did you say that? No?? Ok. > [@](#): > > Deputy District Attorney Alan Jackson displayed a picture taken inside Spector’s home showing something white on a wooden floor that Lee said was a gouge in the floor. > > “It’s clearly a white object sitting atop the wooden floor,” said Jackson. “He said it was a gouge. Is he lying or is he incompetent? That is not a gouge.” > Deputy District Attorney Pat Dixon said the prosecution thinks it was Clarkson’s fingernail. He suggested it would have proved that “her hand was in her mouth trying to push the gun away when Phil Spector pulled the trigger.” Do you really want to use the ‘incompetent’ here??? Are you trying to tell me that there was _evidence_ on the floor of a crime scene, that was secured by uniformed officers, detectives and crime scene techs for days, that was large enough to visible with the naked eye…so much so that it shows up in a crime scene photograph…_ **and none of your guys bagged and tagged it???** _ And now you are going tell me you think it was a piece of the victim’s fingernail? A Crucial piece of evidence?? Am I wrong here? Am I wrong in thinking that anyone with a brain would have found this ‘white object’ during the investigation of the crime scene? That, if it was there, it means the investigators were incompetent? And if it wasn’t, that it means the prosecution is trying to pull a fast one? Are these the best L. A has to offer? Please tell me this not ‘business as usual’ in a crime scene investigation. I don’t expect **C. S. I.** -type science bullshit, but isn’t this ridiculous? ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/2 "2007-05-25T16:30:08Z")
[QUOTE=spooje] Are these the best L. A has to offer? [/QUOTE] So what is it anyway about LA and police recruitment/selection? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/3 "2007-05-25T16:43:26Z")
One would think that by now LA cops would learn how to deal with a high profile murder. But do you really need evidence here? Is there one case of suicide, ever, where someone killed themselves in front of someone they knew for a total of two hours? ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/4 "2007-05-25T16:48:47Z")
Well, in the prosecution’s defense, it’s not as if California juries have a reputation for convicting celebrities of murders. If they wouldn’t convict OJ, or Robert “I couldn’t have done it because I was right there with a gun” Blake, maybe the prosecution is just prosecuting for show but not putting much into it. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/5 "2007-05-25T16:59:20Z")
[QUOTE=Wee Bairn] One would think that by now LA cops would learn how to deal with a high profile murder. But do you really need evidence here? Is there one case of suicide, ever, where someone killed themselves in front of someone they knew for a total of two hours? [/QUOTE] People take hostages and kill themselves, sometimes with and sometimes without taking the hostages with them. People pull out a gun at press conferences and blow their own heads off. So, I’d have to say yes. Tho I don’t what anything about what Phil claims happened. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/6 "2007-05-25T17:00:21Z")
I stlll wonder what the “tooth” if it did exist would prove anyway. 😕 Such it’s a tooth about which no one knows, I guess, we can assign magical properties to it. It was actually the Holy Grail, it was the elusive cure to a cancers and all diseases, it was the philosopher’s stone, it was the key to World Peace, it was the proof that Johnson killed Kenedy, it was the recipe for the darnest bestest chocolate brownie you ever ate!! and why would Mr Lee/Mr Baden, apparently, they look so much alike they could be twins, hide this/deny it’s existance. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/7 "2007-05-25T17:10:35Z")
Back to the OP. Clearly you don’t understand LA cops. They have a heavier burden than mere justice, or competence, or even civilized behavior to the citizens of LA. They are our national police role models, via Hollywood. They are too busy consulting and script writing to read their own departmental rules, for instance. And that is Good, because they WRITE the rules by living them, and inserting them into _CSI_ and _Law & Order_ episodes. In the OPs episode of real life LA Cops, what we’re seeing is a continutity problem. A prop in one scene was not in the next. The director will just have to do some re-shooting. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/8 "2007-05-25T17:20:16Z")
It had to be said: _I want the tooth, the whole tooth and nothing but the tooth!_ ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Don\_t\_Call\_Me\_Shirley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Call_Me_Shirley)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/9 "2007-05-25T17:30:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I stlll wonder what the “tooth” if it did exist would prove anyway. Nothing conclusive, but when people put a gun in their own mouth and shoot themselves they almost never shoot themselves in the teeth. They put the barrel past their teeth. If he were trying to force the gun into her mouth and she was trying to keep it out, she would clench her teeth. Hence, if she was shot in the teeth it would be more likely that she was murdered. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/10 "2007-05-25T17:47:54Z")
[QUOTE=Don’t Call Me Shirley] Nothing conclusive, but when people put a gun in their own mouth and shoot themselves they almost never shoot themselves in the teeth. They put the barrel past their teeth. If he were trying to force the gun into her mouth and she was trying to keep it out, she would clench her teeth. Hence, if she was shot in the teeth it would be more likely that she was murdered. [/QUOTE] 😕 So they could not tell by examining the body that teeth were missing? ---
**Author:** ![Wee\_Bairn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/90db22/32.png) [@Wee\_Bairn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wee_Bairn)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/11 "2007-05-25T17:47:55Z")
[QUOTE=Boyo Jim] People take hostages and kill themselves, sometimes with and sometimes without taking the hostages with them. People pull out a gun at press conferences and blow their own heads off. So, I’d have to say yes. Tho I don’t what anything about what Phil claims happened. [/QUOTE] I didn’t phrase that right, I should have said- no one has ever done this in front of one person only, a stranger, in private, and without obvious reason, ever. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/12 "2007-05-25T18:01:35Z")
The article is about a fingernail. Where did this stuff about teeth come from? ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2007, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/13 "2007-05-26T02:40:21Z")
[QUOTE=Biffy the Elephant Shrew] The article is about a fingernail. Where did this stuff about teeth come from? [/QUOTE] I was just about to ask that myself. But what I really want to know is why nobody asked why the cops didn’t collect the obvious piece of evidence if, in fact, it was there to be taken by a defense investigator. The judge didn’t ask when the prosecutors came to him with this. The reporter didn’t ask when he/she wrote the story. The editor didn’t ask?? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2007, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spector-case-run-by-idiots/405456/14 "2007-05-26T03:30:25Z")
[QUOTE=ouryL] _I want the tooth, the whole tooth and nothing but the tooth!_ [/QUOTE] But can you handle it?