# Spelling question: ing after the letter e **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 10, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560 "2008-12-10T16:12:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Yodalicious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yodalicious/32/8195_2.png) [@Yodalicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yodalicious)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/1 "2008-12-10T16:12:04Z")
Never very good at spelling… It seems that when adding ing to words that end with the letter e, sometimes you leave the e and sometimes you drop it. Is there a rule for when the e should be dropped or kept? ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/2 "2008-12-10T16:14:42Z")
If it is a silent e you drop it before adding ing. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/3 "2008-12-10T16:33:16Z")
Apart from a few words where the e follows a vowel - hoeing, not hoing, for example. ---
**Author:** ![Yodalicious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yodalicious/32/8195_2.png) [@Yodalicious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yodalicious)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/4 "2008-12-10T16:53:29Z")
Pardon my stupidity… isn’t the e always silent? ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/5 "2008-12-10T16:59:55Z")
> [@Daddypants](#): > > Pardon my stupidity… isn’t the e always silent? sauteing flambeing Although, then there’s words like bingeing which, like the aforementioned hoeing, might look bizarre without the e. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/6 "2008-12-10T17:00:16Z")
There is also regional variation: I believe the British write \*ageing \*while the Americans write _aging_. The same goes for other suffixes: judgement / judgment. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/7 "2008-12-10T17:11:36Z")
Final -e is usually dropped before adding -ing. The exceptions are for clarity’s sake: where the -e is pronounced, where it changes the pronunciation of the basic word, etc. Note that -ie often gets converted to -y before -ing, for example lie \> lying, in both the meanings “recline” and “prevaricate.” The coalescence of these two “rules” (actually descriptive summaries of standard written usage) gives _die_ \> dying but _dye_ \> dyeing. Notice that sometimes final letters are doubled or a final -c becomes -ck before -ing, for the same reasons: picnicking rather than picnicing, which almost looks like it should have a “nice” sound in the middle; To mat becomes matting because mating would appear to be the participle for “to mate.” ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/8 "2008-12-10T18:37:26Z")
> [@gigi](#): > > sauteing > flambeing The non-silent ‘e’ probably betrays the French origin of both words _i.e._ sauté and flambé. Incidentally, looking up ‘flambeing’ on google provokes the enquiry ‘Did you mean _flamingo_?’ ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/9 "2008-12-10T18:56:26Z")
> [@Chez\_Guevara](#): > > The non-silent ‘e’ probably betrays the French origin of both words _i.e._ sauté and flambé. Are you saying that there are no non-silent [e]s that aren’t French _accents aigus_? How about the sentence, “They were agreeing that seeing the peeing was freeing.” Of course, if you object to counting originally French words as English, your post should read: The [del]non-silent[/del] ‘e’ [del]probab[/del]ly be[del]tray[/del]s the French [del]origin[/del] of both words _i.e._ _sauté_ and _flambé_. ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/10 "2008-12-10T19:26:49Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Are you saying that there are no non-silent [e]s that aren’t French _accents aigus_? I didn’t say anything of the kind. > [@](#): > > The [del]non-silent[/del] ‘e’ [del]probab[/del]ly be[del]tray[/del]s the French [del]origin[/del] of both words _i.e._ _sauté_ and _flambé_. This sentence makes no sense to me whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Vox\_Imperatoris](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Vox\_Imperatoris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vox_Imperatoris)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/11 "2008-12-10T19:30:39Z")
> [@Chez\_Guevara](#): > > \This sentence makes no sense to me whatsoever. Exactly. It doesn’t make sense because all of the French-derived words are cut out. Valete, Vox Imperatoris ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2008, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/12 "2008-12-10T20:47:49Z")
> [@Chez\_Guevara](#): > > I didn’t say anything of the kind. Sorry — I was a bit confused by the discussion, which seemed to go: **Daddypants** : Isn’t [e] always silent in [-eing]? **gigi** : No, for example sautéing and flambéing. **Chez Guevara** : But those are French. **Me** : 😕 What does their French origin have to do with anything? Perhaps it’s that this is [é]; I’ll point out some long-e examples in English. Apologies if I misunderstood. ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/13 "2008-12-11T12:09:33Z")
The proposition is that ‘flambé - flambe’ and ‘sauté - saute’ and other words ending in ‘é’ in the original French will not drop the ‘e’ in constructing the present participle because the implied ‘é’ forms an essential part of those words. Nothing more, nothing less. I could have been clearer. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/14 "2008-12-11T13:45:44Z")
Some variations of the themes mentioned by **Polycarp** : Birdieing, to make a birdie. I guess others decided that “birdying” looked too weird. Dieing, the making of a die (as in casting). To avoid confusion with “dying” I guess. Cf. the “dyeing” cite above. Garnisheeing: Just throwing this one in since it looks so odd. (To make someone into a garnishee.) Also got “trusteeing”. Ugh. Singeing: ooh, another nice example of why you need to keep the “e”. “Tingeing” also turns up. Those “inge” endings seem to a relatively common exception. And… Fricasseeing: for you Francophones. Ain’t computer dictionaries grand? ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/15 "2008-12-11T14:39:50Z")
It’s not just accented es that are pronounced. e.g. “sing” versus “singe”. The “e” isn’t pronounced on its own but it does modify the “g”. So sing -\> singing but singe -\> singeing. (Edit: er, yeah, what **ftg** said!) A good rule of thumb, to answer the OP, is that if the “e” is needed for reasons of pronunciation or to avoid ambiguity, then it is left in. Otherwise, take it out. But there are often variant spellings, e.g. gluing/glueing, aging/ageing, where either is acceptable (somethimes with regional differences). ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/16 "2008-12-11T14:57:07Z")
I staunchly disbelieve that there’s such thing as an “e” before an “i” anywhere. In that regard, I’m the athiest person I know. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2008, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spelling-question-ing-after-the-letter-e/476560/17 "2008-12-11T16:21:47Z")
> [@](#): > > e.g. “sing” versus “singe”. The “e” isn’t pronounced on its own but it does modify the “g”. So sing -\> singing but singe -\> singeing. This reminds me of a story I once heard told by Spike Milligan (I think) about Peter Sellars, when they were both in the Goon Show: Peter received a letter from a fan requesting “a singed photograph.” He got a photograph of himself, and a match, and carefully burned the edges of the photo before putting it in an envelope and sending it off to the fan. Some days later he got a letter back thanking him for the photo, but complaining that it was “signed all round the edges.” Sorry, I couldn’t help it. Of course, Spike told it much better.