# Spider-Man vs. Wonder Woman: Which should I see? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 11, 2017, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015 "2017-07-11T17:22:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2017, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/41 "2017-07-15T07:44:09Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Hopefully you will have time to go see the better one now. What makes you think Spidey was so amazing? ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2017, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/42 "2017-07-15T11:31:48Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > What makes you think Spidey was so amazing? It’s right there in his name. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2017, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/43 "2017-07-15T12:06:14Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > _Spider-Man: Homecoming_ is clearly the better film. I’d say Wonder Woman is the better movie, Spider-Man: Homecoming is the better superhero movie. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/44 "2017-07-16T05:56:56Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > What makes you think Spidey was so amazing? What makes you think _Wonder Woman_ is so wonderful? After a point, it was just plain boring. Same old superhero battle with same old special effects. Yawn. Oh, I forgot, first superhero movie featuring a woman! Yada, yada, yada. Big friggin’ deal. Spidey, though, managed to keep it fresh and my interest piqued, right to the end of the credits. _Wonder Woman_ had me glancing at my watch wondering would this ever end. > [@epbrown01](#): > > I’d say Wonder Woman is the better movie, Spider-Man: Homecoming is the better superhero movie. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/45 "2017-07-16T08:12:09Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > What makes you think _Wonder Woman_ is so wonderful? After a point, it was just plain boring. Same old superhero battle with same old special effects. Yawn. Oh, I forgot, first superhero movie featuring a woman! Yada, yada, yada. Big friggin’ deal. Spidey, though, managed to keep it fresh and my interest piqued, right to the end of the credits. _Wonder Woman_ had me glancing at my watch wondering would this ever end. > > :rolleyes: See, I had the exact opposite reaction. There was no guarantee any of Wonder Woman’s friends would live, a couple of things were surprising (like what happened to the village) and done very well, serious issues were approached and some of the action scenes were awesome - except for the battle with Aries, I’m with you there. I didn’t like WW because she was a woman but I didn’t use that as a reason to dislike it, either. However, I did like Spidey too and although the films had different demographic target groups I would have thought that there was so much crossover in those demographics that anyone who loved one would at least like the other. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/46 "2017-07-16T12:08:32Z")
Nitpick: Ares is the god of idiotic blind bloody war\*. Aries is the Ram on the zodiac. \*As opposed to Athena, who’s the goddess of intelligent, strategic war, and of a whole lot of other things besides. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/47 "2017-07-16T13:07:51Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Oh, I forgot, first superhero movie featuring a woman! People kept saying that, even though it’s demonstrably false. Cat-Woman (Halle Berry) Supergirl Elektra And those are just comic-book-based movies. If you want to expand that to original series, video games and cartoons, you have: Aeon Flux Resident Evil Tomb Raider Underworld You can’t even say Wonder Woman is the first SUCCESSFUL woman superhero movie because Tomb Raider, Underworld and Resident Evil did pretty good. You could say that Wonder Woman is the BEST and most critically acclaimed, but that’s not what people are saying. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/48 "2017-07-16T13:13:48Z")
I enjoyed both. I grew up reading Marvel and hating DC. That certainly effects how I feel about the characters. I generally much prefer Marvel movies. That said Wonder Woman was a good movie despite the fact that I never cared for the character before. I fell deeply and spiritually in love with Gal Gadot while watching the movie. Chris Pine did a fine job. The cardboard cutouts that played their team did their job. The villains were nothing special. In Spider-Man Michael Keaton played one of the best villains so far in superhero movies. He took a villain that was laughably over the top in the comic books and made him into a believable well rounded character. I’ll give the edge to Spidey but I’m glad I saw both on the big screen. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/49 "2017-07-16T19:31:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Nitpick: Ares is the god of idiotic blind bloody war\*. Aries is the Ram on the zodiac. > \*As opposed to Athena, who’s the goddess of intelligent, strategic war, and of a whole lot of other things besides. Sorry - the SDMB reply screen is tiny on my phone so predictive text typos get through. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/50 "2017-07-16T19:40:47Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > People kept saying that, even though it’s demonstrably false. > Cat-Woman (Halle Berry) > Supergirl > Elektra > > And those are just comic-book-based movies. If you want to expand that to original series, video games and cartoons, you have: > > Aeon Flux > Resident Evil > Tomb Raider > Underworld > You can’t even say Wonder Woman is the first SUCCESSFUL woman superhero movie because Tomb Raider, Underworld and Resident Evil did pretty good. > You could say that Wonder Woman is the BEST and most critically acclaimed, but that’s not what people are saying. Fine. I couldn’t care less. You can have the first movie featuring a Venusian or just any movie featuring a Venusian, but it still better be good. _Wonder Woman_ was merely okay. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/51 "2017-07-16T19:42:06Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > People kept saying that, even though it’s demonstrably false. > Cat-Woman (Halle Berry) > Supergirl > Elektra > > And those are just comic-book-based movies. If you want to expand that to original series, video games and cartoons, you have: > > Aeon Flux > Resident Evil > Tomb Raider > Underworld > You can’t even say Wonder Woman is the first SUCCESSFUL woman superhero movie because Tomb Raider, Underworld and Resident Evil did pretty good. > You could say that Wonder Woman is the BEST and most critically acclaimed, but that’s not what people are saying. Lara Croft from tomb raider is just a woman, nothing super about her. Her movies are action/adventure not super hero films. She’s just a female Indiana Jones. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/52 "2017-07-16T20:01:11Z")
On the other hand, Batman is just a man, nothing super about him, either. It’s tough to draw a line between superhero Bruce Wayne and not-superhero Lara Croft. ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/53 "2017-07-16T21:07:18Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Lara Croft from tomb raider is just a woman, nothing super about her. Her movies are action/adventure not super hero films. She’s just a female Indiana Jones. Batman doesn’t have any superpowers, but he’s considered a superhero anyway. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/54 "2017-07-16T21:31:56Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > On the other hand, Batman is just a man, nothing super about him, either. It’s tough to draw a line between superhero Bruce Wayne and not-superhero Lara Croft. I’d have to go with the costume being the line. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/55 "2017-07-16T22:45:49Z")
Also, is Lara Croft a hero? ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/56 "2017-07-16T22:58:36Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > I’d have to go with the costume being the line. She wears the same clothes all the time… ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/57 "2017-07-16T23:35:49Z")
> [@RikWriter](#): > > You can’t even say Wonder Woman is the first SUCCESSFUL woman superhero movie because Tomb Raider, Underworld and Resident Evil did pretty good. Uh, yes you can, because none of those other ones are superhero movies. You can always get into the weeds debating genres, but none of those are close enough. ‘Superhero’ as a genre has the costumes, the codenames/secret identities, fighting crime or super villains, special powers, etc. Not everyone needs all of those to fall into the category (as pointed out, Batman isn’t a superhuman, for example - though I think you can argue his vast amount of money and gadgets is functionally equivalent) but missing one or two and having the rest is different from only having one or two. Tomb Raider is just regular action-adventure - no powers, no costume, no code-name or secret identity, and she doesn’t go out fighting crime or supervillains. Resident Evil is a zombie flick. Underworld at least has superhumans, but that’s it - it’s a monster movie. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2017, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/58 "2017-07-16T23:44:23Z")
OK, then, Frank Castle. His attire is no more distinctive than Croft’s, he’s no more powered than she is, and he’s probably less of a hero. You can call “The Punisher” a code name, but then, you can call “Tomb Raider” a code name, too. Or how about Drax the Destroyer? He doesn’t really have any of the trappings of a superhero, aside from being produced by Marvel. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/59 "2017-07-17T00:36:49Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > OK, then, Frank Castle. His attire is no more distinctive than Croft’s, he’s no more powered than she is, and he’s probably less of a hero. You can call “The Punisher” a code name, but then, you can call “Tomb Raider” a code name, too. > > Or how about Drax the Destroyer? He doesn’t really have any of the trappings of a superhero, aside from being produced by Marvel. IIRC, comic-book writer Kurt Busiek proposed a five-prong rule-of-thumb test where three or more qualifies: powers and costume and codename and heroic mission and, well, _superhero milieu_. And so Superman is a 4-star example in his own right; even in a situation like the George Reeves TV show, where he’s only fighting ordinary crooks and rescuing folks from natural disasters or whatever, he’s recognizable as superhero. But put him up against costumed supervillains, and team him up with a whole ‘Justice League’ of _other_ superheroes, and suddenly he’s a 5-star example. Batman? 3 stars on his own, and 4 if he’s in that Justice League with Superman. But the interesting bit is, if a character is a 2, you get a fits-the-gut-feeling effect where the answer is _no_ – unless they’re hanging out with Daredevil and battling one of Spider-Man’s villains and trying to impress Captain America, in which case the answer shifts to _oh, well, given that context, yes._ Outside of a comic-book universe, the Hulk is just a Jekyll-and-Hyde monster story like the Wolfman or something; but if he’s an _Avenger,_ he’s in. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2017, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015/60 "2017-07-17T00:47:03Z")
Interestingly, Drax and Gamora are still only at most a 2 on that scale, but Zorro and the Lone Ranger are both 3s. As are many mythical figures, but it’s a different 3. And is, say, _Avatar: the Last Airbender_ a superhero milieu? Certainly, it’s populated with a large number of characters who score 3 or even 4, aside from milieu. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spider-man-vs-wonder-woman-which-should-i-see/791015.md?page=4)