# Spin-off: Artists sneeking subversive elements into their art **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 18, 2023, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372 "2023-01-18T01:06:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/1 "2023-01-18T01:06:44Z")
> [@Boston University unveiled a new Martin Luther King Jr. statue. Is it just me or does it look like someone performing a sexual act?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/boston-university-unveiled-a-new-martin-luther-king-jr-statue-is-it-just-me-or-does-it-look-like-someone-performing-a-sexual-act/978230/33): > > And it would not be the first time an artist snuck something subersive into their work (not saying this artist did). A spin-off of the MLK-Statue thread: any examples of (ideally subversive) or weird elements in art that are not always clear or easy to detect? Like here: [![](https://i.postimg.cc/XJqgc0w9/tcdl0007-torero-alucinogeno-dali.jpg) ](https://i.postimg.cc/XJqgc0w9/tcdl0007-torero-alucinogeno-dali.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/2 "2023-01-18T11:57:10Z")
Assuming we’re not limited to the visual arts, my first thought is the Beatles’ song “Girl”, in which the backing vocals consist of Harrison and McCartney repeatedly singing the word “tit.” mmm ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/3 "2023-01-18T13:18:42Z")
Remember this poster? I think about a dozen people in my college dorm had it on their wall: [![](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0013/2874/2466/products/john-lennon-imagine-memorial-poster-23-x-35-posters-prints-visual-artwork-156_1024x.jpg?v=1642527106) ](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0013/2874/2466/products/john-lennon-imagine-memorial-poster-23-x-35-posters-prints-visual-artwork-156_1024x.jpg?v=1642527106) Most people were completely unaware, as was I until someone pointed it out to me, that there’s a roach (joint) in it. Can you find it? I circled it [here](https://i.imgur.com/h1AWkO2.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/4 "2023-01-18T13:27:50Z")
> [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](#): > > Assuming we’re not limited to the visual arts, my first thought is the Beatles’ song “Girl”, in which the backing vocals consist of Harrison and McCartney repeatedly singing the word “tit.” In The Doors’ song, Riders On The Storm, there’s a ‘whisper track’ running through most of the song. Jim Morrison whispered the lyrics and throughout the song, the main vocals get quieter and the whisper gets louder. I don’t know how well known that is, but I never noticed it until it was explicitly pointed out to me. I was going to link to the [regular version of the song](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iv8GW1GaoIc) so you/everyone could listen to it for themselves. But then I found [a version with the main vocals removed](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiUk5RkJgKs) so it’s only the whisper track and it’s mostly what you’d expect. What, at least for me, wasn’t expected was how different [this version](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wsXYP5RhPE) sounds with the main vocals left in and the whispered vocals removed. That whisper really adds a lot of depth to the song. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/5 "2023-01-18T13:51:46Z")
Dimitri Shostakovich’s Fifth Symphony. He had been denounced for his opera _Lady Macbeth of the Mtsensk District_ including by a review possibly written by Stalin himself (Stalin was at the performance, and angrily walked out).He was on very shaky ground, as offers to perform his work dried up. Family and friends were sent to the Gulags. He started work on his Fourth Symphony, but abandoned it. He wrote his Fifth Symphony and managed to get it performed. It was a sensation and the party leaders praised it, saying he had returned to socialist values. He was back in favor. But the public saw it as an attack on the system, the heroic themes parodies of the bombast of dictatorship. Its themes are also oppressive (think the imperial march from _Star Wars_ in weight), an attack on Stalin’s oppression. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/6 "2023-01-18T13:59:00Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > any examples of (ideally subversive) or weird elements in art that are not always clear or easy to detect? Lady Gaga’s song “Poker Face”? > **[We've Only Just Realised The Lyrics To 'Poker Face' Are, Um, Much Ruder Than...](https://www.elle.com.au/culture/entertainment/lady-gaga-poker-face-lyrics-24743/)** > > Wait, what? ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/7 "2023-01-18T15:08:22Z")
Eh, is there an interview where Lady Gaga actually says that is true and those are the lyrics? I’m not saying that isn’t the case here, but people hearing lyrics wrong and claiming them to be sexual is _so_ common. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/8 "2023-01-18T15:41:46Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > but people hearing lyrics wrong and claiming them to be sexual is _so_ common. Honestly, “poker face/poke her face” really isn’t that much of a stretch, especially when you consider the venerable history of “Liquor in the front, poker in the rear”. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/9 "2023-01-18T15:48:39Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > Eh, is there an interview where Lady Gaga actually says that is true and those are the lyrics? I’m not saying that isn’t the case here, but people hearing lyrics wrong and claiming them to be sexual is _so_ common. There’s this: > **[Lady Gaga: Poker Face - Issuu](https://issuu.com/boimagazine/docs/04.21-boimagazine/s/12251581)** > > Poker Face was released on September 26, 2008 and charted rankings in the US, the song topped the Billboard Hot 100, Dance Club Songs, Dance/Mix Show Airplay and the Mainstream Top 40 charts. The Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA)... > When Lady Gaga was playing at iHeartRadio Wango Tango in 2009, an annual day-long concert held by KIIS FM, she admitted the radio station, one of the only ones to censor her lyrics for the song, was correct. She said: “KIIS FM is the smartest radio station in the whole world and I’ll tell you why. Because this song, it got played all over the world on tens of thousands of radio stations, but KIIS FM was the only one that said I had to censor my lyric because they thought I might be saying something bad.” And out of all the radio stations in the world that played this record over and over, KIIS FM was the only one that was right and caught on.” ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/10 "2023-01-18T16:42:22Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > any examples of (ideally subversive) or weird elements in art that are not always clear or easy to detect? > > Like here: That is a painting that contains _only_ weird element which was typical from Dalí. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/11 "2023-01-18T16:44:33Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > “poker face/poke her face” Welp, can’t unhear that now. I mean, I’m aware of the ‘poker’ jokes, I just never put it together with this song. Another one is Whenever, Wherever, by Shakira. The second verse has the line “Lucky that my breasts are small and humble / So you don’t confuse them with mountains”. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/12 "2023-01-18T16:46:03Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > Welp, can’t unhear that now. My work here is done. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/13 "2023-01-18T16:50:11Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > That is a painting that contains _only_ weird element which was typical from Dalí. But did you ever notice his self portrait in The Persistence Of Memory (the one with the melting clocks)? The white ‘thing’ the clock on the right is draped over is him, or someone anyway. You can see his eyelashes on the left of it and what appears to be part of his mustache to the right of the clock and sort of put together a face from there. [https://blog.singulart.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/the-persistence-of-memory-1931-1024x778.jpg](https://blog.singulart.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/the-persistence-of-memory-1931-1024x778.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/14 "2023-01-18T16:52:40Z")
Dalí was creating AI generated art long before AI was creating art. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/15 "2023-01-18T18:10:13Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Honestly, “poker face/poke her face” really isn’t that much of a stretch, That’s not what people think she’s singing. From my first link: > The real Poker Face lyrics? > > Po-po-po-poker face / fu-fu-f\*\*\* her face (Mum-mum-mum-mah) > > Po-po-po-poker face, fu-fu-f\*\*\* her face (Mum-mum-mum-mah). If she’s not actually singing that, then the only other explanation is that she is selectively sloppy with her pronunciation, slurring a plosive ‘p’ into a fricative ‘f’ and a long ‘o’ sound into a short ‘u’ sound, and that it’s merely a remarkable coincidence when she does both those things as a sequence. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/16 "2023-01-18T18:12:05Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > That’s not what people think she’s singing. From my first link: I was more addressing the notion that finding things in songs “sexual” was sometimes a stretch. The point is, even if she’s not making it “fuck her face”, it’s not a stretch to see this line as sexual. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/17 "2023-01-18T18:58:37Z")
Michelangelo- The Creation Of Adam The cloud of cherubs/puttees behind the Lord looks suspiciously like a human brain. Mikey dissected human cadavers and put proof on the ceiling of the Sistine chapel. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/18 "2023-01-18T19:17:44Z")
Stereolab’s “Miss Modular” does the same thing with the phrase “do me.” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/19 "2023-01-18T19:21:40Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Michelangelo- The Creation Of Adam > > The cloud of cherubs/puttees behind the Lord looks suspiciously like a human brain. Mikey dissected human cadavers and put proof on the ceiling of the Sistine chapel. I’m terrible at reading into things like that or finding any kind of symbology in art (including movies/tv/books), unless it’s explicitly pointed out to me. I never would have seen that, however, I found this on wiki: [Here’s a picture to reference](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5b/Michelangelo_-_Creation_of_Adam_%28cropped%29.jpg/1200px-Michelangelo_-_Creation_of_Adam_%28cropped%29.jpg). > ### Portrayal of the human brain > > In 1990 in [Anderson, Indiana](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anderson,_Indiana), [physician](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physician) Frank Meshberger noted in the _[Journal of the American Medical Association](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journal_of_the_American_Medical_Association)_ that the background figures and shapes portrayed behind the figure of God appeared to be an anatomically accurate picture of the [human brain](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_brain).[[15]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-Meshberger-15) On close examination, borders in the painting correlate with major [sulci](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulcus_(neuroanatomy)) of the [cerebrum](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telencephalon) in the inner and outer surface of the brain, the [brain stem](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain_stem), the [frontal lobe](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontal_lobe), the basilar artery, the [pituitary gland](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pituitary_gland) and the [optic chiasm](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optic_chiasm).[[15]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-Meshberger-15)[[16]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-16) > > ### Portrayal of the birth process > > Alternatively, it has been observed that the red cloth around God has the shape of a human [uterus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uterus) (one art historian has called it a “uterine mantle”[[17]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-17)) and that the scarf hanging out, coloured green, could be a newly cut [umbilical cord](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umbilical_cord).[[18]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-18) In 2015 a group of Italian researchers published on _[Mayo Clinic Proceedings](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayo_Clinic_Proceedings)_ an article where the images of the mantle and the postpartum uterus were overlapped.[[19]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-19) According to Enrico Bruschini (2004), “This is an interesting hypothesis that presents the Creation scene as an idealised representation of the physical birth of man (“The Creation”). It explains the [navel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navel) that appears on [Adam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam), which is at first perplexing because he was created, not born of a woman.”[[20]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-20) > > ### Portrayal of Eve’s Rib > > Additionally, Deivis Campos notes in _[Clinical Anatomy Journal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinical_Anatomy)_ that the left side of [Adam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam)’s [torso](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torso) contains an extra concealed [rib](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rib).[[21]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-:0-21) Due to Michelangelo’s in-depth knowledge of human anatomy, he insinuates that this rib outline is intentional, and represents the rib of [Eve](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eve).[[21]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-:0-21) > > Campos suggests that this extra rib inclusion was a way for Michelangelo to represent Adam and Eve being created side by side, which differs from the [Catholic](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_Church) tradition that states Eve was created after Adam.[[21]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-:0-21) There is significant evidence that Michelangelo radically disagreed with many Catholic traditions and had a tumultuous relationship with the commissioner of the ceiling, [Pope Julius II](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Art_patronage_of_Julius_II). Thus, Campos suggests that the rib inclusion was an intentional way to slight Pope Julius II and the Catholic Church, without having to admit fault, as very few people knew anything about human anatomy at the time and could challenge the piece.[[21]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Creation_of_Adam#cite_note-:0-21) I think in my head, I had likened it to the shell from Birth Of Venus, but I can’t say I’ve ever given it much thought. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2023, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372/20 "2023-01-18T19:47:06Z")
There’s a “fuck” in the Beatles’ Hey Jude, but it was due to a mistake. Paul says “fucking hell” when he doesn’t hit the right keys. But in other Beatles’ songs the subversive elements are more intentional: in the song Girl, on Rubber Soul, they sing “tit tit tit…” as background vocals, and the phrase “chicka ferdy” in Sun King, from Abbey Road, is childhood slang meaning “fuck off.” [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spin-off-artists-sneeking-subversive-elements-into-their-art/978372.md?page=2)