# Spoil "The Natural" for me (spoilers, of course) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 2, 2004, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978 "2004-08-02T15:51:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 11:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/21 "2004-08-03T11:31:33Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > John Sayles (the director) once remarked that he loved the movie, but that if he had made it, he would have kept the original ending and cast Nick Nolte in the main role. [nitpick] **Barry Levinson** directed [The Natural](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0087781/). **John Sayles** ’ baseball-themed movie was [Eight Men Out](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095082/). [/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/22 "2004-08-03T14:01:22Z")
Another thing, I thought the lighting strike caused the overload at the end and made all the bulbs blow and the sparks shower down. Yes, his ball started it but then lighting struck the stadium to give it the big finish. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/23 "2004-08-03T19:48:35Z")
What’s bugged me about the ending is that for the period of time the film is set in, the late 1930s, night baseball in the major leagues was in its infancy and the fact that the most important game of the year would have been played at night would have been laughable. Major League Baseball didn’t play a World Series game at night until 1971. But this complaint is rather silly granted the whole concept of the movie. It’s not unlike a friend of mine saying after leaving “Spider-Man 2” “My problem with that movie is that there are no elevated trains in midtown Manhattan.” ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/24 "2004-08-03T20:11:39Z")
> [@BobT](#): > > It’s not unlike a friend of mine saying after leaving “Spider-Man 2” > > “My problem with that movie is that there are no elevated trains in midtown Manhattan.” Y’know, I was wondering about that one myself… ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/25 "2004-08-03T20:27:18Z")
> [@Antonius Block](#): > > [nitpick] > > **Barry Levinson** directed [The Natural](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0087781/). **John Sayles** ’ baseball-themed movie was [Eight Men Out](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095082/). > [/nitpick] Work a little harder on your reading comprehension. “John Sayles (the director)\* once remarked that he loved the movie, but that _ **if** _ he had made it, he _ **would have** _ kept the original ending and cast Nick Nolte in the main role.” \*I suppose I could have said “The director John Sayles” (as opposed to other John Sayles out in the world). Perhaps it didn’t need to be said, but I assumed people understand how the words “if” and “would have” work. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/26 "2004-08-03T20:46:17Z")
> [@BobT](#): > > What’s bugged me about the ending is that for the period of time the film is set in, the late 1930s, night baseball in the major leagues was in its infancy and the fact that the most important game of the year would have been played at night would have been laughable. I thought it was supposed to be a late-afternoon game that had been darkened by the incoming storm. ---
**Author:** ![Antonius\_Block](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/51bf81/32.png) [@Antonius\_Block](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antonius_Block)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/27 "2004-08-03T21:47:29Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > Work a little harder on your reading comprehension. Mea culpa. Late-night inability to process words is apparently the problem here. I read what I _thought_ that you had written, which (as you point out) would have made far less sense than what you _did_ write. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2004, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/28 "2004-08-03T23:54:39Z")
> [@BobT](#): > > What’s bugged me about the ending is that for the period of time the film is set in, the late 1930s, night baseball in the major leagues was in its infancy and the fact that the most important game of the year would have been played at night would have been laughable. > > Major League Baseball didn’t play a World Series game at night until 1971. > > But this complaint is rather silly granted the whole concept of the movie. It’s not unlike a friend of mine saying after leaving “Spider-Man 2” > > “My problem with that movie is that there are no elevated trains in midtown Manhattan.” But this wasn’t a world series game. It was a league championship game. (now you have to come back with the first league campionship game at night) ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/29 "2004-08-04T00:44:35Z")
> [@Zebra](#): > > But this wasn’t a world series game. It was a league championship game. The Knights and Pittsburgh finished tied in first place at the end of the regular season in a one division league. Keep in mind, the ultimatum with the Judge was about winning the pennant (the League), not the World Series, so whatever happened after Roy’s home run didn’t really matter (they probably got beat 4-0 by the Yankees). Back in the time period of the movie, the teams would have actually played a best out of 3 game series to decide the pennant winner. (As seen in 1951 when the Giants beat the Dodgers.) Nowadays, if two teams are tied for the wild card spot at the end of the season they play one game to decide it. (As seen in 1998, Cubs beat the Giants.) So far, it hasn’t happened, but if more than three teams are tied for the wild card one team wins a coin flip process and gets a “bye” and the unlucky losers have to win two games to get to the real playoffs. For what its worth, I don’t believe any of the 1951 Dodgers/Giants playoff games were played at night. I’m certain Game 3 wasn’t. (That game wasn’t sold out either, perhaps it should have been a night game!) Perhaps in “reality” the game would be started a little later in the afternoon than usual, to allow a “snuck out of work early” crowd, but probably not the modern 7pm start time as the movie seemed to depict. ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/30 "2004-08-04T01:24:04Z")
In the original version of the movie, Hobbs gave in and threw the big game. Guess they decided that was a smidge too depressing. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/31 "2004-08-04T03:28:02Z")
You mean the book, don’t you Snooooopy? Also in the book, after striking out, Hobbs goes back the Judge, Gus, and Memo and refuses the money (but not before punching out Gus and the Judge). ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/32 "2004-08-04T04:21:19Z")
The first League Championship Series game wasn’t played at night until 1975. Do we know that the New York Knights were in the National League? There are no real teams used in the book or the film. And the American League tiebreaker before 1969 was just a one-game playoff. Used only in 1948 when Cleveland beat Boston. ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/33 "2004-08-04T05:45:10Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > You mean the book, don’t you Snooooopy? > > Also in the book, after striking out, Hobbs goes back the Judge, Gus, and Memo and refuses the money (but not before punching out Gus and the Judge). I have never actually seen the movie. But I was watching this HBO special some years ago about well-known movies which originally had startlingly different endings than the ones that they wound up with. “The Natural” was one of the movies profiled. “Pretty Woman” was another one of the movies profiled. Among the interesting tidbits that I learned: Richard Gere was the third choice for the role of the rich guy (behind William Hurt and Al Pacino) and Julia Roberts was the third choice for the hooker role (forget the first choice, but Diane Lane was envisioned to be alongside Pacino). And the ending of that movie was a lot darker, too: The rich guy pays the hooker her money and tells her to get out. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/34 "2004-08-04T13:22:11Z")
> [@BobT](#): > > Do we know that the New York Knights were in the National League? There are no real teams used in the book or the film. The Cubs are real enough, that’s who the Knights were playing against in Chicago. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/35 "2004-08-04T17:53:46Z")
Hmm, that’s interesting. I wonder why they would pay to license one or two trademarks, but not all of them. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/36 "2004-08-04T22:42:09Z")
There is something about the book and movie versions I’ve wondered about. With the exception of the opening prologue, the movie version of **The Natural** is clearly set in the 1930’s. The book, on the other hand, seems to mostly take place in the early 1950’s (i.e., the time when the book was written). Is my assumption about the book correct? ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2004, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978/37 "2004-08-04T23:00:30Z")
> [@BobT](#): > > Hmm, that’s interesting. > > I wonder why they would pay to license one or two trademarks, but not all of them. Actually,. it is because the story is supposed to draw some parallels with the legned of King Arther. Hence, the team name The Knights. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spoil-the-natural-for-me-spoilers-of-course/257978.md?page=1)