# Spot the Actual Hatred Challenge **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 22, 2022, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009 "2022-09-22T02:05:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/21 "2022-09-22T12:58:01Z")
@Aspidistra, so you want Buck Angel going to the women’s locker room and bathroom? ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/22 "2022-09-22T13:46:41Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > This is like finding the racism in an “all lives matter” sign or an “it’s OK to be white” shirt. Hell, this is exactly the line racists used to use (well, ok, still use). “Spot the hatred (cites dictionary definition of ‘hatred’) in this openly and clearly racist text. It’s not hatred according to Webster”. I’m a little shocked anybody would be just plain dumb enough to use exactly the same argument again in this day and age. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/23 "2022-09-22T13:46:47Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > Things that sex makes a difference to are basically the reproductive system and body structure. Modern medicine can’t actually make you a reproductive organ of the other sex, any more than it can make a kidney. It can make something that vaguely, visually looks the same. Putting aside other issues, the practical problem I’m seeing with your position is how difficult it would be to carry it out. The overwhelming majority of social interactions occur in situations where you cannot see other people’s genitals. So we interact with people based on their more obvious appearance. If somebody looks and behaves like a woman, society treats her like a woman. If somebody looks and behaves like a man, society treats him like a man. As I understand it, this is what you are calling gender. How, as a practical manner, are people supposed to look past what you’re calling other people’s gender in social situations and determine what you’re calling their sex? ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/24 "2022-09-22T13:46:53Z")
Again, this is an outrage bait article, with everyyhing in it written to make you angry while confirming your own views. You really need to stop reading this stuff. Anger short circuits your logical thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Mikkel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikkel/32/13151_2.png) [@Mikkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikkel)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/25 "2022-09-22T14:03:30Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > How, as a practical manner, are people supposed to look past what you’re calling other people’s gender in social situations and determine what you’re calling their sex? We’ll all have to walk around without pants, though I guess that will be uncomfortable in many places, at least in wintertime. And then people with penises will experience some shrinkage. Not a good solution ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/26 "2022-09-22T16:19:07Z")
My only question- Why was I not informed of this thread? Is the Cathode Signal not working? Wait, that’s two questions. Isn’t it? Wait that’s three. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/27 "2022-09-22T16:44:42Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > In any case, if you don’t want to take part in activities differentiated by sex, you don’t have to. You can live a life in completely co-ed spaces if you like. No, you really can’t, unless you never go anywhere other than your own house and the houses of others sympathetic to you. If one goes anywhere in public for any length of time one will eventually need to use a public bathroom; and most of them are currently gendered. Also extremely difficult if one wants to take part in athletics, even as an amateur. Or even if one just wants/needs to get exercise, but lives someplace that makes this difficult to do without going to a gym. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/28 "2022-09-22T17:01:41Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > No, you really can’t, unless you never go anywhere other than your own house and the houses of others sympathetic to you. Which is precisely the point. Transgenders are fine as long as they hide away where I don’t have to see or hear about them. Just like gays in the 70’s. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/29 "2022-09-22T22:51:06Z")
Yes, I do agree with all those things. That makes me a **person with a different opinion**. Not a person who **hates someone** ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/30 "2022-09-22T22:52:12Z")
Nah, I’m pretty sure you’re filled with hatred. “Spot The Actual Hatred”- It’s in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/31 "2022-09-22T22:54:22Z")
You probably wouldn’t even know it if you did. It’s nearly identical to the anti gay voters and activists of the 90s. They didn’t hate gay people, they just thought it was unnatural. And they didn’t want them around their kids. Or in public bathrooms. And they didn’t want teachers teaching that it was okay to be gay. And they thought it was a choice. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/32 "2022-09-22T23:22:48Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > And they thought it was a choice. Or a mental disorder. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2022, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/33 "2022-09-22T23:37:51Z")
Yes, a person that thinks it’s appropriate to question a stranger with an androgynous body type about their genitals in a public bathroom, and it’s amazing to me that you actually think people won’t mind such questioning. I find this obsession with genitalia disturbing. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/34 "2022-09-23T00:01:13Z")
> [@Shop class no no’s Shorts, long hair and giant prosthetic boobs?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shop-class-no-no-s-shorts-long-hair-and-giant-prosthetic-boobs/971773/25): > > Any of the (very small set of) cases where men and women should be separated out from each other, should be done by sex. Pray tell, what are those situations, and why should they be based on sex rather than on gender? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/35 "2022-09-23T00:04:13Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Or a mental disorder Strictly speaking, that was probably true, because living as a homosexual used to cause far more distress than it does today. Distress caused by homophobes, of course, but a similar thing could be argued for many mental disorders. A behavior is only a disorder if it’s associated with significant distress. ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/36 "2022-09-23T00:09:01Z")
Minority stress is certainly an important consideration. However, it’s worth knowing that until Evelyn Hooker’s work, studies of gay people (male, for the most part) were conducted with criminals and psychiatric patients. Hooker and others began using community samples and found that gay people aren’t very dfferent from the general population, except for stress related to discrimination and cultural hostility. > **[The myth buster](https://www.apa.org/monitor/2011/02/myth-buster)** > > Evelyn Hooker’s groundbreaking research exploded the notion that homosexuality was a mental illness, ultimately removing it from the DSM. This is why I’m a participant in longitudinal community studies of LGBTQ people, such as > **[Pride Study](https://pridestudy.org/study)** > > The PRIDE Study is a long-term study to learn about the identities, health conditions, and healthcare experiences of LGBTQ people across the country. You can participate via your computer, tablet, or smartphone. Visit The PRIDE Study website to learn... ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/37 "2022-09-23T00:20:14Z")
> [@Mikkel](#): > > We’ll all have to walk around without pants, though I guess that will be uncomfortable in many places, at least in wintertime. BZZZT! False! We will just have pants like these: [![](http://sev.h-cdn.co/assets/17/11/980x980/square-1489495421-100539979.jpg) ](http://sev.h-cdn.co/assets/17/11/980x980/square-1489495421-100539979.jpg) Except you move where the plastic window is. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/38 "2022-09-23T05:02:56Z")
You do realize all these arguments you’re making in favor of never distinguishing by sex are EVEN STRONGER arguments against never distinguishing by gender identity, right? Gender Identity is _completely invisible_. You have no possible way of telling the supposed gender identity of a normal person hanging around in jeans and a t-shirt. And given “transwomen don’t owe you femininity”, as they say, not really the supposed gender identity of anyone at all any more. If you want to make a case for not having any male/female divisions at all, go ahead. That would not be completely illogical (though I’d still disagree). But that’s not the claim the gender movement is actually making. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/39 "2022-09-23T05:36:42Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > You do realize all these arguments you’re making in favor of never distinguishing by sex are EVEN STRONGER arguments against never distinguishing by gender identity, right? > > Gender Identity is _completely invisible_. You have no possible way of telling the supposed gender identity of a normal person hanging around in jeans and a t-shirt. And given “transwomen don’t owe you femininity”, as they say, not really the supposed gender identity of anyone at all any more. Gender identity is not invisible. Even in the cases where it’s not obvious by someone’s dress and/or actions, **people tell you what their gender identity is.** That’s part of what gender is–how you are seen by others. Hell, that’s the point behind listing pronouns after your name. People generally don’t tell you their sex. And the only visible aspects of someone’s sex are usually covered up. So it is much more invisible. * * * That said, yeah, most of the time, you don’t separate people by gender, either. There just are some exceptions, like those women’s spaces you mention. Sure, we could do away with those, but there’s no pressing need to do so as long as all genders are okay with them. The problems is your idea that these women’s spaces should reject people who think and act like women, but accept people think and act like men. You have a hell of a lot more in common socially with a trans woman than a trans man. Trans women face misogyny. Trans women worry primarily about male sexual harassers and rapists. Your main fear seems to be that cisgender men might use this as an excuse to pretend to be women to infiltrate women’s spaces. But, the thing is, there’s nothing stopping them from doing that now. That it hasn’t happened means that fear is not well grounded. You want to stop something that isn’t really a problem, using ideas that aren’t really practical. And that’s the best possible interpretation. The worst is that you just are scared of and/or hate people because they are different than you. I hope very much you will not be that way. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2022, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009/40 "2022-09-23T08:59:11Z")
What arguments? Who are you responding to? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/spot-the-actual-hatred-challenge/972009.md?page=3)