‘historically been interpeted to mean’ --“clearly fits” —
Hmmmm -
Well - interpetation by man to further what man wants it to mean is not very sound reasoning. I mean, its in ‘black and white’ what was promised - and it didn’t come to pass - so if you have to interpet it to mean something else - its just another empty promise upon which the church is formed.
There are prophecy’s of Nostradamus that have as much or more legitimacy than that.
Were any of those folks that were alive when Christ said “Verily I tell you” - alive when the Catholic Church was formed?
How does destroying Jerusalam in 70 show Christ Returning in Power? Isn’t that like the exact opposite of what a Jewish Messiah would do?
And, no - while you might eat his body and drink his blood (ewwww) in rememberance of him symbolically (in the Eucharist) - you would have to be pretty sick to think that is REALLY his flesh and blood when you do it.
From the Jewish perspective perhaps the holiest of prayers says that God is one, which means God is not two or three. We think you are a bunch of polytheists.
So when you say primary source do you mean first source or do you mean main(most important) source? I can’t see either since the NT books were written prior to there being the Catholic Church and surely the Church tradition doesn’t take precedence over the NT.
Posting only in the interest of historical accuracy, since I’m an ex-Catholic atheist who thinks EscAlaMike has been begging the question for ten or so pages, but G.K. Chesterton famously converted to Roman Catholicism in 1922. I don’t know what drove him to it, but he suggests it was a rational choice. But he’d been a faithful Anglican before coming to see the Church of England as a “pale imitation”, so the intellectual jump wasn’t that far. The social change was far greater, given his time and milieu.
Yes. The Catholic Church was formed on Pentecost, which was 50 days after the resurrection.
It was judgment on the Jewish nation and the end of the exclusively Jewish age where God only reveealed himself to the Jewish people. Jesus prophecied this explicitly in Matthew 23:37-38.
It’s not symbolic, it’s is REALLY his flesh and blood. Read John 6, plenty of other people thought it was icky too, that’s why they left him.
Yes I am familiar with that beautiful prayer. We don’t believe the doctrine of the Trinity is the same thing as polytheism, but if you do, then more power to you. The Greeks and Romans called Christians atheists back in the day since we didn’t sacrifice to their pantheon.
Reliable in the sense that it teaches us theological truth? Yes.
Reliable in the sense of being historically literal? I don’t know. I don’t believe the Church has made a declaration on that, but if they have, then I submit to it.
Both really. The NT books were all written after the Catholic Church was founded. The Church was founded at Pentecost which was 50 days after the resurrection.
It is believed that the first NT books to be written were Paul’s letters, 20 years or more after the resurrection.
The Gospels were likely not written until at least 66AD (Mark is believed to be the first).
Yes. Christ spoke extensively about the “Kingdom”, the Church that he would establish and leave to his Apostles. At the ascension, Jesus told his apostles that they would receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon them. The Holy Spirit came down on them at Pentecost.
If you say so.
These smears are not new or clever, just so you know.
A very brief summary
Key event 1: Jesus tells Peter that he will be the rock on which his Church is built.
Key event 2: At the Last Supper, Jesus institutes the Eucharist and instructs his disciples to carry it on.
Key event 3: At the ascension, Jesus tells his that he will send the Holy Spirit to empower them in the mission of the Church (going into the world baptizing, etc.)
Key event 4: The Holy Spirit comes down at Pentecost.
No.
I don’t know the exact details, but I know that Jesus’ body was placed in the tomb on Friday, and Sunday morning his body was gone. If there were zombies, they were not the mindless flesh eating kind, since they allegedly interacted with people without eating them.
To be clear, the question of if the trinity is to justify a polytheistic religion as monotheistic causes a crisis of faith even among some of the faithful.
Many religions generally accepted as polytheistic also have one originator god with children and or manufactured lesser gods.
Transubstantiation also commonly causes a crisis of faith around cannibalism.
While he has passed, one of my good friendswas a Father and had no issues admitting this but was unable to offer resolution. The fact that actual clergy accepted these were common barriers is exactly why I am unwilling to take your claim it is official teachings without direct evidence to church statements that it is.
A kingdom is something ruled by a king. The word used in the NT for “church” is the Greek “Εκκλησία” which means an assembly/convocation of people. This convocation acknowledges Jesus Christ as its king, therefore it is a kingdom.
I don’t recall ever giving a crap about whether something was new or clever. I’ve cared a great deal about whether a thing was ‘true’ or ‘false’; but I’ve never once rejected an idea upon noting, “oh, hey, that’s been pointed out before, and the manner you employed struck me as blandly matter-of-fact.”