# Stage version of A CLOCKWORK ORANGE... **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 29, 2003, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959 "2003-04-29T17:53:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/1 "2003-04-29T17:53:03Z")
Mom & I are visiting my brother in Los Angeles; last Friday night after we left Canter’s Deli we passed the Greenway Arts Alliance theatre on Fairfax- the sign advertising A Clockwork Orange adapted for stage. LA WEEKLY recommends it so we’re going Thursday night… anyone already see it? Thoughts? Of course, I’ll be giving my review- also to anyone interested, I think it ends May 10 ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/2 "2003-04-29T17:58:37Z")
Since so much of that movie depended on its look and on Malcolm McDowell’s performance, I wouldn’t expect much out of a stage version. _A Clockwork Orange_ is one of the most over-rated movies, IMO. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/3 "2003-04-29T19:04:26Z")
There was a critically acclaimed stage version in Chicago a few years. It was based on the book of course and not the movie, so Scumpup’s expectations would have just as irrelevant then as they are now. ---
**Author:** ![porcupine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ac91a4/32.png) [@porcupine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/porcupine)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/4 "2003-04-29T19:27:53Z")
I saw the production in Chicago at Steppenwolf a few years ago with my sister, and we both enjoyed it. I’m a big fan of the movie and the book as well. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/5 "2003-04-29T20:11:54Z")
I just read that Burgess hated the filmed version with the (American) downbeat ending. The UK version supposedly had the original more upbeat ending. Also, I am not sure, but he either wrote the stage version or gave his seal of approval. (Damn…where did I read that article…) ::DMark glances over at a huge stack of newspapers that should be put in tonight’s recycling and decides it is not all that important where he read it:: ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/6 "2003-04-29T20:14:34Z")
I have no idea how that smilie appeared instead of DMark… ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/7 "2003-04-29T20:17:22Z")
Following a colon with a capital d will do that every time… just like clockwork. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/8 "2003-04-29T20:20:16Z")
For some reason one version of the book had the last chapter missing. This is the version the film is based upon. The full version of the book has a 21st chapter. During that chapter Alex chooses to be moral. He becomes an adult (21) and does not have morality forced upon him. ---
**Author:** ![Peg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b38774/32.png) [@Peg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peg)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/9 "2003-04-29T22:33:50Z")
Haven’t seen it, but my theater (or theatre) critic friend has seen it and had this to say: > [@](#): > > Saw it. > > Yes, apparently Burgess was furious that both the film and the American version of the book left out his final chapter. The version playing at Greenway Arts Alliance is based on Burgess’s own script, so it has the restored ending mentioned in the spoiler above. > > It’s an interesting ending, although not the one we’re familiar with, and I think it is worth seeing the play just to see it. I mean, after you see it, you start saying things to yourself like, “Gee, if THAT’s what he really meant, that changes everything,” and “Man, that Kubrick had a lot of balls to cut that last chapter.” Raises, at the very least, issues of artistic integrity. > > Beyond the ending, I think the show is worth seeing. Although some of the supporting acting is uneven, Seamus Dever does a kick-ass job as Little Alex, particularly in the second act. (I’d not realized how impressive it is for someone to retch on cue.) > > Other good things – the FEEL of the production is right. Director Rick Sparks nodded to the visual feel of the movie, and recreated the bits that Absolutely Had To Be Recreated, but otherwise did not slavishly follow the film, and instead created his own creepy futuristic feel for the thing. > > Also, there’s music. It isn’t “Clockwork Orange – the musical,” or anything, but it does have a couple of songs – mostly in the hard rock variety – that (with one exception) work quite well. > > Anyway, I recommend it. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2003, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/10 "2003-04-29T22:53:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally quoted by Peg \* > **"Man, that Kubrick had a lot of balls to cut that last chapter." Raises, at the very least, issues of artistic integrity** It wasn’t Kubrick who cut the last chapter, it was Burgess’s American publisher. Kubrick was working from the American version of the book (despite making the film in England). Burgess himself said that the ending of the movie “wasn’t [Kubrick’s] fault.” ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/11 "2003-05-03T07:11:43Z")
HORRORSHOW!!! It was frightfully discordant at first until ya got into the rhythm; minimalist staging with scaffolding & lights & a central cabinet that held the main scene-change props; the hat & eyelash & codpiece aspects of the costume were of course film-derivative but the overall droog outfits were quite original. The Ludivico technique also resembled the film but how much variation can there be in a chair equipped with brain-probe cap & eyelid-clamps?_L_ The milkbar had NO porceline female milk dispensers _alas_ Since Malcolm so took over the role of Alex, this actor was as original as possible but couldn;t help but occasionally echo MMcD; Mr Deltoid was totally unique as were F Alexander & the IntInf Minister- who seemed to be channelling Robert Morley. They also sold scripts in the lobby so I enjoyed seeing how the production departed from the Burgess script (w/ uneven results). I think performances have been extended into early June- see it! ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/12 "2003-05-03T07:19:49Z")
> [@](#): > > I just read that Burgess hated the filmed version with the (American) downbeat ending. The UK version supposedly had the original more upbeat ending. Kubrick sort of renounced the movie himself; he didn’t like the bleak portrait of humanity he’d painted. He didn’t know about Burgess’s last chapter when he made the movie, and my understanding is that he was quite pissed when he found out what happened. ---
**Author:** ![RexDart](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b77776/32.png) [@RexDart](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RexDart)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 7:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/13 "2003-05-03T07:37:18Z")
Awww, c’mon guys, I _like_ the Kubrick ending. I remember seeing the film for the first time and absolutely cracking up at Alex’s final line. It was so perfect. I wanted to see humanity painted badly, it fit with everything else in the movie. The libertarian author ends up violating his principles for vengeance and to use another human as means to an end, great moment. If it had been upbeat and Alex had matured, I don’t know if I’d have liked the film as much. > [@](#): > > Kubrick sort of renounced the movie himself; he didn’t like the bleak portrait of humanity he’d painted. Yeah, well Kubrick turned into a real wuss at the end of his career. Look at _Eyes Wide Shut_, Cruise and Kidman indulge to some degree in their own temptations, but then at the end come back to each other. Married life and family had finally corrupted Kubrick, and he had to return his characters to a sane baseline at the end of the film. It seems like in general, his films had shown people of weak and easily corrupted character (Jack cannot overcome his weakness for alcohol) and characters whose efforts at self-restraint were entirely futile (see _Dr. Strangelove_). Then he made characters who were malleable but not totally corruptable (_Full Metal Jacket_.) Then he ends his career with _Eyes Wide Shut_ in which characters are stronger than their flaws, at least they are so after confronting them. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/14 "2003-05-03T14:08:41Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Marley23 \* > \*\*Kubrick sort of renounced the movie himself; he didn’t like the bleak portrait of humanity he’d painted. He didn’t know about Burgess’s last chapter when he made the movie, and my understanding is that he was quite pissed when he found out what happened. \*\* Cite? I’m not saying I don’t believe you. I just want to know wehre this comes from. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/15 "2003-05-03T16:19:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mahaloth \* > \*\*Cite? > > I’m not saying I don’t believe you. I just want to know wehre this comes from. \*\* I’m not sure which part of **Marley23** ’s remark you’re questioning, but [here’s](http://www.visual-memory.co.uk/amk/doc/interview.aco.html) a cite for Burgess’s not knowing about the 21st chapter: > [@](#): > > \*The end of A Clockwork Orange is different from the one in the Burgess book. \* > > There are two different versions of the novel. One has an extra chapter. I had not read this version until I had virtually finished the screenplay. This extra chapter depicts the rehabilitation of Alex. But it is, as far as I am concerned, unconvincing and inconsistent with the style and intent of the book. I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the publisher had somehow prevailed upon Burgess to tack on the extra chapter against his better judgment, so the book would end on a more positive note. I certainly never gave any serious consideration to using it. As for “renouncing” the movie, Kubrick did withdraw it from release in the U.K. a year or two after its premiere. It was never shown there again until after Kubrick’s death. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2003, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stage-version-of-a-clockwork-orange/171959/16 "2003-05-03T21:32:00Z")
as to why the movie was withdrawn in the UK, several gang-crimes had been committed using CWO themes & so the movie was being blamed for inspiring violence- and Kubrick concurred with its banning