Dude. You think this is weird, have you ever noticed the parallels between Lord of the Rings and Pink Floyd’s Dark Side of the Moon? Start the album right when you start reading. It’s freaky.
(this post not subtitled for the humor impaired)
That seems like too much of a superficial diagnosis to me. She isnt using money per say, but with her ring of power is “buying” the peaceful youthfulness of Lothlorien. (A reasonable “stairway to heaven”) Sort of a door into summer type of thing. When The Ring is destroyed she can no longer use hers to “buy” the sort of stairway-to-heaven for Lothlorien.
Again, the site which GuitarGuy gave gives a “reasonable” relation to tolkien and Kashmir, but even so, that particular fact was meant to show previous tolkien-zeppelin works. I think we can all agree that led zeppelin did some tolkien related songs.
Yes and we can also asume that I am Robert Plant.
That’s a lovely analysis but seeing as I didn’t write the song there would be no way for me to be “sure” of any line, but TELL ME why the song wouldn’t make sense with either one of those interpretations! It would have a slightly different meaning with either line but would not ruin my interpretaion of the song. Either Galadriel is thinking of Gandolf or she is thinking about the desturction of Mirkwood. No real change to the meaning of the song.
Maybe Plant meant it in a different way than the classical, shallow sence or maybe it makes perfect sence even with Galadriel. She wasn’t perfect you know, nor was the metaphor to be taken literally (As if she couldnt tell gold from other things). I still say the similarity of the all important first lines remains.
Maybe he is saying that Galadriel put too much faith in the power of the rings (Gold) with which she used to keep Lothlorien the way it was. And eventually when the power of the rings were destroyed so was their power on earth (including the heaven-like state of lothlorien) “Your stairway lies on the whispering wind”
Again, I didn’t write the song, I’m just doing my best, and no one has given any “real” arguyments.
bill
here is one from that web site from someone that didn’t catch the led zeppelin tie in, but I did.
This certainly matches the similar lyrics at the end of Stairway “To be a rock and not to roll”
Can’t explain how that fits into my interpretation besides agian having to do with gandalf and the LotR, but I never had an interpreation of that line. Now that about covers every line in the text.
NewUser1 writes:
> Again, I didn’t write the song, I’m just doing my best, and no
> one has given any “real” arguyments.
And neither have you. No one doubts that there are a number of vague Tolkien references in Led Zeppelin. Lots of lines in the song can be made to sorta, kinda refer to things in The Lord of the Rings. That’s not good enough. Since there is no use of specific character or place names from Tolkien, what you’re going to have to do if you want to show that Plant (well, actually it was Plant and Page who wrote the song) intended it to be about The Lord of the Rings is to show a consistent interpretation of the entire song that relates it to the book. Interpreting one part of the song as a reference to one part of the book and another part of the song as a different and not quite consistent reference to another part of the book isn’t sufficient.
As things stand, well, yes, the song does sound sorta, kinda Tolkien-like. So what?
Hey!!!
That’s enough!!!
Stop bogarting that joint, dude!!!
At least he isn’t talking about Engelbert Humperdinck. 
You think that’s freaky? You should try Dark Sode of the Moon and the the LotR movie. That’s really freaky.
Id like to see those interviews Rastahomie…
What do u mean there is no argument??? have you not read any of this post??? did you just skip that whole starting thread?? are you just replying with random and useless comments?? i stand with you bill to the last…stairway IS about lord of the rings
right on guitarguy:D
What? don’t make me qoute the whole OP
Hey, YOU tell me who the “Lady who shines white light” is besides Galadriel (and still fit in with the other lines), nothing vague about it. She IS the Lady of Light. That is one of the non-vague lyrics that puts the rest in perspective.
You keep saying that my explanation is vague and some parts could be interpreted in diffrent ways without changing the overall LotR theme, but for the most part, I have explained most unvaguely what each line means.
If you wrote the most EPIC and Mystical rock song of all time, would you promote the idea that it was about A fantasty trilogy? I woulnd’t. I think that Robert Plant (who wrote the LYRICS) would want us to figure out what the song meant rather than him explaining it. It leaves a wider audeince and makes it more epic and mystical (which sells records) if he doesn’t go right out and tell everyone what the song means, sorta somthing for the fans to figure out. Well I have. And as a Led Zeppelin and Tolkien Fan I wanted to share that connection.
And stop saying “vague” like you know what the word means Wendell.
Bill
wait I want to make this clear, we all now agree that it is tolkien related and not celtic or some crap like that, right ?
Uh, NewUser and guitarguy, since you’re newbies, let me offer you a little advice:
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If you’re going to debate, debate. Don’t just act like typical True Believers and react to counterpoints by sticking your fingers in your ears and saying “I can’t hear you!!”
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Don’t level criticisms against other posters unless you have reason to beleive they are well-founded. “And stop saying ‘vague’ like you know what the word means Wendell,” is one of the single dumbest things I have ever seen on the SDMB, for two reasons.
The first is that your own grasp of the English language seems . . . tenuous, at best.
The second is that I have have met Wendell several times in person. He is not only one of the most intelligent people I have ever met from the SDMB, he is one of the most well-educated people I’ve ever met, period – the holder of several degrees, including graduate degrees, in various disciplines. One of his degrees is in the field of linguistics. I think, from that, we can assume he has at least some grasp of the meaning of the word “vague.”
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Given the degree to which Tolkien himself drew from Celtic mythology and tradition in his writings, and as a linguist whose loves included Celtic, Gaelic and Welsh, he’d probably be amused at best and horrified at worst to see you dismiss the Celts as “some crap like that.”
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Finally, luminscence being associated with royalty, or importance, or virtue, is such a standard trope in fantasy and religious literature that, absent a specific name, there’s no reason to assume it refers to anyone in particular.
Nah, Stairway to Heaven is obviously about the cult of the Virgin in Catholic theology…think about it:
The “lady” is the Virgin, and “all that glitters is gold” and “buying a stairway to heaven” refers to the old Catholic practice of selling indulgence. “With a word she can get what she came for”, refers to her status as a saint, who pleads for the souls of believers on earth.
The piper is Jesus, who’s second coming will happen “if we all call the tune”…when the world is converted to Catholicism and start working towards a world based on Catholic ethics.
Who’s the May Queen? The virgin Mary.
So, I think it’s obvious that “Stairway to Heaven” is about Roman Catholicism, and specifically, the cult of the Virgin.
I’ve never actually heard Stairway to Heaven, or Led Zepplin, and I don’t know what was going through their minds when they wrote the song. Maybe it was some sort of tribute to LOTR. However, song interpretation is a tricky thing (as is literature interpretation), and to say that it’s obviously a tribute to LOTR, is being overly certain.
Moderator’s Note :
Emotions in this thread seem to be running a bit high. I would ask that it be toned down a bit by our new friends before this gets into Pit territory.
Thanks,
O.K., let me go through the song in detail and show you what it would take to produce a consistent interpretation of the song as referring to The Lord of the Rings and, in particular, as referring to Galadriel:
“There’s a lady who’s sure all that glitters is gold . . .”
In what sense is Galadriel sure that all that glitters is gold? Yes, there’s a poem in the book that says that “All that is gold does not glitter.” But that’s not said by Galadriel, and it’s exactly opposite what the line in the song says.
“And she’s buying a stairway to heaven.”
What is the stairway? In what sense is she buying it?
“When she get there she knows, all the stores will be closed . . .”
Where is “there”? Heaven? What are the stores there? Why will they be closed? What’s all the economic imagery doing in a song that’s supposedly about The Lord of the Rings? More specifically, what’s it doing in a song about Galadriel? Where is it ever implied that elves are in need of money?
“There’s a sign on the wall but she wants to be sure, 'cause you know sometimes words have two meanings.”
What is the sign on the wall? What two meanings does it have? Why should Galadriel, of all the people in The Lord of the Rings, be uncertain about the meaning of this sign?
“If there’s a bustle in your hedgerow, don’t be alarmed now, it’s just a spring clean for the May queen.”
Who is the May queen? Why are they doing a spring cleaning for her? For that matter, who is the “they” who’s doing the cleaning? Why would someone need to do a spring cleaning for Galadriel? Doesn’t this sound more like a reference to some goddess of the spring (from Celtic or some other mythology) than to Galadriel?
“There walks a lady we all know who shines white light and wants to show how everything still turns to gold.”
In what sense do we all know Galadriel? In what sense does she want to show us that everything still turns to gold? In so far as Galadriel had any message, it was about loss. She knew that the time of the elves was coming to an end and that they would soon leave Middle Earth.
Incidentally, there are lots of ladies with white light in various religious and mythological schemes. You are aware, aren’t you, that Tolkien was a devout Catholic, and at the back of his mind in his picturing of Galadriel was the Virgin Mary?
“Your head is humming and it won’t go, in case you don’t know, the piper’s calling you to join him.”
Why is someone’s head humming (Galadriel’s? The narrator’s? The head of the person being addressed in the song?)? Who’s the piper? Doesn’t his sound more like drug imagery than anything derived from Tolkien? Indeed, doesn’t this entire song sound like it’s by someone who’s used drugs who’s describing the images in his head caused by the drugs? It seems like this person has at some point read Tolkien and a lot of Celtic mythology and this has affected his images, but there aren’t any consistent references to Tolkien.
If this song is about The Lord of the Rings, who is it addressed to and who is narrating it? There are a number of uses of “you” and “I” in the song, and I don’t see how they consistently fit into The Lord of the Rings. Doesn’t this sound more like one drug user describing to another his drug images? It sounds like both of them have read Tolkien and Celtic mythology and thus both recognize a lot of vague images from those works.
Interesting. That was a simul-post by Captain Amazing and myself. (Yeah, I know they were an hour apart, but it took me a long time to compose the post and I was doing other things at the same time.) We both noticed that the lady with white light could be interpreted as being the Virgin Mary.
Whew! I’m not a huge Led Zeppelin fan, and while I’ve read LotR a few times and am inchanted by it, I’m not a TrueFan®. That is, Tolkein is not my life. Also, I am not a linguist. I’ve read many pieces of classic literature, but I am not as well-read as many on these boards. Anyway, here’s what I think:
The first stanza refers to a shallow woman. (I’ll post some lyrics, but I’m sure this post will fall under “fair use” rules.) “There’s a lady who’s sure all that glitters is gold”. That is, she sees the surface of a thing and not its value. She’s one of these people who “knows the price of everything, but the value of nothing”. She’s spoiled. “When she gets there she knows, if the stores are all closed / With a word she can get what she came for.” She gets what she wants when she wants it. “Don’t be silly, darling! They’ll open up for me!”
In the second stanza: “There’s a sign on the wall but she wants to be sure / 'Cause you know sometimes words have two meanings”. I think she is confronted by a “closed sign” or some other obstacle. She can’t conceive that she is blocked, and tries to figure out if it applies to her. Nearby, a bird (maybe her inner voice?) sings, “You’re not as ‘all that’ as you think you are.”
The third stanza seems to be along these lines: The narrator is telling us, “Sometimes I feel as if I should move on. Look at that woman. She’s shallow and conceited. I’m surrounded by such people! They’re burning down the forests to run their machines, and they don’t realize they’re destroying something beautiful. It doesn’t matter to them!” I think “the ones who stand looking” are people of similar mind to the narrator. If they are looking, then perhaps they see.
*And it’s whispered that soon if we all call the tune
Then the piper will lead us to reason.
And a new day will dawn for those who stand long
And the forests will echo with laughter. *
I think this means that in the midst of all of the consumerism, there are people who don’t – er, “buy” – into it. Remember that when the song was written there were “Flower Children” who rejected the consumerism of their parents. So while this “lady”, a superficial, conceited consumer is having her fun, the Flower Children are whispering amongst themselves that if they all band together they can make a difference. They can change old attitudes and Nature will be safe.
*If there’s a bustle in your hedgerow, don’t be alarmed now,
It’s just a spring clean for the May queen. *
I don’t know enough about the Spring festivals and traditions to really comment on the May Queen. The next lines say that there are two paths we can go down. As human beings we can choose the path of destruction or the path of salvation. It’s our choice. But even if we buy into consumerism, we can still “see the light” and change the way we do things. We always have a chance of salvation if we change our ways.
Miss Superficial is starting to hear the humming in her head of the voices around her that are urging her to change. She’s becoming aware that there is a greater world than the one she’s living in – the one where the point is to “see and be seen” by the “right people”, and to buy the latest trend. The narrator asks this woman if she can hear the call. He tells her that the Righteous Path, the Road to Enlightenment, the Stairway to Heaven, is not based in the material world she’s living in. It lies on the whispering wind and the green trees and the call of birds – Nature.
“And as we wind on down the road / Our shadows taller than our soul.” seems to refer to the “burden of sin” we supposedly all carry. Our “shadows” – sin – are greater than our goodness. As we walk the path of materialism we see the Superficial Lady. She has rejected materialism and her soul has become clean (“shines white light”). Although she no longer has the trappings of the Bourgeoisie, her new attitudes turn the natural things to “gold”. And if you listen to her when she tells of her transformation, then you’ll finally “get it”. You’ll understand that we are all One, and we live on one planet. You’ll know that what we do to our environment, we do to ourselves. You’ll see that if this Queen of Commercialism can change, then you are not beyond hope. You will become enlightened.
Anyway, that’s my non-expert, non-Tolkein interpretation.