# Stanley cup winner snubs President for political reasons **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 24, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460 "2012-01-24T02:14:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/41 "2012-01-24T14:29:35Z")
It’s not that this guy decided to make some “stand” that bothers me, it’s that his stand is friggin’ wishy-washy. It’s nothing but a boilerplate talking point memo. “the Federal government has grown out of control” “Rights, Liberties, and Property of the People” “opposition to the Constitution and the Founding Fathers” “my right as a Free Citizen” “both parties are responsible” “a choice I had to make as an INDIVIDUAL.” No stand, just bullshit, random capitalizing, gummint-hating whining. If he’d had shown some balls and said, “Listen, I don’t like Obama,” at least he’d have something to stand on. ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/42 "2012-01-24T14:30:54Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > I find views like this deeply unsettling. Look, I’m not saying that I think he doesn’t have the right to not go. But I think its a dick move. This isn’t attending a rally for Obama, and there is no implied support for him or his policies in attending. If he had invited the team to attend the Democratic National Convention, I would completely support anyone not going in that circumstance. Perhaps I worded my opinion a bit too strongly. I don’t really believe that someone who does this can’t possibly be patriotic..that was a bit hyperbolic; but it is rather disrespectful, and I do believe that the office deserves respect even if you don’t have particular respect for the man holding it. ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/43 "2012-01-24T14:35:00Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > So it would have been classier if Thomas had pulled an [Eartha Kitt](http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=6531879&page=1) and let Obama have a piece of his mind in front of all his teammates? > > _"Kitt, according to some accounts, caused (Lady Bird Johnson to cry at the White House luncheon in 1968) when she said, “You send the best of the country off to be shot and maimed. No wonder the kids rebel and take pot.”_ > > It might’ve been fun if the goalie and the Prez had a mini-debate on overreaching federal powers in front of the slack-jawed Bruins team and various White House functionaries. I’m sure Obama could have held his own. He doesn’t have to make a spectacle out of it, but I have no problem if there’s some one on one time with each of the players with him voicing his concerns to the President. Yeah, if he just jumped up front and started yelling “you suck” that’d also be quite disrespectful. There is a way to show you don’t agree with the man, but still respect the office and take it as a unique opportunity to meet the leader of the free world. ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/44 "2012-01-24T14:38:16Z")
Meh. If he doesn’t want to go then he doesn’t go. And he won’t have a picture of him with the President to show is grandchildren. I would never make the same choice, but I don’t think it reflects on much beyond the fact that he’s not very good at separating politics from the rest of life. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/45 "2012-01-24T14:42:55Z")
Not to mention that he’s sort of painted himself into a corner. It seems the guy is politically aware. But he can’t meet any politician now without being labeled a hypocrite. Maybe that’s his game; maybe he had a big day of Madden '12 ahead of him and he doesn’t like to be bothered on weekends or something. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/46 "2012-01-24T14:49:39Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Not to mention that he’s sort of painted himself into a corner. It seems the guy is politically aware. But he can’t meet any politician now without being labeled a hypocrite. Well, presumably he can meet Ron Paul or the other politicians who want to shut down the government. Or any state legislator. I don’t think it’s a big deal. I just think it’s hilarious that there are only two American players on the team and one isn’t going. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/47 "2012-01-24T15:18:17Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#): > > He’s an athlete and so has no real obligation to be politically neutral whatsoever, anymore than the billionaire business owners that own the team he works for–if those guys can donate money to political campaigns and be politically active I don’t see why the players can’t. > [@Kobal2](#): > > Other than that, I don’t see anything wrong with giving your own President the finger. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > Personally? I think Thomas had ever right to do so, > [@Jman](#): > > Look, I’m not saying that I think he doesn’t have the right to not go. > [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > I don’t care if someone doesn’t want to meet the President because of his policies or because he’d rather stay home and sleep in. > > His employer might have something to say about it, but it’s still not my business. > [@mhendo](#): > > I don’t agree with you much on political issues, but i agree with this. I’ve got no problem with what the player did. > [@RickJay](#): > > Thomas was free not to go - it is a free country …Again, it’s a free country and you are free to do things that are dickish, dishonorable, and insulting, and I think it was all three. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > I disagree with Thomas’s decision, like I said – I think he really let down his teammates. But, I support his right to do so. Geez this is like getting a bunch of politicians into a room full of people where someone identifies themself as a veteran and every politician feels compelled to start every sentence with “thank you for your service” Can we please assume that EVERYONE agrees that everyone has the right to do whatever the fuck they want, especially if what they want to do is give their president the middle finger. It is our country’s most sacred and cherished right. I think some people are getting the point and it seems like most people agree that it was a dick move > [@BeaMyra](#): > > I dislike Obama, because I feel he was dishonest when he campaigned, by making promises he knew darn well he couldn’t keep. Sure others do that, but they weren’t conning other people at the same time as the voice of change. What promise did he make that he knew he couldn’t keep? Guantanamo? > [@SenorBeef](#): > > Actually, he has a reputation as being the dirtiest player in the NFL, inflicting a lot of concussions deliberately. How the heck does a goalie do that? I don’t follow hockey but I have watched a few playoff games. It seems to me that goalies are far more liekly to be on the receiving end of physical punishment. > [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > If he’d had shown some balls and said, “Listen, I don’t like Obama,” at least he’d have something to stand on. Yeah, it wopuldn’t seem so lame but then that opens him up to kneejerks liberrals accusing him of disliking Obama because of his race. I don’t know what the source of his dislike might be but (fairly or not) the racist elements of the tea party have given credence to these kneejerk accusations. Better if the Tea Party had identified and ejected the racists early on (who knows if there would have been quite as big a turnout or quite as much vigor, see, how they open themselves up to all sorts of attacks?) so that we can have a rational debate about their stupid ideas. Instead we find out that there are racists in their leadership. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Well, presumably he can meet Ron Paul or the other politicians who want to shut down the government. Or any state legislator. > > I don’t think it’s a big deal. I just think it’s hilarious that there are only two American players on the team and one isn’t going. What?!?!? we haven’t annexed Canada yet? Well, we should. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/48 "2012-01-24T15:22:30Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > How the heck does a goalie do that? I don’t follow hockey but I have watched a few playoff games. It seems to me that goalies are far more liekly to be on the receiving end of physical punishment. The response was to a question about James Harrison, NFL linebacker. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/49 "2012-01-24T15:26:39Z")
It’s being a jerk in that he’s making a big deal out of it, and thus denying his teammates who do want to go a peaceful time. But, here’s the thing: quite a lot of athletes are jerks. I really can’t get fired up over this any more than any other athlete who puts himself in front of his teammates. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/50 "2012-01-24T15:32:23Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Cite? As a Steelers fan, the ONLY player I know of who neglected to go was James Harrison. [His reason](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Harrison_%28American_football%29#Personal)? Gee, and Harrison seemed like such a nice guy. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/51 "2012-01-24T15:35:08Z")
Seems like a dick move. Obama wasn’t inviting him to a political function, but just as a generic “go America” type tying. Going wouldn’t have been any sort of statement, other then maybe a vague pro-US one (or at least, pro-US hockey teams). Trying to twist it into a political thing is needlessly combative. And agree that posters stressing his right to decline the invite are arguing against a strawman. No one is saying the Secret Service should arrest him and haul him unwillingly to the Whitehouse. Obviously he can legally do whatever he wants. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/52 "2012-01-24T15:36:54Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Seems like a dick move. Obama wasn’t inviting him to a political function, but just as a generic “go America” type tying. It’s not even that. If you win a championship in a pro sport or a major college sport, you get invited to the White House. It’s just part of the package now. It has been for a while and even trying to curtail the practice might be more trouble than it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/53 "2012-01-24T16:20:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > By the way, James Harrison of the Steelers refused to visit the White House after the team’s Super Bowl wins in 2006 and 2009. And? I love the Steelers as much as the next western PA guy, but Harrison’s always been the (black-and-) gold standard for “being a tactless asshole in public”. ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/54 "2012-01-24T17:00:58Z")
As to Harrison…I am a rabid Steelers fan, and when he didn’t go when he was invited, I felt the same way about that as I do about Thomas. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/55 "2012-01-24T17:10:36Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > And? I love the Steelers as much as the next western PA guy, but Harrison’s always been the (black-and-) gold standard for “being a tactless asshole in public”. Harrison was mentioned earlier in the thread (not by name) as a player who refused to meet Bush. I was pointing out he refused to meet visit the White House under Bush and Obama. And from what I can tell, being an asshole is his primary talent. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/56 "2012-01-24T17:12:55Z")
Sign me up for “It’s a dick move, but in America everyone’s free to be a dick.” That said, I find his statement entertaining, inasmuch as I believe that Tim Thomas has read and understood the Constitution about as much as I believe in fairies and unicorns. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/57 "2012-01-24T18:05:44Z")
Its a complete dick move against his teammates as opposed to the President. If I was his teammate I would be like “What the fuck? You don’t want to celebrate this massive achievement we pulled off as a team. Fuck you.” ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/58 "2012-01-24T18:45:58Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Actually, he has a reputation as being the dirtiest player in the NFL, inflicting a lot of concussions deliberately. Maybe he’s bitter that everyone else is smarter than him and is trying to lower everyone else’s IQ to his level one concussion at a time. Cite? How about a link to a recognized sports commentary source that makes this claim, eh? I would have picked Sean Avery or Matt Cooke, maybe that Jarko Rootoo guy from Ottawa. If I weren’t a Cappies fan, I might admit that Alex Ovechkin can throw a few knees. But I’ve never heard Tim Thomas described as the dirtiest player in the NHL. (I assume your ‘NFL’ is a typo, since he’s certainly NOT an NFL player). So – cite? Or could it be that political zeal has caused you to say something that simply isn’t true? ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/59 "2012-01-24T18:50:27Z")
It could also be that you misread the post. He was talking about James Harrison who plays Football in the **NFL**. But, then, we all know what happens when we assume, don’t we. ---
**Author:** ![theR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@theR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/theR)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2012, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460/60 "2012-01-24T19:06:08Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Personally? I think Thomas had ever right to do so, however I think he should have gone for the sake of his teammates. I don’t think a visit like this is a time to make a political statement. > > HOWEVER, if he feels that strongly, I do give him props him for being [diplomatic](http://espn.go.com/boston/nhl/story/_/id/7493826/barack-obama-honors-stanley-cup-champion-boston-bruins-tim-thomas-no-show) about it: > > Notice he said nothing about liberals, conservatives, Obama, anything like that. I disagree with his choice, because I really think he let his fellow Bruins down, but I don’t think what he did was a major insult. > > Unless, of course, you have proof that Thomas is a racist? He likes the Tea Party and Glenn Beck and chooses to hide it in the statement you quoted, pretending to be non-partisan. He clearly doesn’t like Obama and I don’t buy his statement about blaming all government, because it’s boilerplate Tea Party words that never appeared prior to Obama. I would think more of him if he was honest about it instead of being weasily. > [@](#): > > A native of Flint, Mich., Thomas wears a helmet adorned with the patriotic slogan “Don’t Tread on Me” and is a fan of conservative pundit Glenn Beck, formerly of Fox News. [http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view.bg?articleid=1398302&srvc=home&position=emailed](http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view.bg?articleid=1398302&srvc=home&position=emailed) > [@](#): > > Thomas has been recognized as a “true Tea Party patriot” for having the saying “In God We Trust” and the Gadsden flag on his mask. He also publicly said he is a fan of former Fox News talk show host Glenn Beck and lobbied to be a guest on Beck’s show. > **[Davison native Tim Thomas would rather be on Glenn Beck's show than meet...](https://www.mlive.com/sports/flint/2012/01/davison_native_tim_thomas_woul.html)** > > Davison native and Boston Bruins goalie Tim Thomas has made headlines with his decision to skip the team's White House visit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/stanley-cup-winner-snubs-president-for-political-reasons/610460.md?page=4)