# Star HS basketball star recruit collapses in despair when he is sentenced to 3 years in prison **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 23, 2012, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350 "2012-08-23T04:05:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Honesty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/f04885/32.png) [@Honesty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honesty)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/141 "2012-08-26T02:43:28Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > It’s like some of ya’ll are forgetting there are real-live black people on this board. Ain’t that the truth. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/142 "2012-08-26T03:00:35Z")
A year or two in prison might actually do this kid some good. With the restraining order and other events related to the case, he had ample warnings to get off his self-destructive path. He chose not to heed them. There are only two possibilities here: One, he’s incapable of adjusting his behavior, controlling his actions and emotions. In which case, he just ain’t fixable. After his initial prison term, he’ll be back. Like OJ. Typically, guys who stalk their exes and then beat their asses all over the house, aren’t fixable. Often, they don’t really think they did anything wrong. “It was all her fault.” Or, two, he was just too stubborn, immature, arrogant, whatever to learn from the red flags waving in front of his face. So he does a year in prison, comes out a wiser man. He won’t be able to play in college, but there are plenty of other places to play - minor leagues in the US, pro league in Europe and Oz. Most Div 1 bball and fball players don’t graduate from the colleges they attend anyway. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/143 "2012-08-26T04:08:27Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > I don’t. Far as I can tell, nobody else here does, either. > > That’s the last time I let you bait me in this thread. Just because I don’t agree with you, doesn’t mean I’m defending or excusing him. You can’t have a civil discussion about this, because for some crazy reason anyone who doesn’t trip over themselves in their haste to prove they hate him more than everyone else does gets this kind of crap from you. If you don’t want people to think you’re defending or excusing him you should stop implying that three years is too harsh a sentence for man who kicked a woman in the head multiple times. When caught, not only did the asshole not apologize, he threatened to hurt her again even worse. At one point you actually ludicrously wrote (post 26): > [@](#): > > He beat someone up and made threats against them. Yes, its a serious crime, but worthy of jail? If you don’t want to sound like you’re excusing then don’t write shit like that. If you physically attempt to beat the shit out of someone you’d damned well better be prepared to be put in a fucking cage for a while until you learn not to pull that shit. I am not a law and order Republican lock them up and throw away the key kind of a person. I hate the death penalty with a passion because I think it is the height of barbarism. I think many sentences are too long. But after reading what this spoiled brat did, I am not particularly sympathetic to your rather silly assertion that we should hand him probation for a nasty physical assault that he has not even admitted was a terrible thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/144 "2012-08-26T05:36:55Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > You might need to work on your “mocking” style then. It didn’t sound like you were mocking anything. I figured out he was mocking while I read the very sentence it was in, and I can be tonedeaf. Maybe you might want to turn up the tone on your hearing aid, too. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/145 "2012-08-26T05:38:56Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > If you don’t want people to think you’re defending or excusing him you should stop implying that three years is too harsh a sentence for man who kicked a woman in the head multiple times. When caught, not only did the asshole not apologize, he threatened to hurt her again even worse. > … > If you don’t want to sound like you’re excusing then don’t write shit like that. If you physically attempt to beat the shit out of someone you’d damned well better be prepared to be put in a fucking cage for a while until you learn not to pull that shit. > > I am not a law and order Republican lock them up and throw away the key kind of a person. I hate the death penalty with a passion because I think it is the height of barbarism. I think many sentences are too long. But after reading what this spoiled brat did, I am not particularly sympathetic to your rather silly assertion that we should hand him probation for a nasty physical assault that he has not even admitted was a terrible thing to do. Yup. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/146 "2012-08-26T06:16:50Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > Anyone who beats their girlfriend has made a mistake. Do you think it’s NOT a mistake for a man to beat his girlfriend? > > What you just did is to try to make it seem like I said something I didn’t say. I never said he mistakenly beat his girlfriend. I said he made a mistake, by committing a terrible crime. If you want to debate me, debate the argument I make, not the argument you wish I made. If this is what you call a “mistake”, I’d hate to see your idea of a serious offense. These kinds of “mistakes” unfortunately, have victims, and have legal consequences. If people can’t accept the consequences of said “mistakes”, they’ll never learn from them. Otherwise, why bother making laws in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/147 "2012-08-26T06:58:24Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > I guess - speaking as someone who had been assaulted once and did everything “right” as a victim and there was overwhelming evidence + a confession and _nothing happened_ - I see it as harsh. Wait – because you were assaulted and nothing happened, you think nothing should happen in this case? Do you agree with the result in your case? > [@](#): > > Christ, people get less for **killing people** while driving drunk. [Example](http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2012/05/14/delaware-man-accused-repeat-drunken-driving-sentenced-30-months.html). Either drunk driving/manslaughter laws are too light or 3 years is too much. I know **Lavender Blue** thinks driving drunk is minor, but I don’t. Did you read the story you cited? The drunk driver received **8 years** for the vehicular manslaughter. The 30 months was for driving drunk after he was released from prison. In this case I think 3 years seems perfectly reasonable for his actions and subsequent lack of remorse. If I had been assaulted, it’s what I would have wanted to happen to the perpetrator, regardless of his career prospects. ---
**Author:** ![The\_King\_of\_Soup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@The\_King\_of\_Soup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_King_of_Soup)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/148 "2012-08-26T08:59:24Z")
I think it’s probably [true](http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=797) that 18-year-old male brains are not fully developed in some important ways that govern behavior. Some evidence suggests actual structural and chemical reasons that an 18 year old male might be more emotional and less likely to foresee consequences than he will be a few years later. And I can see why some view this as a powerful argument against capital punishment for young males (I save time by just being against it for anybody). But this is not to say that prison is inappropriate. First, immature, emotional, impulsive brains refrain from violence all the time even though they’re bad at assessing consequences for themselves, because the ability to foresee consequences is not the only governor of behavior: the reason most people don’t go around brutalizing smaller people is _not_ because of a sudden visualization of the potential consequences, it’s because most people have been taught and have internalized the lesson that it is wrong. What can send things haywire is if we provide enough counter-examples demonstrating to a particular kid that he will _not_ have to worry about consequences – then his real-world experience will more than compensate for the brain maturity we hope and expect he’ll achieve. Second, intelligence and maturity exist on a long continuum even in adults, and I don’t think we will (or should) ever get to the point, absent actual pathology, where we punish according to individual states of psychological and emotional development. Let’s face it: “Don’t hit girls” is an awfully low bar for anyone, even if his brain is still a few years away from full physical maturity, to hurdle. A seventy-year old is, on the statistical evidence, even better able to avoid domestic violence than a forty-year old: what sort of concessions shall we make in punishing the latter for beating _his_ girlfriend? I’m also unsympathetic to the argument that the punishment is unduly harsh because it takes away something – a potential, if uncertain, college and professional career in sports – larger than a mere three calendar years suggests. For one thing, I simply do not find the prospect of another future wealthy and successful professional athlete who mistreats and threatens women necessary for my vision of a perfect world. Second, I would view any university which knowingly enrolled a man, at whatever age, whose brain development admitted of physical and emotional violence against women, with a great deal of alarm, and if they did it on account of his prowess at sports, I would add outrage and disgust to my reaction. ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/149 "2012-08-26T21:16:04Z")
> [@Farmer\_Jane](#): > > I guess our views on the criminal justice system are quite different. I’m not convinced he would go around beating all future girlfriends. > > I didn’t object to a year in jail. But three? > Jail is pretty horrible. I’m not sure if you just don’t care what happens when young boys go to jail or you want to be extra tough on what you think is ‘soft racism’, but I strongly disagree with you that you think prison conditions in the U.S. aren’t a factor in some Dopers’ train of thought. > > I’m sure you’re aware of Southern Poverty Law Center’s research on juvy facilities for young minority boys in the South. Great. **Now multiply that by three years and people who are much bigger and tougher than you.** > > That’s appropriate punishment? > > Jail is more ghetto than anything you’ve experienced in your model minority life, **monstro**. Please don’t accuse me of racism because you can’t understand the implications of sending a young teenage boy to jail. Er, not that Farmer isn’t going to have a terrible terrible time in prison, but can we agree that he’s not going to run into a whole lot of people in this world who are bigger and tougher than he? > [@Mosier](#): > > The point I was trying to make is that the punishment doesn’t seem to fit the crimes, to me. He beat someone up and made threats against them. Yes, its a serious crime, but worthy of jail? According to everyone that knows him, this is not a pattern of behavior that we needed to remove him from society for their protection. It was a guy who lost control of himself, and might benefit from honest-to-goodness attempts at behavior therapy. Putting him in jail for 3 years doesn’t help anyone, costs a lot of money, and hardens him up to be a much worse criminal when he gets out. > > I just think the judge made the wrong choice here. Some people need to be removed from society because they can’t function in it. Do you think that’s applicable here? Should he really get the same punishment a fifth-time drunk driver gets? To answer your questions: 1) Yes, worthy of jail. His actions are pretty much the dictionary definition of worthy of jail. It’s the reason we have jails. 2) I do not know if Farmer can or cannot function in society for the long run. I truly hopes that one day, he does. But right now, nope, he’s flunked himself straight on out of society. 3) Yes, that sounds reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2012, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/150 "2012-08-26T23:54:42Z")
> [@Simple\_Linctus](#): > > No one should have their life and career ruined for a mistake at the age of 18, \*\*especially \*\*if the victim forgives him. > > This is an idiotic ruling morally and socially. I do not doubt that it is legally correct however, and to be honest fits in with what I know about US sentencing of black people. Speaking as a black man who’s seen female friends & family victimized by other black men–occasionally under color of “ball players are important, we must protect them!” I have to say that I this this punishment was entirely appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/151 "2012-08-27T00:15:26Z")
On rewatching the video, I have to say the fainting spell is hella drama queeny. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/152 "2012-08-27T00:48:00Z")
No hitting allowed. My children knew that when they were a lot younger than 18. I do hope this young man will learn that lesson. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/153 "2012-08-27T01:54:49Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#): > > On rewatching the video, I have to say the fainting spell is hella drama queeny. He fell out like he got the Holy Ghost. I was halfway expecting some old ladies in white gloves to come out and fan him. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/154 "2012-08-27T02:04:53Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > He fell out like he got the Holy Ghost. I was halfway expecting some old ladies in white gloves to come out and fan him. Hahaaa! Those little ol’ ladies were always on time, weren’t they? Man, they never get recognition for making sure no one ever hits the floor without quick attending to with a Martin Luther King or [Blonde Jesus cardboard fan](http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_GHoww9Z7d0o/TDDdwBGeqNI/AAAAAAAAAko/1Yuk2y14e7Q/s1600/Jesus%2BFan.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/155 "2012-08-27T02:24:45Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > He fell out like he got the Holy Ghost. I was halfway expecting some old ladies in white gloves to come out and fan him. That’s it! If he ever gets to the NBA, his nickname will be Church Lady. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![denquixote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9bd4f/32.png) [@denquixote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/denquixote)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/156 "2012-08-27T05:55:29Z")
I don’t think anyone thinks he should go free because he is good at basketball. But there are alternatives to jail time. Whether his situation merits alternative sentencing is certainly not clear from the minimum facts shown. What he really needs is a good lawyer. When have you ever seen someone appearing for sentencing in a serious situation, in their orange prison jumpsuit? This appears to be a case of someone who has absolutely noone in his corner, for whatever reasons. ---
**Author:** ![highrollinwooded](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/71c47a/32.png) [@highrollinwooded](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/highrollinwooded)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/157 "2012-08-27T08:48:09Z")
As a former victim of a violent asshole, this son of a bitch should do every hour that he was sentenced to!!! He’ll probably get out and re-offend when this is all said and done… ---
**Author:** ![sugaree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@sugaree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sugaree)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/158 "2012-08-27T15:25:17Z")
I’m kind of appalled at all the people who are focusing the discussion on his future (and I’m not necessarily looking at anyone here; I’ve been reading other comments other places on the Internet). Let’s play the What If game. What if Farmer and the young woman had never met before, but he needed some money and decided to mug her. The attack and robbery played out just like we saw on the video, but all the hitting, hair-pulling, and kicking were not inspired by some relationship vendetta but were only intended as a means of separating her from her keys, phone, bank car, and computer. I can’t imagine that anyone would think that three years served was too severe in those circumstances even for a first time offender, so why is it too harsh a sentence for a domestic violence incident? Hell, I do not know if anyone would be saying anything short of “them’s the breaks” if Farmer was some enterprising young dope slinger or car thief caught and sentenced to serve three years. And 18-year-olds who sling dope or steal cars or even mug people in a violent fashion are far more likely to reform than 18-year-olds who hunt down, beat, and terrorize their partners/ex-partners. The latter kids just age into 30- and 40- and 50-year-olds who continue to stalk and beat and terrorize (and very occasionally, kill) their partners/ex-partners. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2012, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/159 "2012-08-27T16:20:07Z")
Thats a very good and interesting post there Sugaree. Yeah, the whole dangerously attacking some you know is somehow generally socially more acceptable than attacking a random stranger is a bit odd when you think about it. Kid is damn lucky (and so is she) he didn’t do some serious or permanent damage to her and then spend a good fraction of his life in jail. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2012, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350/160 "2012-08-28T04:37:45Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > …He’s getting a sentence stricter than most forcible rape convictions. Got a cite for that statement? The most recent stat that I could find is a 1992 Department of Justice report, summarised in the wiki article on [Laws Regarding Rape](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_and_punishment#Punishment): > [@](#): > > Prison sentences for rape are not uniform. A study made by the U.S. Department of Justice of prison releases in 1992, involving about 80 percent of the prison population, found that **the average sentence for convicted rapists was 11.8 years** , while\*\* the actual time served was 5.4 years\*\*. This follows the typical pattern for violent crimes in the US, where those convicted typically serve no more than half of their sentence.[11] So, average sentence for rape is close to 4 times the sentence this guy got, and the average time served is 2.4 years more than this guy is sentenced to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-hs-basketball-star-recruit-collapses-in-despair-when-he-is-sentenced-to-3-years-in-prison/632350.md?page=9)