# Star Trek ENT spoilers: Terra Prime & These are the Voyages...
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [May 13, 2005, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766 "2005-05-13T18:01:46Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 4
### Author:  [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)
#### Post date: [May 14, 2005, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/61 "2005-05-14T21:47:40Z")
_sigh_ … why oh why did they have to wait until _Enterprise_’s **last season** to start caring about Trek continuity?
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### Author:  [@Turek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Turek)
#### Post date: [May 14, 2005, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/62 "2005-05-14T21:48:16Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#):
>
> **Turek** : What is FUPA? And is your username a Vulcan name?
av8rmike got it. FUPA = **F** at **U** pper **P** elvic **A** rea.
And no, I’m not a Vulcan. I’m a lowly hobbit from Rivervale.
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### Author:  [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/63 "2005-05-15T00:11:11Z")
> [@Aesiron](#):
>
> I’ve not seen it yet and, honestly, don’t really care to. I’ll watch it when I get my final tape from **viva** but more out of a feeling of obligation to her than any to the franchise. I’m not sure what the causes of my current apathy for the franchise is but as of this moment, I don’t care a bit.
>
> It’s been a fun two and a half years and if it weren’t for the ENT Dopers, I wouldn’t be a Doper myself and, by extension, would still be living at home in Tennessee and probably working at McDonald’s instead of having a job I love and my own apartment in Oregon.
>
> I’m not sure how much longer I’ll stick around, but I just wanted to voice my appreciation for all of you in case my disinterest in the SDMB continues to grow.
>
> Thank you.
yer welcome. 🙂
Tapes are coming; look out!!
\*Did you still need other stuff taped?
Let me know.
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### Author:  [@Tybalt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tybalt)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/64 "2005-05-15T01:08:13Z")
So are they going to start a new series up or what?
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/65 "2005-05-15T02:25:47Z")
Oh, another little fun fact…not only did Trip end up buying it, but according to the Ent writer who typed up Hoshi’s bio for the mirror universe ep a coupla weeks back—
Get this…
“Sadly, Hoshi and her husband will die in 2246 when the colony where they live, Tarsus IV, is stricken by a food shortage, and Governor Kodos orders the deaths of half of the colony’s population. Hoshi and her husband [Takashi Kimura] will be among the dead. Note: episode writer Mike Sussman, in confirming this information to the Trek BBS, cautioned that the fate of Hoshi is not necessarily officially canonical since some of the above information was not actually visible on screen.”([http://www.trektoday.com/news/020505\_01.shtml](http://www.trektoday.com/news/020505_01.shtml))
:eek: How’s THAT for a sucker punch? :mad:
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/66 "2005-05-15T02:34:48Z")
Everybody buys the farm sometime, and she’d have had quite a long life.
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### Author:  [@NE\_Texan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NE_Texan)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/67 "2005-05-15T03:27:13Z")
It seems to me that, instead of trip giving his life for that, they would normally have let the intruders have the upper hand, and come back to rescue Shran afterwards. I really expected Tripp to be cleverer than that.
Furthermore, they want us to believe that Tripp is ready to give his life for Archer at any time, yet somehow has survived six more years of the same type of things they’ve been doing? Forgive me if I don’t find that statistically plausible.
For that matter, every single (recognizable) character in the crew seems to have survived, unscathed. That, plus the fact that Trip/T’Pol have gone nowhere with their relationship, highlights another problem: _Nothing_ ever happens off screen. If time passes, but it wasn’t on-screen, no events can happen. (Similar to **Ranchoth** ’s objection.)
And Phlox? In one episode, he’s crying over a child he didn’t know, because this crew has become a new family to him. In the next, after more years with this family, he’s not the least discomfited by it’s breakup. I think that in addition to the inherent flaws in the last episode, what makes them worse is that these two episodes look bad back-to-back; they show up flaws in each other.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/68 "2005-05-15T03:39:27Z")
> [@NE Texan](#):
>
> I really expected Tripp to be cleverer than that.
I expected the writers to be more clever than that. ^ :dubious: ^
> [@NE Texan](#):
>
> If time passes, but it wasn’t on-screen, no events can happen.
Good point.
Ah well, it was a Holo Deck event. It wasn’t real.
Trip is still available for my “Kill Archer, Promote Trip” concept.
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/69 "2005-05-15T07:38:04Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#):
>
> Everybody buys the farm sometime, and she’d have had quite a long life.
A likable character dying after a long life is one thing; a likable character being _murdered in a euegenic purge_ is another, I’d think.
I’m not saying we should expect all our fiction to be whitewashed with a happy ending, but still—I mean, _Jesus_. That’s worse than friggin’ Old Yeller.
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### Author:  [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/70 "2005-05-15T14:39:29Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#):
>
> A likable character dying after a long life is one thing; a likable character being _murdered in a euegenic purge_ is another, I’d think.
>
> I’m not saying we should expect all our fiction to be whitewashed with a happy ending, but still—I mean, _Jesus_. That’s worse than friggin’ Old Yeller.
For the Mirror Universe, that **is** a happy ending.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/71 "2005-05-15T16:32:01Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#):
>
> A likable character dying after a long life is one thing; a likable character being _murdered in a euegenic purge_ is another, I’d think.
Good point, well taken.
How about if she kicked some ass on the way out at 125 or so?
🙂
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### Author:  [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/72 "2005-05-15T18:25:47Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#):
>
> Oh, another little fun fact…not only did Trip end up buying it, but according to the Ent writer who typed up Hoshi’s bio for the mirror universe ep a coupla weeks back—
>
> Get this…
>
> “Sadly, Hoshi and her husband will die in 2246 when the colony where they live, Tarsus IV, is stricken by a food shortage, and Governor Kodos orders the deaths of half of the colony’s population. Hoshi and her husband [Takashi Kimura] will be among the dead. Note: episode writer Mike Sussman, in confirming this information to the Trek BBS, cautioned that the fate of Hoshi is not necessarily officially canonical since some of the above information was not actually visible on screen.”([TrekToday - Sussman Offers Biographical Tidbits on Archer & Sato](http://www.trektoday.com/news/020505_01.shtml))
>
> :eek: How’s THAT for a sucker punch? :mad:
That wasn’t in the MU, though. Mirror Archer and Mirror Hoshi were looking at these bios for their counterparts in the other (our) universe…until she told him she didn’t want to know any more about them. So M.Archer read about how the counterpart dies, but not M.Hoshi.
**Tybalt** : There is supposed to be another movie in the works, but no real word on another series.
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### Author:  [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/73 "2005-05-15T20:05:02Z")
The movie is currently up in the air, too. Could go either way. Still, it would be a Bergama product if it does end up getting made.
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### Author:  [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)
#### Post date: [May 15, 2005, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/74 "2005-05-15T22:20:32Z")
> [@gotpasswords](#):
>
> I guess Shran’s wife is yellow?
>
> When Those Names came up at the end, all I thought was “That’s it??”
Actually she’s white. Jhamel was the Aenar woman who’s brother was piloting the Romulan drone ships.
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### Author:  [@drewbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewbert)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/75 "2005-05-16T02:28:12Z")
> [@vivalostwages](#):
>
> Didn’t any of you folks read the TATV spoilers on these eps.? 😉 I did, so I knew what was coming, but it still reeked. I’m really surprised that the Reeves-Stevenses and Manny wrote this together. They’ve done better than this.
They didn’t. This travesty was brought to you by none other than B&B themselves. The Reeves-Stevenses and Manny wrote Terra Prime.
I have nothing else to add, for SDMB has no pukey smiley.
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### Author:  [@Khan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khan)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/76 "2005-05-16T02:53:02Z")
I agree with the following:
1.) The Shran subplot was unnecessary.
2.) Trip’s death was anticlimactic and ill-conceived.
3.) The “end program” right before the speech was a cocktease.
4.) Six years later and the only thing that changed was their hairstyles? “Don’t insult my intelligence,” as my namesake said. The least they could’ve done is salted up Archer’s temples a bit.
5.) Riker and Troi took it away from the rest of the cast. I read in the TV Guide that Jolene Blalock said the finale was “apalling,” and I agree.
6.) The only thing that came even remotely close to redeeming this dreck was that ending thing with the other Enterprises, but it failed. It gave me goosebumps, sure, but I thought the bit with the Human, Vulcan, Andorian, and Tellarite ships all cruising off into the sunset together at the end of the “Babel” arc was far, far more powerful.
That said…
This was the **WORST** finale of any Star Trek series, and “The Turnabout Intruder” wasn’t even intended as such. TNG took it back to where the series began with Q, and then ended with a bit of character development when Picard joined the senior staff’s poker game. DS9 gave us an epilogue. VOY brought everyone home safe and sound and leaving us to wonder whether future Janeway’s scheme left the Borg’s collective ass kicked for all time. Tack on a clever little montage with all the TV Enterprises to a rather short-winded couple of episodes and that’s our finale?
Capping it off with an “end program,” giving the heroes nosebleed seats, killing off perhaps the most well-liked character on the show in a sidetrack mission; these are all none-too-subtle ways of telling the viewer just how much of a black sheep this was among the Paramount execs.
And I’m glad that they’re so hostile to Star Trek. Yes, this series needs to lie fallow for a while and needs fresh mind-meat to give it new life. And with these jackasses behind the desk, they’ll accomplish just that. Let them have their reality TV or OC clones or whatever fashionable bullshit they want to wring a bit of ratings out of. By the time they’re gone, another generation will have come and the ground will be ripe for some fresh Trek.
Let us eagerly await that day.
PS: taht CG Enterprise-D was badass. Most badass indeed.
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### Author:  [@Khan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khan)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/77 "2005-05-16T02:57:11Z")
> [@drewbert](#):
>
> They didn’t. This travesty was brought to you by none other than B&B themselves.
Well that certainly explains a lot. :rolleyes:
Rick, Rick, the Great Bird is spinning in his grave (such as it is; if that capsule of his ashes is still in orbit, it’s probably spinning anyway, but I didn’t mean that literally).
Christ this makes me angry. I demand a reissue of the 3-piece Enterprise B, C, and E set as appeasement. :mad:
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### Author:  [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/78 "2005-05-16T03:52:28Z")
> [@Khan](#):
>
> Well that certainly explains a lot. :rolleyes:
Doesn’t it, though…
Everything that’s brought the franchise to this since DS9 can be laid at their feet. Preferably laced with smallpox and cyanide.
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### Author:  [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/79 "2005-05-16T05:08:40Z")
> [@Khan](#):
>
> Yes, this series needs to lie fallow for a while and needs fresh mind-meat to give it new life. And with these jackasses behind the desk, they’ll accomplish just that. Let them have their reality TV or OC clones or whatever fashionable bullshit they want to wring a bit of ratings out of. By the time they’re gone, another generation will have come and the ground will be ripe for some fresh Trek.
And you know what that generation will do to Trek?
The same thing that our generation did to Battlestar Galactica.
They’ll throw continuity out the window and do a “re-imagining” of the whole damn thing that has nothing to do with the original except that there will be species named Vulcans and Klingons and there will be a space ship named Enterprise.
Is that what you really want?
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### Author:  [@Khan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khan)
#### Post date: [May 16, 2005, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-ent-spoilers-terra-prime-these-are-the-voyages/303766/80 "2005-05-16T06:12:04Z")
> [@tracer](#):
>
> And you know what that generation will do to Trek?
>
> The same thing that our generation did to Battlestar Galactica.
> They’ll throw continuity out the window and do a “re-imagining” of the whole damn thing that has nothing to do with the original except that there will be species named Vulcans and Klingons and there will be a space ship named Enterprise.
>
> Is that what you really want?
On the one hand it seems that you’re thinking too much in terms of the now, but on the other I believe you have a point. Continuity is important to most fans of Trek because it binds everything together as a comprehensive saga, rather than individual stories based on a similar theme. Whoever gets passed the torch ought to share in this belief, and this would require a true appreciation for the series.
That’s what it would take to revive it from here on. That’s what it SHOULD take, because it’s treating it like a cash cow that lead to much of what we find distasteful about Star Trek. The desire for profit will always be a part of network culture. And perhaps it’s futile to hope that network culture will change such that storyline integrity is on a more prominent footing, but perhaps it’s more realistic to strive for killing this “remake” fad that’s just an attempt to cover up the depleted creativity well of current television programs.
And a remake is what we need to avoid. Invoking Galactica is apt in that sense, since it wasn’t an attempt to continue the story from the original series, but an attempt to retell the story. We don’t need a remake. Remakes most certainly ARE a threat to continuity. What we need is something new. That doesn’t threaten continuity as much, but a certain level of retconning is acceptable, eg the Klingon forehead problem. They didn’t need to have a story arc about that; Worf’s comment in “Trials and Tribble-ations” was enough, not to mention cleverly tongue-in-cheek.
A new generation with a new perspective, yet an appreciation for continuity is precisely what we need. Continuity’s always at risk when you try to continue a story. Would you rather just have it end with this?
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