# STAR TREK episodes in which the Captain was absolutely right to go on the landing party. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 29, 2015, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521 "2015-07-29T21:39:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/21 "2015-07-30T06:49:00Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Kirk is styled after old school explorers of the 17th and 18th centuries. And much like them…there isn’t another ship of the same nationality around for a lonnnng whiles. There was no reason at all for Kirk to stay on the bridge. > > Besides he was usually best qualified for whatever mission they happened to be on. He also reminds me of several aggressive battalion commanders I’ve known - the kind who always rush out in the field to take charge of any event occurring in their sector. ---
**Author:** ![Ranger\_Jeff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranger_jeff/32/2065_2.png) [@Ranger\_Jeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranger_Jeff)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/22 "2015-07-30T06:59:28Z")
I can understand the Captain leaving the ship on a diplomatic mission where he has to leave it to negotiate. I can understand the Captain leaving the ship if the ship is docked at a Federation Starbase. I can’t understand the Captain leaving the ship and taking his First Officer (and sometimes Chief Engineer) with him leaving an Ensign or Lieutenant in Command. It’s one thing to leave a jr officer with the Bridge, but NOT in Command. There’s a difference. Obviously, that was one criticism of ST:TOS that Roddenberry listened to when he got a chance to do ST:TNG. And he had a bigger budget for casting his 2nd time at bat too. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_stainless_steel_rat/32/5727_2.png) [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/23 "2015-07-30T13:15:34Z")
> [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](#): > > Every single Diplomatic mission. Yep, this. Was especially highlighted in TNG where there was a bit more diplomacy and the Second Officer got sent on missions more than the Captain. There was a lot more contact in TNG with ‘civilized’ planets than in TOS, so the opportunities for the captain to 'Show the flag" was greater. But even there, with 1,000+ crew and families, the numbers of available specailists outside of 4-5 people seemed rather low. And IIRC, Captain Sisko stayed pretty much on DS9 unless negotiating some deal with the Bajorans or Cardassians or Klingons. But I can’t point to specific episodes to prove my point ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/24 "2015-07-30T14:39:58Z")
> [@Ranger\_Jeff](#): > > I can understand the Captain leaving the ship on a diplomatic mission where he has to leave it to negotiate. I can understand the Captain leaving the ship if the ship is docked at a Federation Starbase. I can’t understand the Captain leaving the ship and taking his First Officer (and sometimes Chief Engineer) with him leaving an Ensign or Lieutenant in Command. It’s one thing to leave a jr officer with the Bridge, but NOT in Command. There’s a difference. > > Obviously, that was one criticism of ST:TOS that Roddenberry listened to when he got a chance to do ST:TNG. And he had a bigger budget for casting his 2nd time at bat too. It’s ridiculous that the chief science officer and the 1st Oifficer (XO) are the same person. The XO has a fulltime job already. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/25 "2015-07-30T15:10:09Z")
> [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > And IIRC, Captain Sisko stayed pretty much on DS9 unless negotiating some deal with the Bajorans or Cardassians or Klingons. He Captained the Defiant during the war, did he not? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/26 "2015-07-30T15:25:29Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Cestus III a purely military installation? I don’t think so. I’m pretty sure it was a colony with women and children. That was one reason Kirk was so pissed off with what the Gorns had done. > [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > In the script, at least, it’s described as a “military-scientific installation”. > [@terentii](#): > > It’s referred to here as an “observation outpost” and “colony” with women and children. > > [The Star Trek Transcripts - Arena](http://www.chakoteya.net/StarTrek/19.htm) Given that there are children on the Enterprise in NextGen, it wouldn’t be surprising to find children on a military observation post in the same Universe. Still incredibly stupid, but then, The Federation is a utopia full of morons who constantly forget that the entire rest of the galaxy isn’t similarly governed. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/27 "2015-07-30T15:50:19Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > It’s ridiculous that the chief science officer and the 1st Oifficer (XO) are the same person. The XO has a fulltime job already. Well, it IS Spock after all. He’s more than human. He probably never sleeps. I bet he does annual crew reviews, too. With a crew of 420, that’s more than one a day. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/28 "2015-07-30T16:06:03Z")
> [@Dale\_Sams](#): > > Kirk is styled after old school explorers of the 17th and 18th centuries. Who once in a while would get their heads bashed in on a beach in the Philippines or Hawaii. Learning from the past, Jimmy lad… > [@](#): > > Besides he was usually best qualified for whatever mission they happened to be on. As David Gerrold wrote, some might have preferred a dramatic show where Kirk makes decisions as commander of the mission, but what we got was an action-adventure show where Kirk faces danger as THE hero and star. Kirk at age 34 is a full Captain, one of only 12 capital Starship commanders, and holder of a list of decorations and commendations for both battle AND peace missions as long as Rand’s hair when shaken loose – he’s literally the Federation’s best man for any job on the frontlines. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/29 "2015-07-30T18:31:04Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > With a crew of 420, that’s more than one a day. Uhhhhh … 30. 430. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/30 "2015-07-30T18:40:08Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > Given that there are children on the Enterprise in NextGen, it wouldn’t be surprising to find children on a military observation post in the same Universe. Still incredibly stupid, but then, The Federation is a utopia full of morons who constantly forget that the entire rest of the galaxy isn’t similarly governed. Again, by analogy with the Age of Exploration (and the settling of the American West), such outposts would be commonplace on the outskirts of the Federation in Kirk’s time. Lots of today’s major cities started as isolated forts that served a number of functions (military, scientific, commercial); and yes, they were homes to families with young children. Hard to see how things could have happened otherwise. It’s nowhere near as dumb as putting families with young children on board a starship that regularly seeks to contact new and potentially dangerous alien species. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/31 "2015-07-30T19:01:53Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I bet he does annual crew reviews, too. With a crew of 420, that’s more than one a day. That’s what the show was missing, more paperwork. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/32 "2015-07-30T19:22:45Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Uhhhhh … 30. 430. 🙂 I’m sure it varied, with crew coming and going. Transfers. Number of Red Shirts in the landing party that week. yeah, that’s the ticket! ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/33 "2015-07-30T20:19:24Z")
> [@terentii](#): > > Uhhhhh … 30. 430. 🙂 428, if you’re gonna get all shirty. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/34 "2015-07-30T20:53:41Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > 428, if you’re gonna get all shirty. “Deres ova four hundred guys up there.” ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/35 "2015-07-30T22:53:39Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > “Deres ova four hundred guys up there.” Let me say something. I only saw three guys in that ship. Maybe there ain’t no more. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/36 "2015-07-30T23:25:38Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > He also reminds me of several aggressive battalion commanders I’ve known - the kind who always rush out in the field to take charge of any event occurring in their sector. A well-publicized military victory is a big help if you are thinking of going into politics. Worked for Julius Caesar, Napoleon, and US President William Henry Harrison. (If you don’t recall the man, you may have heard his slogan, “Tippecanoe and Tyler, Too.”) Your commanders were just setting themselves up to be the next Moshe Dayan. Or Custer. > [@Loach](#): > > That’s what the show was missing, more paperwork. The lack of paperwork on TV takes away from the realism. Paperwork is why _Barney Miller_ was so great. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2015, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/37 "2015-07-30T23:37:40Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Let me say something. I only saw three guys in that ship. Maybe there ain’t no more. crap. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2015, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/38 "2015-07-31T04:06:47Z")
I don’t think that Spock does all the crew evaluations. I think that each department head does their own. (McCoy, medical. Scotty, engineering. Etc.) ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2015, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/39 "2015-07-31T12:49:21Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > That’s what the show was missing, more paperwork. That was all on the touchscreen thing Yeoman Rand was always handing to Kirk for him to tap. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2015, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521/40 "2015-07-31T14:00:37Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > A well-publicized military victory is a big help if you are thinking of going into politics. Worked for Julius Caesar, Napoleon, and US President William Henry Harrison. (If you don’t recall the man, you may have heard his slogan, “Tippecanoe and Tyler, Too.”) Your commanders were just setting themselves up to be the next Moshe Dayan. Or Custer. > The lack of paperwork on TV takes away from the realism. Paperwork is why _Barney Miller_ was so great. Realism is over to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-episodes-in-which-the-captain-was-absolutely-right-to-go-on-the-landing-party/726521.md?page=3)