# Star Trek Into Darkness Enterprise/ocean question **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 8, 2014, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701 "2014-12-08T21:36:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/21 "2014-12-09T05:59:21Z")
I’d think that at certain depths it would be very dangerous for the Enterprise seeing that on deep sea vessels today the water pressure is so intense even the tiniest of cracks the water shoots in with the power of a mini jet and can cut thru metal so if some bulkhead wasnt on tight or some tiny seem was open somewhere water could come in and cause some big problems. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/22 "2014-12-09T09:33:59Z")
Plus, the ship is presumably designed to withstand at least an atmosphere or pressure, since its pressurized in space so Kirk and friends can breathe. Hardly unbelievable that it was over-engineered to withstand several times that as a precaution. The main problem with submerging the ship is that while the interior of the ship would have to be sealed, one wouldn’t think they would’ve bothered to make the various devices and sensors on the outside of the ship water-tight. But that’s easy to fan-wank away, and of the dozens of basic logical issues that come up in the plot of that movie, submerging the ship is hardly in the top 100. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/23 "2014-12-09T12:16:56Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Plus, the ship is presumably designed to withstand at least an atmosphere or pressure, since its pressurized in space so Kirk and friends can breathe. Hardly unbelievable that it was over-engineered to withstand several times that as a precaution. > > The main problem with submerging the ship is that while the interior of the ship would have to be sealed, one wouldn’t think they would’ve bothered to make the various devices and sensors on the outside of the ship water-tight. But that’s easy to fan-wank away, and of the dozens of basic logical issues that come up in the plot of that movie, submerging the ship is hardly in the top 100. But a few minor hairline air leaks in space wouldnt be much of an issue because I’m sure they have double hulls and such wheras at ocean depths water can cut its way right thru making even a small leak much bigger in areas maybe difficult to reach and repair and allowing water in which could quickly change the ships mass. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/24 "2014-12-09T12:42:27Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > The whole movie is jam packed with fridge logic like that. It’s more like “beer bottle logic”, e.g. in the time it takes you to pop the cap off of a beer you realize that the preceding scene makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, and also was almost completely incoherent thanks to the gyrating camera work and blinding lens flares. This continues up until about the point of Beer #6, by which time you no longer care about anything except the gratuitous near nudity inserted in the film to distract from the utter abandonment of any attempt at a plot. Also, Alice Eve has a really rocking ahhh…what point was I making again? Anyway, I really like this movie better when it was staring Tim Allen and Sigourney Weaver: Gwen DeMarco: _What is this thing? I mean, it serves no useful purpose for there to be a bunch of chompy, crushy things in the middle of a hallway. No, I mean we shouldn’t have to do this, it makes no logical sense, why is it here?_ Jason Nesmith: _'Cause it’s on the television show._ Gwen DeMarco: _Well forget it! I’m not doing it! This episode was badly written!_ Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/25 "2014-12-09T12:49:57Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > But a few minor hairline air leaks in space wouldnt be much of an issue because I’m sure they have double hulls and such wheras at ocean depths water can cut its way right thru making even a small leak much bigger in areas maybe difficult to reach and repair and allowing water in which could quickly change the ships mass. I don’t think the ship was actually that deep (Kirk and McCoy are able to swim down to it pretty easily). Assuming the bottom of the ship is at 100 feet, and sea-level pressure is the same as Earth, water coming through a hole would be at like 45 PSI. By comparison a commercial pressure washer generates a stream in the low thousands of PSI. So you wouldn’t want to stick your face in the stream, but it wouldn’t be strong-enough to rip through the hull to create a larger hole, or keep someone on the otherside from patching it. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/26 "2014-12-09T13:49:38Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > In the new Star Treks, are the shields a sphere around the ship or are they tightly hugging the ship’s contours? If the latter, maybe the shields were up and that was enough. > > I think it’s still a sphere, and that’s not the answer. Probably it’s just the future super-materials it’s made from can withstand the pressure. In either case, how did Kirk & McCoy get through the shields? If it’s a sphere, that’d suck. “Okay, we’re through the aaaaaaahhhhhhhh!!!” splat. This might explain why my blueprints for the Enterprise included a water line. I always wondered about that. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/27 "2014-12-09T15:57:23Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > It’s more like “beer bottle logic”, e.g. in the time it takes you to pop the cap off of a beer you realize that the preceding scene makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, and also was almost completely incoherent thanks to the gyrating camera work and blinding lens flares. This continues up until about the point of Beer #6, by which time you no longer care about anything except the gratuitous near nudity inserted in the film to distract from the utter abandonment of any attempt at a plot. Also, Alice Eve has a really rocking ahhh…what point was I making again? Anyway, I really like this movie better when it was staring Tim Allen and Sigourney Weaver: > > Gwen DeMarco: _What is this thing? I mean, it serves no useful purpose for there to be a bunch of chompy, crushy things in the middle of a hallway. No, I mean we shouldn’t have to do this, it makes no logical sense, why is it here?_ > Jason Nesmith: _'Cause it’s on the television show._ > Gwen DeMarco: _Well forget it! I’m not doing it! This episode was badly written!_ > > Stranger I think I’ll watch Galaxy Quest tonight! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/28 "2014-12-09T16:41:44Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > It’s not an Apollo capsule made out of tinfoil. It is made out of “tri-titanium”, a fictional transuranic element with a name that implies it has all the benefits of titanium, but better. Oh, that’s easy. Six inches…We carry stuff that big in stock. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/29 "2014-12-09T18:35:56Z")
What bothered me was the fact they were ‘hiding’ from the natives, a non-technological society. Why would you need to be in the ocean to not be seen? HOW did you get it there without being seen? The reason it is there is so Spock can say, “don’t come get me, you’ll be seen” So then Kirk can be “I don’t care, I lurvs you Spock!” How is being in orbit too visible? Maybe hide behind the moon? OK, not sure if the planet had a moon but still landing the ship in the water you might be seen by someone. Is the planet is only inhabited on one side did they splashed down on the uninhabited side of the planet with no people and then went submerged to the other side? How, what sort of underwater propulsion system does the ship have? In the first film they built the Enterprise on earth not in ‘space dock’. So the ship has to function in atmosphere. (really not very aerodynamic though) ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/30 "2014-12-09T19:19:19Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > It’s not an Apollo capsule made out of tinfoil. And Apollo capsules did survive being dropped into the ocean. Anyway… We’re talking about spaceships that can travel faster than light, and travel hundreds of light-years on a tank of fuel (and the “tank” is so small you can’t even tell where it is from the outside), even travel through time certain situations, and has an invisible shield that stops matter as well as energy weapons. And we’re complaining that it can survive being submerged in liquid water?? ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/31 "2014-12-09T19:24:12Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > And Apollo capsules did survive being dropped into the ocean. > > Anyway… We’re talking about spaceships that can travel faster than light, and travel hundreds of light-years on a tank of fuel (and the “tank” is so small you can’t even tell where it is from the outside), even travel through time certain situations, and has an invisible shield that stops matter as well as energy weapons. And we’re complaining that it can survive being submerged in liquid water?? Pretty much I bet getting water trapped between the panes of all those space windows woulda been a nightmare. What good are space windows if they get all fogged and you can’t see some super cool space nebula? ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/32 "2014-12-09T19:37:50Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > And Apollo capsules did survive being dropped into the ocean. > > Anyway… We’re talking about spaceships that can travel faster than light, and travel hundreds of light-years on a tank of fuel (and the “tank” is so small you can’t even tell where it is from the outside), even travel through time certain situations, and has an invisible shield that stops matter as well as energy weapons. And we’re complaining that it can survive being submerged in liquid water?? Scotty did complain that the salt water was doing something to the something, if I remember correctly. Which also means, no shield, for the benefit of previous discussion. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/33 "2014-12-09T19:42:11Z")
I guess if the Japanese can take a battleship and turn it into a space cruiser, then taking a space cruiser and turning it into a bath toy makes roughly the same amount of sense. It isn’t like the first set of Star Trek movies had any better conception of spaceship physics. The crash scene in Star Trek: Generations had the Enterprise making a fiery re-entry into a planet’s atmosphere after which people did the usual stretch and groan and claw their way out of the largely intact wreckage, which in real life would have required them to reconstitute their bodies from ionized plasma Wolverine style. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/34 "2014-12-09T19:47:36Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > And Apollo capsules did survive being dropped into the ocean. They survived being dropped\* onto\* the ocean, not _into_ the ocean. They didn’t become submerged, nor did they stay down, fully occupied, for extended time. The only spacecraft that was recovered from time spent underwater didn’t hold off 15000 feet of seawater pressure, as its door was open, and it didn’t look too good when it came up. [Liberty Bell 7](http://images.ksc.nasa.gov/photos/1999/medium/KSC-99PP-1030.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/35 "2014-12-09T19:51:15Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > They survived being dropped\* onto\* the ocean, not _into_ the ocean. They didn’t become submerged, nor did they stay down, fully occupied, for extended time. > > The only spacecraft that was recovered from time spent underwater didn’t hold off 15000 feet of seawater pressure, as its door was open, and it didn’t look too good when it came up. > > [Liberty Bell 7](http://images.ksc.nasa.gov/photos/1999/medium/KSC-99PP-1030.jpg) That does not look good for being underwater 38 years. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/36 "2014-12-09T19:52:25Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > We saw the Enterprise being constructed in Kansas in the first film. So it can definitely land. I’m not too clear on how it could _stay upright_ once it does so, though. They put down the kickstand. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/37 "2014-12-09T19:56:17Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Gwen DeMarco: _What is this thing? I mean, it serves no useful purpose for there to be a bunch of chompy, crushy things in the middle of a hallway. No, I mean we shouldn’t have to do this, it makes no logical sense, why is it here?_ > Jason Nesmith: _'Cause it’s on the television show._ > Gwen DeMarco: _Well forget it! I’m not doing it! This episode was badly written!_ \ I have long had a question about that scene. The preceding bit of dialog from Ms. Demarco, as she stops short at the sight of the chompers, is “Screw this!” But very obviously, that was not what Sigourney Weaver said: did they deliberately redub the dialog as a subtle joke, or were they forced to change it for the rating? \ ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/38 "2014-12-09T20:11:04Z")
IMDB says it was dubbed to keep the PG rating. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/39 "2014-12-09T20:12:04Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > It isn’t like the first set of Star Trek movies had any better conception of spaceship physics. The crash scene in Star Trek: Generations had the Enterprise making a fiery re-entry into a planet’s atmosphere after which people did the usual stretch and groan and claw their way out of the largely intact wreckage, which in real life would have required them to reconstitute their bodies from ionized plasma Wolverine style. And all the Transparent Aluminum broke like glass while it was crashing. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701/40 "2014-12-09T20:30:13Z")
Well, it’s Transparent _Safety_ Aluminum. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-enterprise-ocean-question/706701.md?page=3)