# Star Trek Into Darkness Seen it thread. Spoilers to follow **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 16, 2013, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528 "2013-05-16T17:16:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/21 "2013-05-17T02:57:01Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > BTW anyone think in a future Trek film there will be a twist on the Kaatra theme based on the fact that Kirk now has Kahn’s super-DNA in him? What about the little girl from the beginning of the film? Or the tribble? The tribble that can’t die tries to conquer the the world! ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/22 "2013-05-17T03:04:50Z")
Ach, they’ll be no tribble at all! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/23 "2013-05-17T11:26:45Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > 1. When was Khan born? I thought it said the present year is 2259 towards the beginning of the movie, but later they said Khan is at least 300 years old. But surely he wasn’t born in 1959? Did I misread the date? He was shot into space in the 1990s, right? Montalban was in his forties circa SPACE SEED, Cumberbatch looks maybe forty in INTO DARKNESS… ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/24 "2013-05-17T11:28:35Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > He was shot into space in the 1990s, right? Montalban was in his forties circa SPACE SEED, Cumberbatch looks maybe forty in INTO DARKNESS… Is this supposed to be some top secret genetics project going on under our noses? Or does the reboot assume the same past as the original rather than assuming our actual past? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/25 "2013-05-17T11:39:59Z")
Saw it with my wife last night- we both really enjoyed it- better than the 2009 Trek (which we also enjoyed). It’s way, way different from the Trek I grew up with (TNG, DS9)- but it’s still good. I have some quibbles about the logistics inside the “new” Trek universe (things like how fast they move from place to place, how the technology level seems to beyond even TNG and DS9, and how casual the rank structure and chain of command of Starfleet seems to be). But these are pretty minor problems, and I thought the movie was a lot of fun. Even though Cumberbatch was a very different Khan than Montalban, I still thought he was good. I couldn’t help but chuckle when Spock yelled “KHAAAAAAN!!!” ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/26 "2013-05-17T13:10:45Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I have some quibbles about the logistics inside the “new” Trek universe (things like how fast they move from place to place… Yes, that bothered me in the first one, too… Vulcan was seven warp-minutes from Earth? I can understand a wish to speed things up a bit but the notion that the galaxy has been reduced to a high-density suburb bothers me above all other changes. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/27 "2013-05-17T13:15:54Z")
Yeah, so far not a big fan of the ST:Reboot Universe. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/28 "2013-05-17T13:43:28Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Is this supposed to be some top secret genetics project going on under our noses? Or does the reboot assume the same past as the original rather than assuming our actual past? I’d figure the reboot assumes the same past as the original. And, yes, I’d figure it’s supposed to have played out without most folks noticing – or, to quote Kirk after one of Gary Seven’s nutty adventures in the 1960s, _“Our record tapes show, although not generally revealed, that on this date, a malfunctioning suborbital warhead was exploded exactly one hundred and four miles above the Earth.”_ ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/29 "2013-05-17T14:13:33Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I couldn’t help but chuckle when Spock yelled “KHAAAAAAN!!!” Spock Prime: “Listen, this is very important. When you get the opportunity, be sure to yell Khan’s name as loudly and forcefully as you can. This is essential to prevent the outburst from being added to Jim Kirk’s list of greatly overacted moments. Do not fail.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/30 "2013-05-17T14:16:11Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > Spock Prime: “Listen, this is very important. When you get the opportunity, be sure to yell Khan’s name as loudly and forcefully as you can. This is essential to prevent the outburst from being added to Jim Kirk’s list of greatly overacted moments. Do not fail.” “Of all the overacting I’ve encountered in my travels, his was the most . . . huuruman.” ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/31 "2013-05-17T17:59:02Z")
I enjoyed the first one, silliness aside, as a change of pace and for general fun and some well-done scenes and dynamics. And the use of Nimoy I found acceptable as a way to transition the franchise to this new paradigm. But I really disliked how they continued to cannibalize the old Trek for this new movie. It stunk of an absence of original ideas, simply recycling old moments and relying on our good will and the power of association to bridge the gap when it comes to any emotional connection (Kirk’s death is moving more because it reminds us of ST2:TWoK than because of its own impact). This running parallel just strikes me as lazy, especially if you have to resort to old Spock again. He’s no longer a transition agent but a fixture. Also, I’m tired of the new incarnations being supermen in miniature. The first film pushed the edge of this a little, but Kirk’s space-zoom into a shot glass? Spock jumping from one hovervehicle to another effortlessly? Give me a break. I would suspend my disbelief on Khan being able to do this, but the others? Uh uh. Khan’s first movie was about a battle of wits and will, not feats of acrobatic nonsense. And as long as we’re comparing the two (which Abrams specifically invites us to do), while the original film had what still remains James Horner’s best score (a brilliant piece of work), I got so goddamn sick of Michael Giacchino’s new ST theme–which is used relentlessly and without mercy–that I hope to never ever hear it again. The threat of its existence alone might be enough to dissuade me from seeing the third film. I thought the use of Abrams was a clever idea and his inclusion in the SW universe a promising one. But this is a huge step backwards. I thought the film did Scotty & McCoy justice (I hope the latter hooks up with Carol Marcus in this universe) but Uhura so unprofessional? Chekov in engineering?!? Ugh. I also have to say that I don’t remember San Francisco being cinematically trashed ever as badly as in this film. Usually when a meteor hits, or a tsunami, or aliens, we see NY, DC, LA get the beating. A spaceship crash pales compares to those, but I still think it’s the worst disaster we’ve ever explicitly seen depicted here in a film. ---
**Author:** ![Quimby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/22d042/32.png) [@Quimby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quimby)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/32 "2013-05-17T20:30:36Z")
Upfront I will say I did like it (and I also liked the 2009 movie which I rewatched last weekend to get geared up for this one), that said: 1. I think these movies have a little too much Star Wars in my Star Trek. ST has exploration and the idea that the Federation is a place that has its shit together which seems to be lacking somewhat in the reboot which are much more focused on action. On the other side of the coin, this movie featured Sci Fi metaphors for current controversies and a crazy Star Ship commander which are the Trekiest of Trek tropes which I appreciated. 2. When McCoy asked for them to get one of the Torpedoes, I thought he was going to draw blood from a different “Superman”. It wasn’t really clear why it had to be Kahn’s other than the fact that Kahn’s was the one he tested. He could have at least tried someone else’s. 3. The actor who played Kahn was good but physically he just didn’t look like a Superman which I found distracting. Also Kahan was established as Indian. They couldn’t find an Indian or lighter black skinned actor to play the part? I suppose that would have given away the villain but who cares really? 4. The Federation of this timeline seems to be getting kicked in the teeth an awful lot isn’t it? In the span of a short time the world of a founding, influential member is destroyed and their headquarters are now wrecked. I liked the end though and like the 2009 movie I had the feeling where I wished I could keep watching and see more adventures which I guess means the movie did a lot right. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/33 "2013-05-17T20:32:55Z")
Wait, did they explain in the movie how the ripples of the first movie’s time travel could have affected the race of a man who was born _before_ the Federation era? ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/34 "2013-05-17T20:39:08Z")
> [@Quimby](#): > > Also Kahan was established as Indian. They couldn’t find an Indian or lighter black skinned actor to play the part? They totally nailed that piece of casting with Ricardo Montalban. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/35 "2013-05-18T00:43:01Z")
> [@](#): > > Is this supposed to be some top secret genetics project going on under our noses? Yes, it was [ret-conned in the books](http://www.amazon.com/Eugenics-Wars-Vol-Star-ebook/dp/B000FC0O22/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1368837588&sr=8-5&keywords=eugenics+wars+star+trek), and much like Zero Dark Thirty, used real-life events to anchor the shadow war going on in the 80s/90s. Loved the movie. Thought it was incredibly ballsy to re-do Star Trek’s sacred cow, and they did it well. I cried when Kirk died, even though I knew this movie wouldn’t make the same mistake as ST:III. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/36 "2013-05-18T00:44:45Z")
It’s not like JJ Abrahms hasn’t worked with Naveen Andrews. ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/37 "2013-05-18T00:46:37Z")
Or maybe I should have said Homeland. Anyway! It was stylistically like that. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/38 "2013-05-18T00:52:07Z")
> [@Rysler](#): > > even though I knew this movie wouldn’t make the same mistake as ST:III. Does everyone here know what mistake is being referred to? ---
**Author:** ![LibrarySpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f9ae1b/32.png) [@LibrarySpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LibrarySpy)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/39 "2013-05-18T00:53:36Z")
> [@Frylock](#): > > Does everyone here know what mistake is being referred to? Existing. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528/40 "2013-05-18T02:04:36Z")
re mccoy needing khan’s blood for kirk, there is an answer not in the movie. sigh, yes, i read the book… there is a scene in sickbay where they are putting kirk in the cryotube, after getting one of khan’s men out of it. carol marcus asks him why not just use the blood from the crew mwmber. mccoy states that it is too risky, he doesn’t know how alike khan and his crew are, and there isn’t time to find out. “if there’s even the slightest unresolved difference between their respective physiologies, then we might be doing nothing but wasting our time and what little, if any jim has left. and i have to have khan alive, because i don’t know what death might do to his body… or the viability of its respective components. it’s khan, or nothing.” apparently kirk’s body was not happy about the khan transfusion. there was a bit of a rejection battle. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-into-darkness-seen-it-thread-spoilers-to-follow/658528.md?page=3)