# Star Trek: TOS Question (open spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 28, 2012, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220 "2012-02-28T03:32:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/41 "2012-03-01T19:02:35Z")
Don’t forget [Take Me Out to the Holosuite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Take_Me_Out_to_the_Holosuite), in which the captain of an all-Vulcan crew challenges Sisko at his favorite game. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/42 "2012-03-01T19:21:47Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Also, it emphatically turns the whole thing from _“predictable prequel”_ into _“anything can happen,”_ right? If it’s _ **not** _ an alternate timeline, we’d already know that Sulu and Uhura and McCoy and the rest will spend the rest of the movie not dying, sure as we’d already know the Earth won’t get done blowed up real good by the Romulans; anyone and anything that’s still around in the series and the movies will still be just fine. > > Instead, it’s a movie where, say, Chekhov might get beheaded between now and the end credits; until you actually watch it through for the first time, you don’t know. Thing is, because of the nature of the change, i.e. it’s due to time-travelers, there’s a built-in escape clause where another time-traveler can undo everything and put it “right”. Not that I’m expecting this to happen, but I just didn’t see the point in trying to tie the two timelines together in this clumsy fashion. If you’re gonna reboot… then _reboot_, damnit. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/43 "2012-03-01T19:34:11Z")
I saw this movie for the third time the other night and I’m starting to like it. Shoot me now, please. Was there ever any explanation why New Spock bodily threw Kirk off the ship where he landed not 200 yards from Spock Prime? That’s some crazy coincidence! ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/44 "2012-03-01T19:54:13Z")
No… it’s _destiny!_ ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/45 "2012-03-01T20:18:24Z")
> [@kaylasdad99](#): > > P.S. I hate reboots. Requesting a move to the Pit, so I may adequately vent my spleen at the people who green-lighted this one and the people who are okay with it. You’re welcome to start your own thread, but there’s no need to move this one. > [@TBG](#): > > It absolutely is a reboot, but it also absolutely IS still related to the original show. Spock Prime, played by Leonard Nimoy is the very same Spock as the one he played in TOS. The point of the comment about not being related was simply to explain that things in the 2010 movie timeline are not constrained by things in the TOS timeline, and vice versa. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/46 "2012-03-01T20:43:01Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I saw this movie for the third time the other night and I’m starting to like it. Shoot me now, please. > > Was there ever any explanation why New Spock bodily threw Kirk off the ship where he landed not 200 yards from Spock Prime? That’s some crazy coincidence! There’s a scene in the ice cave where Spock Prime mentions something about “destiny” and New Kirk gives him a “you’re outta your cotton pickin mind” look. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/47 "2012-03-01T20:47:33Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > There’s a scene in the ice cave where Spock Prime mentions something about “destiny” and New Kirk gives him a “you’re outta your cotton pickin mind” look. 🙂 For what it’s worth, I was giving my TV the same look. ---
**Author:** ![Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8dc957/32.png) [@Christopher\_Robin\_Davies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Christopher_Robin_Davies)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/48 "2012-03-01T20:51:47Z")
> [@Irishman](#): > > You’re welcome to start your own thread, but there’s no need to move this one. > > The point of the comment about not being related was simply to explain that things in the 2010 movie timeline are not constrained by things in the TOS timeline, and vice versa. I think kayla’sdad started this in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/49 "2012-03-01T20:55:16Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > There’s a scene in the ice cave where Spock Prime mentions something about “destiny” and New Kirk gives him a “you’re outta your cotton pickin mind” look. 🙂 Right - but look at it from Spock prime’s viewpoint - he didn’t mean it as ‘destiny’ as in ‘predetermined’ - but as in ‘destiny, the way things worked before says you really ought to do this, and from my perspecitve, things will be fantastic if you do’ Spock Prime, having been friends with Kirk Prime and knowing all the things they can accomplish together - really wants that part of the new timeline to have a chance. It is a unique perspective. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/50 "2012-03-01T20:55:22Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > I saw this movie for the third time the other night and I’m starting to like it. Shoot me now, please. Because it’s an objective requirement that this movie must be hated? Sheesh. It’s a fun movie and I think the magnitude of flak it gets is undeserved. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/51 "2012-03-01T21:02:06Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Because it’s an objective requirement that this movie must be hated? Sheesh. It’s a fun movie and I think the magnitude of flak it gets is undeserved. I’m starting to get that. I wondered if someone were to ask me what it’s about, if I could come up with a good answer. The plot very complex. It’s not as easy to explain as “Superman terrorist gets his hands on a terrible weapon but first wants to exact personal revenge.” It’s more like trying to explian the plot of _Office Space_. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/52 "2012-03-01T21:23:32Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Right - but look at it from Spock prime’s viewpoint - he didn’t mean it as ‘destiny’ as in ‘predetermined’ - but as in ‘destiny, the way things worked before says you really ought to do this, and from my perspecitve, things will be fantastic if you do’ > > Spock Prime, having been friends with Kirk Prime and knowing all the things they can accomplish together - really wants that part of the new timeline to have a chance. > > It is a unique perspective. Maybe, but Spock is super duper smart. He _should_ pick his words with more care than Kirk does. He says it to Kirk Prime, as well, in The Wrath of Khan: > [@](#): > > **Spock:** If I may be so bold, it was a mistake for you to accept promotion. Commanding a starship is your first, best destiny; anything else is a waste of material. > **Kirk:** I would not presume to debate you. > **Spock:** That is wise. Were I to invoke logic, however, logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. > **Kirk:** Or the one. It appears Spock uses the word “destiny” to mean “role best suited for”. I wonder why… In several instances, we see Vulcans holding on to ceremonies and traditions that smack of spirituality, not logic. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/53 "2012-03-01T21:28:12Z")
They shoulda just called it _Ultimate Star Trek_ and cast Samuel L. Jackson as Kirk. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/54 "2012-03-01T21:33:30Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > They shoulda just called it _Ultimate Star Trek_ and cast Samuel L. Jackson as Kirk. Snakes on a Starship? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/55 "2012-03-01T21:34:55Z")
Heh. "I have had _enough_ of this motherfuckin’ Romulan tryin’ to blow _up_ my motherfuckin’ _ship!"_ I liked the reboot, all in all, although I hated (a) the _Enterprise_ being assembled on the Earth’s surface, and (b) Kirk rising from midshipman to captain in the span of about a week. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/56 "2012-03-01T21:47:45Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > Snakes on a Starship? Well, tribbles… ---
**Author:** ![HubZilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ccd318/32.png) [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/57 "2012-03-01T21:56:13Z")
Some things I didn’t get in the reboot, and perhaps this is a good place to ask: 1. How did the Narada get right above Earth? No ships or defenses to stop him (orbital stations, ships, even SAMs)? I mean, Nero’s right above Starfleet itself in San Francisco, and Earth just watched until the Enterprise arrived? 2. How did Nero destroy all those Federation starships over Vulcan so quickly? It shot dozens of missiles at the Kelvin, which still wasn’t enough to prevent it from ramming. Yet it could destroy those dozen starships in the few seconds (parking-brake delay) before the Enterprise arrived? 3. How did Kirk get promoted to command his own ship? Was it a reward for being in temporary command of the Enterprise while Earth was saved? All he did was rescue Pike. Spock flew the Jellyfish, destroyed the drill, and caused the red matter to destroy the Narada. Chekov was in command with the fancy flying and shooting on the Enterprise. Seems like a huge reward for doing such a small part. ---
**Author:** ![FordTaurusSHO94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f07891/32.png) [@FordTaurusSHO94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordTaurusSHO94)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/58 "2012-03-01T22:01:55Z")
Not to mention that a drop of red matter destroyed the entire solar system that Roumlus was in, but a beach ball sized amount was just enleashed possibly near Saturn, but there’s no concern. Also, they left the remains of Vulcan at warp whatever speed for several minutes, but when Kirk was ejected to the ice planet, it was close enough to see details of the surface of Vulcan. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/59 "2012-03-01T22:03:30Z")
> [@mlees](#): > > Maybe, but Spock is super duper smart. He _should_ pick his words with more care than Kirk does. > > He says it to Kirk Prime, as well, in The Wrath of Khan: > > It appears Spock uses the word “destiny” to mean “role best suited for”. I wonder why… > > In several instances, we see Vulcans holding on to ceremonies and traditions that smack of spirituality, not logic. yeah - like “protecting their culture” == a dozen folks standing in a circle holding hands in a cave. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2012, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220/60 "2012-03-01T22:05:42Z")
> [@FordTaurusSHO94](#): > > Not to mention that a drop of red matter destroyed the entire solar system that Roumlus was in, but a beach ball sized amount was just enleashed possibly near Saturn, but there’s no concern. > > Also, they left the remains of Vulcan at warp whatever speed for several minutes, but when Kirk was ejected to the ice planet, it was close enough to see details of the surface of Vulcan. Romulas’ sun went supernova - that is what destroyed Romulas and the system- Spock was trying to ‘pull back’ the effects of the supernova with the red-matter but was too late. They were pretty clearly a good distance away from our system when they destroyed the Narata with teh beach ball - but you are correct that they do not do a good job of stating just how far out that was. (couldn’t have been too far - since Enterprise no longer had a warp core to get back home quickly) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-trek-tos-question-open-spoilers/614220.md?page=4)