# Star Wars biggest plotholes
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [June 15, 2005, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444 "2005-06-15T21:20:52Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/1 "2005-06-15T21:20:52Z")
Inspired by multiple threads, I was trying to rank the biggest plot holes (IMHO): Rather that name all the movies, I just used the first letters in the titles.
[ol]
[li]ROTJ: Luke and Leia being sisters, with NO foreshadowing in the earlier movies (quite the opposite actually: the knight gets the princess). Solved a love triangle issue, though.[/li][li]ROTJ: Having the Death Star shields down before the Emporer fell. Moments after Vader/Palps beat Luke, they would’ve died in the explosion.[/li][li]ROTS/ROTJ: Leia remembering her _real_ mother, despite being an Padme dying in childbirth.[/li][li]ROTJ: Ewoks with primitive weapons beating an armored legion with mobile armor support. And where did Ewoks have time to prepare those traps?[/li][li]ROTS/TPM: Obi-Wan beats Anakin because he has the “higher ground”. Yet he earlier beats Darth Maul from the lower ground.[/li][li]TPM/Star Wars: Mystical Force that binds the galaxy is midichlorians.[/li][li]ROTJ: Mission to Endor requiring stealth, yet brought along a noisy golden C3PO for no discernable military or technical reason.[/li][li]TPM/AOTC: No one bothered to free the slaves in Tatooine in 10 years, despite a senator, Jedi masters, and especially Anakin knowing about this outlawed practice.[/li][li]TPM: The pod race; gambled too much to find spare parts. In this dire emergency (planet conquered, etc), couldn’t they have found another way to Coruscant? Like say, going to a cantina and hiring a ride?[/li][li]TPM: The prophesy about “bringing balance to the force”. The good jedi far outnumber the bad jedi… there’s only one way to balance this.[/li][/ol]
What’s your list? Or possible answers to the issues above?
I did not include
[ul]
[li]Obi-Wan telling Luke Vader murdered his father, since Obi Wan & Yoda did try to retcon that. [/li][li]R2D2 and C3PO knowing people and places in the prequels. They erased C3PO’s memory banks.[/li][li]Star Wars: “Only Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise”. If they hit the heroes, we’d have a short movie.[/li][/ul]
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### Author:  [@Lobsang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobsang)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/2 "2005-06-15T21:29:24Z")
“ROTJ: Luke and Leia being sisters”
:eek:
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### Author:  [@Won-Tolla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Won-Tolla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/3 "2005-06-15T21:36:37Z")
Luke and Leia were sisters??
You mean siblings, don’t you? :smack:
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### Author:  [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/4 "2005-06-15T21:39:41Z")
Half of those aren’t actually plot holes.
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### Author:  [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/5 "2005-06-15T21:43:34Z")
> [@HubZilla](#):
>
> Inspired by multiple threads, I was trying to rank the biggest plot holes (IMHO): Rather that name all the movies, I just used the first letters in the titles.
> [li]ROTJ: Luke and Leia being sisters, with NO foreshadowing in the earlier movies (quite the opposite actually: the knight gets the princess). Solved a love triangle issue, though.[/li]
I don’t see how this is a plot hole, per se. Just a totally un-foreshadowed plot twist. There’s nothing previous that tells us that they can NOT be siblings.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]ROTJ: Having the Death Star shields down before the Emporer fell. Moments after Vader/Palps beat Luke, they would’ve died in the explosion.[/li]
Only a plot hole if you assume that the intercutting between the three scenes (endor, space battle, throne room) must happen in real time. The death star was being blown up, and Luke got out at the last possible moment. Not plot hole, just movie-plot-luck.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]ROTS/ROTJ: Leia remembering her _real_ mother, despite being an Padme dying in childbirth.[/li]
Definitely an apparent contradiction, although I’d point out there’s a difference bewteen Leia **claiming** to remember her mother and Leia actually remembering her mother.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]ROTJ: Ewoks with primitive weapons beating an armored legion with mobile armor support. And where did Ewoks have time to prepare those traps?[/li]
A dumb, dumb, dumb scene, although not really a “plot hole”.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]ROTS/TPM: Obi-Wan beats Anakin because he has the “higher ground”. Yet he earlier beats Darth Maul from the lower ground.[/li]
This one doesn’t bother me at all. In both cases, the downfall of the Sith is hubris. Darth Maul assumes he has Obi Wan totally beaten, takes some time to stop and taunt him, and Obi Wan takes advantage. Then in ROTS, Annakin is in a minorly disadvantageous spot, and instead of regrouping, floating upstream a few yards, hopping off, and then fighting on level ground, he is taunted by Obi Wan into making the worst possible decision because he’s so certain he can’t lose. Obi Wan, who is no pushover, takes advantage.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]TPM/Star Wars: Mystical Force that binds the galaxy is midichlorians.[/li]
A stupid and frustrating and insulting revelation which pisses a bunch of people off, cheapens the force, and accomplishes nothing. I don’t see how it’s a “plot hole”, however.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]ROTJ: Mission to Endor requiring stealth, yet brought along a noisy golden C3PO for no discernable military or technical reason.[/li]
This one I see no conceivable justification for other than “we like 3PO as a character”.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]TPM/AOTC: No one bothered to free the slaves in Tatooine in 10 years, despite a senator, Jedi masters, and especially Anakin knowing about this outlawed practice.[/li]
Tatooine is not part of the Republic, so they have no official power to do so. Without knowing more about the relationship between the various powers involved, I can’t call this a plot hole.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]TPM: The pod race; gambled too much to find spare parts. In this dire emergency (planet conquered, etc), couldn’t they have found another way to Coruscant? Like say, going to a cantina and hiring a ride?[/li]
This one has bugged me forever. So regardless of whether Tatooine is part of the Republic, it’s obviously NEAR the Republic. If I go to some random island in the Caribbean with a boat whose motor needs to be replaced, even if I’m not IN the US, and I have $500,000 cash, you can bet your ass I’ll be able to get my motor replaced. The pod race is in the movie based on hilariously flimsy justifications.
> [@](#):
>
> [li]TPM: The prophesy about “bringing balance to the force”. The good jedi far outnumber the bad jedi… there’s only one way to balance this.[/li]
Prophecies being misinterpreted is a fine tradition, dating back to ancient mythology, so I can’t call this a plot hole.
I’ll add:
-In ANH, the Death Star people analyzed the attack, and there was a weakness. Why didn’t they order every single tie fighter to immediately fly to the end of the trench and interpose their ships in front of the small thermal exhaust port directly above the main port?
And not really plot holes, but just things that are left vague:
-What, precisely, is up with Qui Gon and becoming a ghost? If he knew how, how come he didn’t? And if he didn’t know how, how did he figure it out after being dead?
-Who was Sypho Diaz, and why did the Jedi council trust the clone army?
-How on EARTH did they not figure out that Palpatine was a Sith?
-What was up with the dark cave place on Degobah?
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### Author:  [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/6 "2005-06-15T21:48:59Z")
ROTJ: Luke and Leia being sisters, with NO foreshadowing in the earlier movies (quite the opposite actually: the knight gets the princess). Solved a love triangle issue, though.
Not a plot hole. It’s a twist. Never are we told that they ARE NOT related. Sure a twist out of left field but not a plot hole.
ROTJ: Having the Death Star shields down before the Emporer fell. Moments after Vader/Palps beat Luke, they would’ve died in the explosion.
…Huh?
ROTS/ROTJ: Leia remembering her real mother, despite being an Padme dying in childbirth.
PLOT HOLE.
ROTJ: Ewoks with primitive weapons beating an armored legion with mobile armor support. And where did Ewoks have time to prepare those traps?
The Ewoks are clearly shown getting their furry bottoms blown off until Chewie commanders the At-St. Yes the elaborate traps are a stretch. You have to accept that these traps are standard for an ewok village or they spent the entire night preparing them. And sincehte Ewoks knew about the empire for presumably the moment they arrived the Ewoks could have been preparing these traps the whole time. And sicne the Ewoks are clearly retreating during the early parts of the battle perhaps they were actually leading the Imperials into these preset traps.
ROTS/TPM: Obi-Wan beats Anakin because he has the “higher ground”. Yet he earlier beats Darth Maul from the lower ground.
Not a plot hole. I don’t know how you can view that as a plot hole.
TPM/Star Wars: Mystical Force that binds the galaxy is midichlorians.
Midichlorians are dumb… but Midichlorians ARE NOT THE FORCE. As is stated in TPM they are simply the way the Force communicates and connects to the living.
ROTJ: Mission to Endor requiring stealth, yet brought along a noisy golden C3PO for no discernable military or technical reason.
Again not a plot hole. It doesn’t make any sense but is not a plot hole.
TPM/AOTC: No one bothered to free the slaves in Tatooine in 10 years, despite a senator, Jedi masters, and especially Anakin knowing about this outlawed practice.
Not a plot hole. Slavery is accepeted and tolerated outside the Republic. It’s a Hutt world not a Republic planet.
TPM: The pod race; gambled too much to find spare parts. In this dire emergency (planet conquered, etc), couldn’t they have found another way to Coruscant? Like say, going to a cantina and hiring a ride?
Plot Hole in the loosest sense.
TPM: The prophesy about “bringing balance to the force”. The good jedi far outnumber the bad jedi… there’s only one way to balance this.
…where’s the plot hole?
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### Author:  [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/7 "2005-06-15T21:50:26Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#):
>
> I’ll add:
> -In ANH, the Death Star people analyzed the attack, and there was a weakness. Why didn’t they order every single tie fighter to immediately fly to the end of the trench and interpose their ships in front of the small thermal exhaust port directly above the main port?
I’ll raise you: 3 X-Wings make the trench run, how were the other two covering the leader? I guess they were there to take a bullet for the leader, but why not fly above the trench and attack any pursuers?
Better yet: Why bother with the hazardous trench run at all? Why not just fly the ships directly at the exhaust port from above?
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### Author:  [@Longgrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Longgrain)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/8 "2005-06-15T21:50:55Z")
Yeah. Aunt Beru looks like she about 19 at the end of Sith, but in Episode One she’s about fifty-four–TWENTY YEARS LATER.
Those twin suns of Tatooine must do a number on the aging process. :rolleyes:
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### Author:  [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/9 "2005-06-15T21:52:19Z")
Damn… missed it by THAT much.
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### Author:  [@Tarrsk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarrsk)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/10 "2005-06-15T21:53:11Z")
> [@](#):
>
> -In ANH, the Death Star people analyzed the attack, and there was a weakness. Why didn’t they order every single tie fighter to immediately fly to the end of the trench and interpose their ships in front of the small thermal exhaust port directly above the main port?
You actually answered this one yourself, earlier- the Sith (or, in the case, the Imperials) \*always \*lose because of hubris. Notice that Tarkin is dismissive to the point of contempt for the idea that anyone could actually destroy the battle station. He doesn’t send additional TIE fighters against the X-wings because he doesn’t think there’s any danger.
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### Author:  [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/11 "2005-06-15T21:55:04Z")
R2-D2 forgetting that he can fly.
> [@](#):
>
> Those twin suns of Tatooine must do a number on the aging process.
To say nothing of the memory process.
“You! I suppose you’re programmed for etiquette and protocol…you know, you look familiar…aren’t you the same protocol droid that left our farm to fly off to Geonosis for no good reason 20 years ago?”
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### Author:  [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/12 "2005-06-15T21:59:29Z")
Okay, perhaps “plot hole” was not the word I was looking for. “Inconsistencies” or “unanswered questions” perhaps?
> [@Tarrsk](#):
>
> Tatooine is not part of the Republic, so they have no official power to do so. Without knowing more about the relationship between the various powers involved, I can’t call this a plot hole.
But someone could’ve made some action within those 10 years. At least buy back Anakin’s mom or something.
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### Author:  [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/13 "2005-06-15T22:00:54Z")
> [@Dooku](#):
>
> “You! I suppose you’re programmed for etiquette and protocol…you know, you look familiar…aren’t you the same protocol droid that left our farm to fly off to Geonosis for no good reason 20 years ago?”
Droids in this universe are simply appliances. Do you remember a dishwasher or blender you had twenty years ago?
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### Author:  [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/14 "2005-06-15T22:02:07Z")
Except the Jedi aren’t a very family friendly group. No marriage, no kids, no families.
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### Author:  [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/15 "2005-06-15T22:02:19Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#):
>
> Tatooine is not part of the Republic, so they have no official power to do so. Without knowing more about the relationship between the various powers involved, I can’t call this a plot hole.
But someone could’ve made some action within those 10 years. At least buy back Anakin’s mom or something.
Okay, perhaps “plot hole” was not the word I was looking for. “Inconsistencies” or “unanswered questions” perhaps?
We could probably fix some of these issues with another Super Special Fantastic Edition of the original trilogy:
They should redo some scenes from the original series:
Vader vs Obi-Wan: “Your powers are weak, old man. But you’re still younger than Count Dooku when he beat our asses.”
Vader to Obi-Wan: “I’ve been waiting for you, Obi-Wan. We meet again, at last. The circle is now complete. When I met you I was but a jedi apprentice. Now, I am a sith apprentice.”
Yoda: “Wars not make one great… but seen me you should’ve during the Clones Wars. Kicked ass, I did.”
Yoda: “Sicker I become, old and weak… When nine hundred years old YOU reach, look as good YOU will not, hmm? But when I was 870 years old, I was jumping and flipping around!”
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### Author:  [@righto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/righto)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/16 "2005-06-15T22:03:07Z")
> [@Bricker](#):
>
> Droids in this universe are simply appliances. Do you remember a dishwasher or blender you had twenty years ago?
Does your dishwasher or blender talk?
I think of them more as slaves; surely a slave owner would remember which ones he owned.
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### Author:  [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/17 "2005-06-15T22:03:34Z")
> [@Bricker](#):
>
> Droids in this universe are simply appliances. Do you remember a dishwasher or blender you had twenty years ago?
Espcially if it looks different. (Threepio had matte gray coverings when he worked the farm not his gold coverings)
I am pretty sure Owen never hears Threepios designation.
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### Author:  [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/18 "2005-06-15T22:04:31Z")
> [@Longgrain](#):
>
> Yeah. Aunt Beru looks like she about 19 at the end of Sith, but in Episode One she’s about fifty-four–TWENTY YEARS LATER.
>
> Those twin suns of Tatooine must do a number on the aging process. :rolleyes:
For that matter, how does Obi-Wan age from youngish Ewan MacGregor to ancient Alec Guinness between Revenge of the Sith and Star Wars?
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### Author:  [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/19 "2005-06-15T22:08:12Z")
> [@Bricker](#):
>
> Droids in this universe are simply appliances. Do you remember a dishwasher or blender you had twenty years ago?
No, but this is a gold-plated walking British-talking appliance that was in their house, not out in the fields somewhere. An appliance that they self-admittedly had no need for in the first place.
Plus, surely he remembers vividly the time where his sister-in-law’s kid showed up with this particular appliance, murdered a bunch of Sand People, returned with his mother’s body, then later Old Ben returned with his sister-in-law’s grandchild for them to raise in secret. I’d remember that appliance.
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### Author:  [@Dogzilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogzilla)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2005, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-biggest-plotholes/308444/20 "2005-06-15T22:12:30Z")
No, Yoda would flip it around, “Sicker I become, old and weak… When nine hundred years old YOU reach, look as good YOU will not, hmm? But when I was 870 years old, jumped and flipped around I did. Mm-hm!”
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