# Star Wars: How did the Rebels get the death star plans in ANH?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [May 26, 2005, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662 "2005-05-26T20:55:01Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 4
### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [May 29, 2005, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/61 "2005-05-29T17:41:50Z")
> [@flodnak](#):
>
> Putting hundreds if not thousands of copies of the Death Star plans circulating around in Rebel hands, on the other hand, would mess up the whole first half of the film. If there are copies all over the place, why would Vader be so concerned about getting his hands on this **one** copy?
Oh that’s easy, for you see, that copy was in possession of Vader’s daughter, and Vader knew (thanks to the Force) that that copy would end up in the hands of his son, so he had no choice but to track it down, if he was going to find his son, join forces with him and overthrow the Emperor. (I really hope to Og that Lucas doesn’t lurk here, because if we does, and he sees this, we are so screwed.)
**Bryan Ekers** , odds are the blue prints would be broken up into several different files. One for the electrical system, one for the HVAC, etc., etc.
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### Author:  [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)
#### Post date: [May 29, 2005, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/62 "2005-05-29T18:43:05Z")
> [@Priceguy](#):
>
> 120 to 160 meters? Surely the Death Star must be _much_ bigger than that? Han mistakes it for a moon!
Ah, you’ve hit on a key point that most viewers miss. _Star Wars_ is described as transpiring “long ago, in a galaxy far, far away”; obviously at a time when the universe was young and expanding fairly quickly. Both the time and distance scales were compressed and conflated, hence Han Solo’s comment about making “the Kessel run in less than 12 parsecs” and the ability of _Millenium Falcon_ to limp to a neighboring star system without a functioning hyperdrive. In reality, the scale of the _Star Wars_ universe (as compared to our modern-day measurements) was about 1:10000 or (likely) greater. This also explains the wooshing sounds of TIE fighters and the apparent aerodynamics in free space–the density of free gaseous matter was comperable to Earth’s atmosphereic pressure. Lucas had to be very careful during filming lest an errant breath flatten his exactly-to-scale models. The “forest moon” of Endor was actually a hardboiled egg, dyed green and left over from Passover. And the Endor scenes, which are often mistakenly thought to have been filmed in the Northern California Redwoods NF were actually filmed in the overgrown backyard of local cranky old lady and collectible stuffed creature fetishist Edna Beatrice Steptoe of Akron, Ohio, giving the true origins of the now-maligned Ewoks. (Lucas was originally going to use dwarf capuchin monkeys made up to look like Wookies but owning to budget constraints due to increased demands from Alec Guinness and Harrison Ford to continue to speak the wooden, cliche-ridden dialog couldn’t afford to rent the animals and pay for SPCA oversight so he ended up using wind-up stuff toys instead.)
Similarly, _Battlestar Galactica_ took place only shortly after the condensation of matter from the quagma, which explains why the Cylon fighters were always “microns” away from the Galactica-led fleet. While in todays measurements this would suggest that they were right up against the hull, in the timeframe of the series they were actually quite distant. The entire series, in fact, took place in a volume no larger than a shoebox and using only the amount of energy needed to power a transistor radio.
Now, for my next trick, watch me pull an elephant out of my hat. _“Again?!?”_
Stranger
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [May 29, 2005, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/63 "2005-05-29T19:10:09Z")
> [@Priceguy](#):
>
> 120 to 160 meters? Surely the Death Star must be _much_ bigger than that? Han mistakes it for a moon!
So, I’m a k short, gimme a break.
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### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [May 29, 2005, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/64 "2005-05-29T19:49:42Z")
> [@msmith537](#):
>
> As for droids piloting ships, I believe R2 is an “astromech” droid. Since an untrained 8 year old can fly a starfighter well enough to take off, take it into orbit, destroy a battleship and safely land, I have to think that the astromech droid does in fact do a great deal of the piloting.
They can’t be _that_ essential, however, since Luke says, “I’ve lost R2!” and yet is still able to fly the X-Wing well enough to make the money shot and then fly back to base afterwards.
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### Author:  [@Made\_in\_Macau](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Made_in_Macau)
#### Post date: [May 29, 2005, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/65 "2005-05-29T23:06:05Z")
> [@Priceguy](#):
>
> Coming from the guy who brought up this nonissue to start with, this is pretty amusing.
>
> ‘Guy’?
>
> Why do you care?
I think this is a good question.
MiM
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/66 "2005-05-30T03:32:57Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#):
>
> They are not contradictory.
>
> In RL, Intelligence is often assembled from many different sources.
>
> Both sources, each possibly outdated/incomplete in some fashion, would be subjected to Intel Analysis in the hands of a senior Rebel Leader–i.e. Princess Leia. The 2 sources would be combined into a complete & informative picture.
That was always my take, too, on all the myriad Star Wars games where different characters are stealing Death Star plans. Probably, at least some of these plans were just sort of “useless” in the end—they described the DS’s command and control systems, or the armor plating, or the arrangement of turbolasers defences around the main gun. At best, they might been just good for determining how they _couldn’t_ attack the DS. At worst…“Ten Mon Cal agents lost their lives getting this data from an Imperial contractor, and one of our best commando/starfighter pilot/mercenaries risked his life delivering it to us. And now, after we decrypt it…what the _hell?_ ‘Manual Override Controls for Internal Waste Disposal Chambers’? Aw, _DAMNIT!_ What the hell good is _that_ going to do for anyone!?”
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/67 "2005-05-30T03:46:08Z")
Say, a quick thought on Droid starfighter pilots…it might have to do with intelligence.
Assuming it wouldn’t be impossible to build a droid with the smarts and skill to be a really good starfighter pilot—that’s not so far-fetched, I wouldn’t think—it might have been too expensive or difficult for the Rebels to get their hands on such droids. But, if it wasn’t, there might be another problem…most droids are basically slaves in the SW galaxy, right? Well, a droid smart enough to be a human-level pilot might resent being sent on probable suicide missions, which could badly affect his performance. And a droid stupid or conditioned enough to gladly fly to his death might not make a good enough pilot to risk an expensive and hard to replace starfighter on.
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### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/68 "2005-05-30T03:54:06Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#):
>
> Say, a quick thought on Droid starfighter pilots…it might have to do with intelligence.
>
> Assuming it wouldn’t be impossible to build a droid with the smarts and skill to be a really good starfighter pilot—that’s not so far-fetched, I wouldn’t think—it might have been too expensive or difficult for the Rebels to get their hands on such droids. But, if it wasn’t, there might be another problem…most droids are basically slaves in the SW galaxy, right? Well, a droid smart enough to be a human-level pilot might resent being sent on probable suicide missions, which could badly affect his performance. And a droid stupid or conditioned enough to gladly fly to his death might not make a good enough pilot to risk an expensive and hard to replace starfighter on.
It might also have something to do with bad feelings generated over the Droid armies used by the Trade Federation.
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### Author:  [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/69 "2005-05-30T05:41:23Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#):
>
> They can’t be _that_ essential, however, since Luke says, “I’ve lost R2!” and yet is still able to fly the X-Wing well enough to make the money shot and then fly back to base afterwards.
Possible that R2 was automatically regulating all the various systems on the ship, similar to how someone can be totally unconcious but still manage to keep a pulse and a breath going. It’s also debatable how much an astromech droid DOES in normal space flight, possible he just served whatever role a co-pilot would in a two-seater, managing things the pilot COULD take care of himself, but would rather not mess with, in addition to reaching out and fixing stuff outside of the cockpit.
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### Author:  [@toadspittle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toadspittle)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/70 "2005-05-30T13:31:43Z")
I thought that astromechs were there to (1) repair in-flight damage and (2) act as the hyperdrive navacomputer for small ships like the X-Wing. So, good thing that Luke only needed to fly to Yavin 4, and not go into hyperspace at the end of the movie.
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### Author:  [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/71 "2005-05-30T19:52:41Z")
To return to the subject of the OP, a recent [historical document](http://www.twentyoneproductions.com/starwarsparody/) discovery explains how the Rebels got the plans for the DS I. Interesting to note, that apparently Tarantino was either aware of this document while he was making _Pulp Fiction_ or else the Force is strong in him.
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### Author:  [@Ficer67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ficer67)
#### Post date: [May 30, 2005, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/72 "2005-05-30T20:04:31Z")
Vader says additionally, that transmissions were beamed to her ship, suggesting that Leah was the upper contact of a vast network of spies. A fact that could be used against her in the council of planets. Spying is something that every country does and all countries frown upon.
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### Author:  [@Ezekiel25\_17](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ezekiel25_17)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/73 "2005-05-31T03:44:37Z")
In the column “For” droid pilots, Threepio was piloting Lukes speeder. So I’m guessing basic piloting software would be pretty much standard issue if it was on a protocol droid.
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### Author:  [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/74 "2005-05-31T04:04:17Z")
> [@Ezekiel25:17](#):
>
> In the column “For” droid pilots, Threepio was piloting Lukes speeder. So I’m guessing basic piloting software would be pretty much standard issue if it was on a protocol droid.
Also, in Episode III…
It would seem that Threepio was piloting Padme’s ship towards the end of the movie.
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### Author:  [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/75 "2005-05-31T04:20:03Z")
> [@Ezekiel25:17](#):
>
> In the column “For” droid pilots, Threepio was piloting Lukes speeder. So I’m guessing basic piloting software would be pretty much standard issue if it was on a protocol droid.
Plus, in episode three…
[spoiler]…We see 3PO acting as Padme’s pilot, and commenting that he’s “starting to get the hang of flying.” Granted, it’s a glorified RV, not a starfighter, but it’s still a starship proper.
I just wonder if piloting software is built into him, was loaded on “after market,” if Anakin was running low on protocol droid subprocessors and just Frankensteined in some pilot-droid brains during 3PO’s construction, or if his 3PO’s brain is just advanced enough that he can simply be _taught_ to fly a spacecraft, like any other person.[/spoiler]
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### Author:  [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/76 "2005-05-31T04:38:36Z")
All right, I give up. What does EU stand for? I’m picturing officious guys in Brussels making decisions on Star Wars canon.
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### Author:  [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/77 "2005-05-31T04:45:32Z")
> [@Kyla](#):
>
> All right, I give up. What does EU stand for? I’m picturing officious guys in Brussels making decisions on Star Wars canon.
“Extended Universe” IIRC it’s everything but the movies. Might only refer to the novels though. Basically, it’s canon until it’s not.
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### Author:  [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/78 "2005-05-31T05:06:20Z")
> [@Raguleader](#):
>
> “Extended Universe” IIRC it’s everything but the movies. Might only refer to the novels though. Basically, it’s canon until it’s not.
I never thought I’d run across a nerd acronym I didn’t recognize. Yes! There are people in the universe geekier than me! I’m cool now!
(Thanks, btw. Nerd!)
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### Author:  [@HPL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HPL)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/79 "2005-05-31T05:55:14Z")
> [@Kyla](#):
>
> I never thought I’d run across a nerd acronym I didn’t recognize. Yes! There are people in the universe geekier than me! I’m cool now!
>
> (Thanks, btw. Nerd!)
Now Zoidberg is the Popular One!
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### Author:  [@Ezekiel25\_17](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ezekiel25_17)
#### Post date: [May 31, 2005, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-did-the-rebels-get-the-death-star-plans-in-anh/305662/80 "2005-05-31T06:30:31Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#):
>
> Plus, in episode three…
>
> [spoiler]…We see 3PO acting as Padme’s pilot, and commenting that he’s “starting to get the hang of flying.” Granted, it’s a glorified RV, not a starfighter, but it’s still a starship proper.
>
> I just wonder if piloting software is built into him, was loaded on “after market,” if Anakin was running low on protocol droid subprocessors and just Frankensteined in some pilot-droid brains during 3PO’s construction, or if his 3PO’s brain is just advanced enough that he can simply be _taught_ to fly a spacecraft, like any other person.[/spoiler]
I wondered about that. Also: (Episode 3 spoiler) If he was memory wiped at the end of the movie, what portions of his memory would that affect? This might be more relevant in 3PO’s case since he’s certainly nonstandard. If his brain is indeed learning things, then he would have to lose all of that too.
Here endeth the Hijack (for now)
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