# Star Wars—How long have Imperial Star Destroyers operating in planetary atmospheres been a thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 25, 2016, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807 "2016-09-25T10:47:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 10:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/1 "2016-09-25T10:47:11Z")
I’m a really a casual Star Wars fan, at best, but there’s something I’ve really noticed the last couple of years, in both official “canon” and semi-canon materials: Imperial Star Destroyers operating within planetary atmospheres. Particularly odd as these are rather massive vessels, the kind of which one would normally fully expect to operate solely in space. But, like I’ve said, in the last couple of years, this seems to have been expanded. A crashed one features prominently in _The Force Awakens_, which had seemed odd to me at the time, if it were a fallen starship, which I would’ve expected to be in far poorer shape considering the masses and velocities involved—but in the _Star Wars Battlefronts_ game and now in the trailer for _Rogue One_, we seem to have Star Destroyers hovering without difficulty in the atmosphere, operating like big Helicarriers. Now, I know some “Star Destroyers” (earlier, smaller ones) were shown landed on a planet in _Attack of the Clones_, and there are a _lot_ of classes of Star Destroyers in over thirty-odd years of story material, both canon and EU, only a fraction of which I’m at all familiar with. But, still, I’m curious to know if there’s existing precedent to this kind of thing in SW lore, or if this is a J.J. Abrams-era stylistic introduction. (The man had the rebooted _Enterprise_ built on the ground, and flying around in the clouds, after all. And underwater.) So, I’m asking…is this something new, or am I just hopelessly out of touch? ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/2 "2016-09-25T12:31:48Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > Now, I know some “Star Destroyers” (earlier, smaller ones) were shown landed on a planet in _Attack of the Clones_, and there are a _lot_ of classes of Star Destroyers in over thirty-odd years of story material, both canon and EU, only a fraction of which I’m at all familiar with. According to [Wookieepedia](http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial_I-class_Star_Destroyer#Propulsion_systems), Star Destroyers need to keep moving to stay aloft in the atmosphere, but you’re right that seems to be contradicted in the [trailer](http://cdn.fansided.com/wp-content/blogs.dir/319/files/2016/08/Rogue-One-A-Star-Wars-Story-Trailer-Official-0338-2.jpg) for _Rogue One_. But as you say, [this scene](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/8buh5A70loA/maxresdefault.jpg) in _Attack of the Clones_ says canonically that it’s possible, even if they are scaled a bit smaller. However, unlike shows like _Star Trek_ with hundreds of episodes, there haven’t been enough _Star Wars_ movies to make anything truly definitive. We’ve really only seen most aspects of its lore from limited points of view, and just because we haven’t seen it doesn’t mean it can’t happen. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/3 "2016-09-25T16:09:03Z")
Some of these things are seriously large - miles long - and our atmosphere isn’t very thick. And our eyes are good at focusing in on detail. How big would something say 5 miles long seem if at an altitude of 50 miles? ---
**Author:** ![blue\_infinity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blue_infinity/32/2817_2.png) [@blue\_infinity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blue_infinity)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/4 "2016-09-25T16:21:01Z")
Close to six degrees. The moon by comparison is half a degree. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/5 "2016-09-25T16:44:22Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > However, unlike shows like _Star Trek_ with hundreds of episodes, there haven’t been enough _Star Wars_ movies to make anything truly definitive. We’ve really only seen most aspects of its lore from limited points of view, and just because we haven’t seen it doesn’t mean it can’t happen. Ten movies - plus thousands of comics, novels, TV shows, and video games. Setting aside the question of what is and is not canon, there’s no end of material to answer the question, “How long have they been showing Star Destroyers in atmosphere?” Earliest I can remember off the top of my head was [this](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/kgDU66pIuB0/hqdefault.jpg) scene from the _Force Unleashed_ video game, from 2008, but I’m sure there’s something earlier out there. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/6 "2016-09-25T17:31:41Z")
Does showing one crashing - or taking off - count? ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/7 "2016-09-25T17:50:07Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Some of these things are seriously large - miles long - and our atmosphere isn’t very thick. And our eyes are good at focusing in on detail. How big would something say 5 miles long seem if at an altitude of 50 miles? A Super Star Destroyer is 19 KM long (per wiki). Thats almost exactly a third of the way to space; if its hovering just outside the discernible atmosphere on an Earth like planet; what would it appear like on the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Atomic\_Alex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atomic_alex/32/175_2.png) [@Atomic\_Alex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atomic_Alex)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/8 "2016-09-25T18:11:49Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > But, still, I’m curious to know if there’s existing precedent to this kind of thing in SW lore, or if this is a J.J. Abrams-era stylistic introduction. (The man had the rebooted _Enterprise_ built on the ground… That completely took me out of the movie for some reason, I always assumed the ships had been built in space and couldn’t operate in the atmosphere. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/9 "2016-09-25T18:33:29Z")
Yeah, it makes no sense to build these things on the ground. But it gave Kirk something to look at while he thought about joining Starfleet. In any case, the Enterprise was shown in atmosphere in one of the old time travel episodes; ‘Tomorrow is Yesterday’, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2016, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/10 "2016-09-25T23:06:00Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Yeah, it makes no sense to build these things on the ground. But it gave Kirk something to look at while he thought about joining Starfleet. In any case, the Enterprise was shown in atmosphere in one of the old time travel episodes; ‘Tomorrow is Yesterday’, I think. And they got out of the atmosphere as quickly as possible. Why they were moving so slowly after getting sent back in time is another problem. I suspect they were pretty high up - John Christopher thought it was close to him because he probably underestimated its size. I know they tried to keep him away with a tractor beam, but they also had no idea of the ceiling of a 20th century fighter, and so thought the plane could approach them closer than it did. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/11 "2016-09-26T00:58:38Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Ten movies - plus thousands of comics, novels, TV shows, and video games. Setting aside the question of what is and is not canon, there’s no end of material to answer the question, “How long have they been showing Star Destroyers in atmosphere?” Three of those ten movies imply they can, four if you count the big crash of a comparably-sized ship at the start of ROTS, and scenes [like this](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/lYZyHAK0qW8/maxresdefault.jpg) have appeared a couple of times in _Star Wars Rebels_. The comic and novels, though not canon anymore, are so frequently contradictory they probably shouldn’t factor into the answer. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/12 "2016-09-26T13:27:18Z")
Aside: **Miller** and **GuanoLad** , let me just say how glad I am that I’m not the only one who remembers _all_ of the Star Wars movies. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/13 "2016-09-26T14:51:03Z")
They have antigrav (sorry, “repulsorlift”) tech and superstrong materials, all bets are off on what can and can’t operate in atmo. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/14 "2016-09-26T15:27:12Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > And they got out of the atmosphere as quickly as possible. Why they were moving so slowly after getting sent back in time is another problem. I suspect they were pretty high up - John Christopher thought it was close to him because he probably underestimated its size. I know they tried to keep him away with a tractor beam, but they also had no idea of the ceiling of a 20th century fighter, and so thought the plane could approach them closer than it did. F-104s tended to crash a lot. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2016, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/15 "2016-09-26T16:29:36Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Aside: **Miller** and **GuanoLad** , let me just say how glad I am that I’m not the only one who remembers _all_ of the Star Wars movies. Perks of owning a time machine. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/16 "2016-09-27T00:21:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Aside: **Miller** and **GuanoLad** , let me just say how glad I am that I’m not the only one who remembers _all_ of the Star Wars movies. I was going to correct him, but I’m assuming he’s counting the Ewok movies to bring it up to ten. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/17 "2016-09-27T01:35:48Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > And they got out of the atmosphere as quickly as possible. Why they were moving so slowly after getting sent back in time is another problem. I suspect they were pretty high up - John Christopher thought it was close to him because he probably underestimated its size. I know they tried to keep him away with a tractor beam, but they also had no idea of the ceiling of a 20th century fighter, and so thought the plane could approach them closer than it did. The new Enterprise is clearly not just more spiffy than the original, but more robust. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/18 "2016-09-27T01:49:31Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > I was going to correct him, but I’m assuming he’s counting the Ewok movies to bring it up to ten. No, I am, in fact, dumb. But thanks for assuming the best. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/19 "2016-09-27T01:56:27Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > But thanks for assuming the best. There’s an infinite number of them coming up. “Every year” is their plan. By 2020 the amount of them will be so high we can stop counting. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2016, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807/20 "2016-09-27T06:51:48Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > The comic and novels, though not canon anymore, are so frequently contradictory they probably shouldn’t factor into the answer. Heck, suspect or contradictory is fine, if it can indicate general trends. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-how-long-have-imperial-star-destroyers-operating-in-planetary-atmospheres-been-a-thing/766807.md?page=2)