# Star Wars question **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 23, 2013, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110 "2013-01-23T15:14:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/21 "2013-01-23T22:01:27Z")
Given the thickness of Jabba’s neck and the muscles it would take to just hold his head up, Leia would have had to use much greater than female-normal upper body strength to strangle him. Zero leverage too, just brute strength. The Thrawn Trilogy pretty much says that Leia hasn’t trained as much as she should have. She is still very much a beginner in the ways of the Force. Not in Mara’s class by any means, but not weak either. ---
**Author:** ![edwards\_beard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7bcc69/32.png) [@edwards\_beard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/edwards_beard)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/22 "2013-01-23T22:05:47Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Well, she choked Jabba out with an eight foot length of chain. I don’t think that necessarily requires Force powers. > > I’d forgotten Luke’s line, but I don’t know if that really establishes anything about Leia’s abilities. Luke may be just assuming that his sister has the same capabilities as he does. And Yoda’s never met Leia, has he? Maybe as a baby, in the prequels? He could be making the same assumption Luke did. > > I do remember one of the novels (the Thrawn trilogy, I’m pretty sure) establishing that, despite training with Luke, Leia’s ability to manipulate the Force was pretty negligible. I think it can go either way…but I’m leaning towards Leia isn’t very strong with the force. On one hand, at the end of Empire, she senses Luke reaching out to her using the force. On the other hand, Luke never sensed that Leia was strong with the force either, he did eventually figure it out, but he never seeemed to sense it higher than a subconsious level. Back to the original post, was it mentioned how many minutes of screentime Vader had in Empire or Jedi? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/23 "2013-01-23T22:11:47Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > You left out a few scenes with Leia; accusing her of being a spy, interrogation in her cell, putting the big hurt on Alderaan. You know, all those times he was right next to her and didn’t sense that his daughter was strong with the Force. Well, dads can be pretty oblivious. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/24 "2013-01-23T22:24:34Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > Not every character, even the main ones, need to be onscreen 100% of the time. > [@](#): > > … whenever Poochie’s not onscreen, all the other characters should be asking “Where’s Poochie”? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![magnusblitz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b4bc9f/32.png) [@magnusblitz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magnusblitz)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/25 "2013-01-23T22:46:10Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Vader wasn’t even the villain in the first movie. The Empire was the villain, and its face was Tarkin. Vader was just an interesting henchman; notice how he follows Tarkin’s orders. What’s remarkable isn’t that he only has 12 minutes of screentime, it’s that they bothered to give him any characterization at all. They created a backstory with Obi-Wan, and then they had a showdown that felt like it had some real depth. Contrast that with Darth Maul from the first prequel, who did nothing and then died. > > Darth Vader was a happy accident that they were wise to capitalize on, but the whole father/son thing was clearly an afterthought, especially given the dialog in the first movie about Luke’s dad. Hmm. Interesting theory. I’m convinced that the Luke/Leia sibling angle was made up completely after the first movie, but I’m not so sure on the Luke/Vader one being made up. Yes, there’s nothing in Episode IV pointing directly to it, but there’s also nothing that directly counters it - the conversation about Luke’s dad is pretty vague. I think they set the ground for the connection but purposely didn’t allude to it because at the time, no one thought the movie would be a hit and that Lucas would only get one film - so no need to create plotlines that wouldn’t get resolved. (Of course, today they would purposely put in open plotlines to help them get a sequel). Then again, Luke and Leia kiss in ESB too, which you think he would cut down on if he suddenly decided to make them siblings, so maybe Lucas is just weird. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/26 "2013-01-23T22:59:59Z")
> [@magnusblitz](#): > > Hmm. Interesting theory. I’m convinced that the Luke/Leia sibling angle was made up completely after the first movie, but I’m not so sure on the Luke/Vader one being made up. Yes, there’s nothing in Episode IV pointing directly to it, but there’s also nothing that directly counters it - the conversation about Luke’s dad is pretty vague. Obi Wan: “A young Jedi named Darth Vader, who was a pupil of mine until he turned to evil, helped the Empire hunt down and destroy the Jedi Knights. He betrayed and murdered your father.” That’s… pretty direct. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/27 "2013-01-23T23:31:28Z")
Obi-Wan also calls Vader “Darth” like it was a first name rather than a title. Lucas was totally making it up on the fly. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/28 "2013-01-23T23:37:23Z")
I love the idea that Vader’s whole ‘breathing mask’ system and its whole Obi-Wan lava-fight backstory all grew out of an early draft of his entrance scene onto Leia’s ship where he spacewalks for some reason, so he needed a pressure suit… ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/29 "2013-01-23T23:42:32Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Obi-Wan also calls Vader “Darth” like it was a first name rather than a title. Lucas was totally making it up on the fly. The really grating thing about this “goof” is that it would have been so easy to fix in the prequels if Lucas had given a sh!t about making things make sense. All it would have taken was one line by Obi-Wan, which Ewan would have killed with his penchant for being smarmy, something like, “Oh, you’ve become a Sith, have you? Change your first name to Darth and everything, I guess?” Then sprinkle in a couple of taunts with “Darth” like it was a name and bingo, loose end tied up nicely. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/30 "2013-01-24T00:12:42Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Ben : That boy was our last hope. > Yoda : No - there is another. Ben: I hope its not another whiner. Yoda: Hot this chick is. Strong she is with the space bitch. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/31 "2013-01-24T00:18:00Z")
Freaky, super, she is. Taking home to mother, that is not her kind. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/32 "2013-01-24T00:19:40Z")
Luke to Solo: “You like my sister? She’s HOT, huh?” Solo: “I’d like to do _her_ run in twelve parsecs.” ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/33 "2013-01-24T00:27:02Z")
I’ve got your 12 parsecs right here… SWINGIN’ ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/34 "2013-01-24T01:22:00Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > YYou know, all those times he was right next to her and didn’t sense that his daughter was strong with the Force. She wasn’t using the Force. Luke had been using it since he was a kid, though he didn’t know it that was how he was a good pilot, and he was using it like crazy when Vader was chasing him down the trench. Leia would hardly have used it at all, only when she was subtly influencing people during diplomatic negotiations (and even then that would’ve been rare, politicians have strong wills). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/35 "2013-01-24T02:18:44Z")
Being as this thread has already taken a turn in that direction, I’ll add that one of the other factoids mentioned in the article is that Carrie Fisher did the entire movie without a bra. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/36 "2013-01-24T02:26:11Z")
> [@](#): > > Leia would hardly have used it at all, only when she was subtly influencing people during diplomatic negotiations (and even then that would’ve been rare, politicians have strong wills). All the more reason for her to need it, then. The simple little hand-wave monotone only works on the weak-willed, but a master negotiator who happened to be strong in the Force would be using it a lot more subtly than that. And if nothing else, sensing the emotions of other politicians would be incredibly useful. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/37 "2013-01-24T02:30:20Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Being as this thread has already taken a turn in that direction, I’ll add that one of the other factoids mentioned in the article is that Carrie Fisher did the entire movie without a bra. Where is this article. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/38 "2013-01-24T02:34:10Z")
> [@magnusblitz](#): > > Hmm. Interesting theory. I’m convinced that the Luke/Leia sibling angle was made up completely after the first movie, but I’m not so sure on the Luke/Vader one being made up. Yes, there’s nothing in Episode IV pointing directly to it, but there’s also nothing that directly counters it - the conversation about Luke’s dad is pretty vague. I think they set the ground for the connection but purposely didn’t allude to it because at the time, no one thought the movie would be a hit and that Lucas would only get one film - so no need to create plotlines that wouldn’t get resolved. (Of course, today they would purposely put in open plotlines to help them get a sequel). > > Then again, Luke and Leia kiss in ESB too, which you think he would cut down on if he suddenly decided to make them siblings, so maybe Lucas is just weird. Leia kisses Luke to annoy Han, not for directly romantic reasons, or at least directly related to Luke. Her force sensitivity is hinted at throughout the movie and just about confirmed at the end. So while I agree that Leia was not originally Lukes twin, I think by the time of the shooting of ESB, she was…or at least a backup. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/39 "2013-01-24T03:33:30Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Being as this thread has already taken a turn in that direction, I’ll add that one of the other factoids mentioned in the article is that Carrie Fisher did the entire movie without a bra. Duct tape is like the Force. It has a light side, a dark side and it keeps the Universe together. And Carrie’s boobs from bouncing. If you look carefully at a couple of scenes in ESB you can see proof she is braless. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2013, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110/40 "2013-01-24T04:13:08Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Where is this article. It’s not an article yet. It was a [forum thread](http://www.cracked.com/forums/topic/127441/image-macro-contest-1.22.13-fascinating-real-facts-about-famous-film-scenes) at Cracked for an upcoming photoplasty contest. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/star-wars-question/648110.md?page=3)